House renovations - Replace flat roof with pitched and garage conversion

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BlueFriction

7 posts

Wannabe Geek

#252929 17-Jul-2019 14:53

Hello all, I've been soaking up all the tips and advice on GZ DIY for a while :)

We have recently moved into what I think will be our forever house (Auckland North Shore) and after a few years of renting it's been awesome rolling up the sleeves and doing various small improvements like improving the underhouse insulation but time to tackle something major!

Over the main living area and garage we have a flat membrane roof with parapets and internal gutters. It's seen through plenty of torrential downpours no worries, however, with an eye on the future, we really want to put in something with eaves to give better all-round protection and improve ceiling insulation while we are at it.

My initial idea is in the image, it would be to put on a pitched longrun over the existing roof incorporating eaves and potentially a porch style extension over some of the deck to give wet weather use. We are also looking at converting the garage and doing some external stairs round the side to give garden access. I've had a conversation with the council and am familiar with the building consents that will be required.

Currently casting around for roofers / designers / builders so I'm keen to hear any opinions or recommendations for the North Shore. eg Is it worth trying to find a renovation's company that would PM the whole thing including design? Or should we look to get the design all specced out in advance by a designer/architect?

We also have a huge mancave area under the deck which would be ripe for an extension but that would be opening up a resource consent can o worms so think we will leave that to phase 2 long term plans!
Thanks in advance and will try to fill in with more details as I can.

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#2278426 17-Jul-2019 15:49

Just being nosey, why would work on your man cave need resource consent? I have heard that a very high % of Ak projects do but for something already in the envelope??

neb

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#2278435 17-Jul-2019 16:12

Bung: Just being nosey, why would work on your man cave need resource consent? I have heard that a very high % of Ak projects do but for something already in the envelope??

Just a guess but it looks like a steep section, if the house is on piles and the man-cave was created by putting walls around them then there'd be considerable structural considerations involved in changing things around.

BlueFriction

7 posts

Wannabe Geek

#2278511 17-Jul-2019 17:21

Just a guess but it looks like a steep section, if the house is on piles and the man-cave was created by putting walls around them then there'd be considerable structural considerations involved in changing things around.

That's right, the rear is on poles (which gives all the space for the mancave). The house backs on to parkland which has special character restrictions so any earthworks over 2m3 trigger the Resource Consent. The good thing is the poles are arranged such that they would not need to be altered.

neb

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#2278513 17-Jul-2019 17:27

BlueFriction: The house backs on to parkland which has special character restrictions so any earthworks over 2m3 trigger the Resource Consent.

That's what I was wondering when I saw the photo/rendering, I know you've said you've gone over it with the council but have they given you a clear shopping list of all the stuff you'll need to do to raise the roofline? That's what killed us when we tried, next to a reserve with potential blocking of neighbours' views, the maximum height we were allowed under current regulations was less than the roof height under the 1970s regulations when the house was built. In other words the permitted change in roof height was a negative value.

mattwnz

20180 posts

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#2278514 17-Jul-2019 17:27

Bung: Just being nosey, why would work on your man cave need resource consent? I have heard that a very high % of Ak projects do but for something already in the envelope??

Wouldn't adding eaves put it outside the envelope as the roof will be outside the existing envelope, and it will also be higher?

decibel

317 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2278531 17-Jul-2019 17:57

While you have the roof off, install a ducted heatpump in the roof space.

BlueFriction

7 posts

Wannabe Geek

#2278535 17-Jul-2019 18:02

neb:
BlueFriction: The house backs on to parkland which has special character restrictions so any earthworks over 2m3 trigger the Resource Consent.
That's what I was wondering when I saw the photo/rendering, I know you've said you've gone over it with the council but have they given you a clear shopping list of all the stuff you'll need to do to raise the roofline? That's what killed us when we tried, next to a reserve with potential blocking of neighbours' views, the maximum height we were allowed under current regulations was less than the roof height under the 1970s regulations when the house was built. In other words the permitted change in roof height was a negative value.

Luckily the slope works in our favour the house is fairly low lying to the rolling ground level and so we have the height to spare to go up to the 8m allowed within our zoning. Our front neighbours are on a cross lease with us and we have a sightline covenant with them that we can design to with the pitch. I went through all the different controls with the council planner.

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Kickinbac

433 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2278766 18-Jul-2019 10:46

If you are serious about doing the mancave thing, try to include it in the design work, building consent and resource consent if that is triggered. It won't cost much more but if you did it later you would have to get a new building consent and pay the fees again. Generally, there's no cheaper time to do the work than now as costs always go up.

It would be worth a conversation with the Council about what would happen if it were included in the consent and it didn't go ahead.

BlueFriction

7 posts

Wannabe Geek

#2278809 18-Jul-2019 11:29

Kickinbac:

If you are serious about doing the mancave thing, try to include it in the design work, building consent and resource consent if that is triggered. It won't cost much more but if you did it later you would have to get a new building consent and pay the fees again. Generally, there's no cheaper time to do the work than now as costs always go up.

It would be worth a conversation with the Council about what would happen if it were included in the consent and it didn't go ahead.

Thanks certainly good advice, I was thinking that as a possible option. However, I understand that building consent is only for one year so it's likely we would have to double up anyway if not undertaken at the same time. Can certainly look to get all the design work done together.

neb

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#2279185 18-Jul-2019 18:02

Kickinbac:
It would be worth a conversation with the Council about what would happen if it were included in the consent and it didn't go ahead.

Wouldn't it just lapse after 18 months? Or are you asking something different here?

Disrespective

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#2279486 19-Jul-2019 10:23

The scope of your project isn’t huge so any decent designer should be able to do what you need. Do you have a budget in mind? That will quickly determine the tier of designer/builder that would be available for the project.

Without critiquing the plan in any way I’ll give some food for thought on your question of engaging a designer/architect/builder.

I’m a little biased towards engaging an architect (I am one) or reputable architectural designer (there’s some really good ones around) over a generic/bulk builder. Particularly on a project that is something you plan on living in long term. I believe that you can’t underestimate the benefit of someone spending the time to understand your needs and propose a design solution that meets or exceeds these, or gives you alternatives that you may not have considered.

I’m not going to give you any names of firms/people in Auckland on the forum but treat any meeting with them like you’re interviewing them as much as they are you. It has to be a good fit, or what they’ll be proposing simply won’t be what you’re looking for.

These links are places you can start to look for someone:

https://www.nzia.co.nz/connect/find-an-architect

https://www.adnz.org.nz/find/search

BlueFriction

7 posts

Wannabe Geek

#2279498 19-Jul-2019 10:49

Disrespective:

Without critiquing the plan in any way I’ll give some food for thought on your question of engaging a designer/architect/builder.

Appreciate the advice. In fact I would be happy to take any critique or constrictive criticism!

Our current budgeting is around $125k so I'm looking to see how far that will go towards our ideas, and we are noway set on a particular design and that there will likely be things that have to be dropped or modified.

I have also been told that it would be better to engage a builder-designer firm so everything can be done within the same ecosystem, but I think a good designer or architect would have trusted companies they could recommend as well so why would it be an issue..?

FYI talking with a renovation friend back in the UK they thought that a pitched Posi-Strut frame over the existing one would be a good idea due to lightweight and strong.

Happy to take discussion offline if you would be able to offer some recommended names - even your own services :)

Kickinbac

433 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2279504 19-Jul-2019 11:10

neb:
Kickinbac:
It would be worth a conversation with the Council about what would happen if it were included in the consent and it didn't go ahead.

Wouldn't it just lapse after 18 months? Or are you asking something different here?

I just don’t know the timeframe to complete a building project once it’s consented. Possibly solved with a consent amendment if the work didn’t go ahead. This would probably be cheaper than a whole new building consent application.
My thoughts were to plan for it to be done so it can be budgeted.

Disrespective

1926 posts

Uber Geek

#2279518 19-Jul-2019 11:35

Generally you can extend a consent to allow enough time to complete all the work, however you will want to be conscious that if you don't do part of the consented works then you won't be able to get a Code Compliance Certificate (CCC) without first either completing this work, or amending the consent to exclude this work. I would generally advise consenting only the parts that will be completed within a 12 month build window. Anything else can be done at a later date.

As for whether a design-build firm will be better or not is subjective. They might give you a cheaper overall price, but (biased opinion aside) probably won't do as good work when compared with a separate designer and builder contract. Every architect/designer has preferred builders. They know each others processes and their expectations of each others work. That said, there are always exceptions to this, and issues do arise.

I don't have any capacity to do projects on the side at the moment and the scale of job is too small for my office i'm afraid. I'd look for someone local with an office of 1-5 staff who has done renovations recently and, if you want some architecturally styled stuff, then you'll need to like what they've done. Ring a handful up, explain the scope and budget (does $125k include all council/designer/engineer fees?) and if they aren't interested ask them if they know anyone who might be.

Good luck!

neb

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#2279534 19-Jul-2019 12:36

Not meant as an attack on @Disrespective, but I've got somewhat the opposite perspective on architects, based on my dad being a builder who was often asked to build architect-designed or -amended homes. Virtually all of them needed considerable design re-work to make them buildable and/or liveable, not counting at least two jobs he turned down outright as unbuildable or unliveable. I've been in one of them after it was built by someone else, the same family is still in there fifty years later because the place is unsellable. Another one, that my dad did build after extensive re-working of the architect's plans, looked like it had been designed via a game of tetris, there was an L-shaped bedroom and a T-shaped bedroom and rooms that were odd little blocks, and an ingenious Mystery Room where you had to exit the house, walk up a path around the side, and then enter the room via a side door in the house.

My approach would be to get an architect to do a general plan as a baseline for the work, then get a builder to indicate what and how to build, and then go back to the architect and get them to finish the specs based on what the builder recommends.

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