Global mode over ? Lets see.....

Forums › Online streaming services › Global mode over ? Lets see.....

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | ... | 54

BDFL - Memuneh
79316 posts

Uber Geek

Administrator

ID Verified

Trusted

Geekzone

Lifetime subscriber

#1276708 3-Apr-2015 13:09

Sidestep: I'm sure this imbalance - your $400 import duty/GST exemption - will disappear sometime in the future, becoming more like say, Canada, where with the addition of GST (on every purchase) & shipping, the US price advantage over buying locally is reduced.

There's no exemption. It is just that the costs associated with collecting GST are higher than the $60 collected. For example if the sender doesn't collect GST (and how small stores would do it?) then Customs will need storage space for all goods while waiting for payment. People to move the goods from the pallets to storage, people to chase payment, people to process payment, people to move out of storage, trucks to move to NZ Post or Couriers, etc.

All this costs money and $60 is the minimum where they can do it.

Start charging for everything and you have a government agency that will need a super budget, more employees and so on...

vexxxboy

4246 posts

Uber Geek

#1276710 3-Apr-2015 13:11

code15: Not sure if this view has been mentioned yet:

So I had no moral issues with using UnoTelly to access US Netflix, and paying for a US account.

But.

I've just discovered how easy it is to use the Dynamo feature which gives you access to Netflix in every country - even though you're paying for one account (in my case, a US one).

This coupled with https://netflixaroundtheworld.com allows me to search whatever movie/tv series I want to watch and 9 times out of 10 some country's Netflix will have it.

To me, this is moving into a greyer area. My US subscription is my contribution towards content rights for tv/movies on netflix US, but with Dynamo I'm getting free access to tv/movies available only in Canada, Denmark, etc.

Of course Netflix knows this loophole exists.

actually netflix promote this as a holiday service and say instead of cancelling you service you can take it and use your subscription while on holidays in different countries, is it there fault that people are abusing the service.

Common sense is not as common as you think.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1276712 3-Apr-2015 13:18

The other thing that occurred to me whilst pondering this idea is that there are some potentially dangerous long term implications for the way isps fundamentally work that could come from this.

Consider things like the safe harbor rules, where isps that carry illegal or copyright breaching content are safe from prosecution because they are not aware of what is being carried on their networks. (Just like courier companies cannot be prosecuted for shipping drugs if they are not aware of the drugs)

This is why ISPs (in NZ) cannot be forced to block access to sites like pirate bay, or stuff like child pornography.
However, this does rest on the critical assumption that ISPs are not aware of what is being carried on their network, and therefore cannot be expected to police it.

Global mode, as an isp provided service, means the ISP is fully aware, and indeed is actively encouraging their customers to breach intellectual property rights by accessing content they do not have the right to access.

Yeah sure they can put in their disclaimers 'do not use this service to breach ts and cs' but they also state up front this is for accessing US Netflix, which can only be done in NZ with a breach of ts and cs.

It just makes me nervous that an ISP that provides global mode now has a big target painted on its back by studios who lobby the government for law changes that can hurt us all. The studios can point to call plus etc and argue to the government that the laws should be changed to make ISPs far more responsible than they are today. Stopping global mode would just be a thin end of the wedge to then lobby for ISPs to block BitTorrent traffic, block pirate bay etc etc

If callplus had just stayed away and concentrated on providing broadband, and let unblock-us etc just do what they do (much better I might add) then it would be so much harder for studios to make any argument about what ISPs should or should not be doing to protect IP rights.

ISPs should stay neutral. They should provide broadband and not try to interfere with what customers can or cannot access on their network. That means they shouldn't be stopping people from accessing sites, but likewise they also shouldn't be encouraging or enabling them to access sites they normally couldn't.

Sidestep

1013 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#1276731 3-Apr-2015 14:16

freitasm:
There's no exemption. It is just that the costs associated with collecting GST are higher than the $60 collected. For example if the sender doesn't collect GST (and how small stores would do it?) then Customs will need storage space for all goods while waiting for payment. People to move the goods from the pallets to storage, people to chase payment, people to process payment, people to move out of storage, trucks to move to NZ Post or Couriers, etc.

All this costs money and $60 is the minimum where they can do it.

I think they'll review that.. and will find ways to do it as more and more people purchase online. In the Canadian case a user fee covers the implementation costs.

There is actually a Canadian exemption, just much lower than NZ's $400 cutoff – at CAN$20, after that tax is due.

“if someone mails you an item worth $20 or less, you don’t have to pay duty or taxes on the item. If the item is worth more than $20, you must pay the applicable duty, the GST or HST, and any PST on the item’s full value”

To reduce those GST collection costs (and add insult to injury):

“To process goods imported as mail that are subject to duty and/or tax, Canada Post charges the recipient CAN$9.95. If the item is duty-free and tax exempt, no amount is charged.”

And to avoid the storage/handling costs you mentioned..a computer generated invoice is just stuck onto to your parcel:

“If items being mailed to you are subject to duty and taxes, you will find Form E14, CBSA Postal Import Form, attached to your parcel”

You pay by CC, cash, cheque, to your mailman/courier or at your Post office..

Introducing the unpopular "user pays" customs idea it was painted it as a way of shielding wholesome (Tax paying) local companies from undercutting by rapacious foreign sweatshops.
They are - very publicly - working on a way to charge GST on Netflix and similar services at the moment, calling it a way of "protecting Canadian service providers" ..

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1276742 3-Apr-2015 14:40

If the court rules that global mode is totally legal and fine, then here's an idea spark could do.

1) setup a version of lightbox in some teeny nothing country like, say, San Marino

2) Buy rights to distribute content in San Marino for all the awesome content. HBO, sports etc This content would be super cheap, especially stuff like the All Blacks because San marino demand for the all blacks would be very low, so it could have a vast amount of content, more than any other provider.

3) cancel content contracts for NZ version of lightbox. Have only a few token shows on there.

3) provide all lightbox customers with a free 'global mode' to allow them to view Lighbox San Marino content. make sure you tell the customers they absolutely must not use it for accessing lightbox San marino, but nudge nudge wink wink, do whatever you want.

4) profit.

dclegg

2806 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1276745 3-Apr-2015 14:49

NonprayingMantis: If the court rules that global mode is totally legal and fine, then here's an idea spark could do.

1) setup a version of lightbox in some teeny nothing country like, say, San Marino

2) Buy rights to distribute content in San Marino for all the awesome content. HBO, sports etc This content would be super cheap, especially stuff like the All Blacks because San marino demand for the all blacks would be very low, so it could have a vast amount of content, more than any other provider.

3) cancel content contracts for NZ version of lightbox. Have only a few token shows on there.

3) provide all lightbox customers with a free 'global mode' to allow them to view Lighbox San Marino content. make sure you tell the customers they absolutely must not use it for accessing lightbox San marino, but nudge nudge wink wink, do whatever you want.

4) profit.

Not a bad idea, but I suspect content rates will increase dramatically by the time Lightbox San Marino come to renegotiate them at the end of their term.

Guess they could find another small country to open up a branch in. Should be enough of them to keep Lightbox going for the next few decades :-)

BigMal

996 posts

Ultimate Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

#1276757 3-Apr-2015 15:00

NonprayingMantis: If the court rules that global mode is totally legal and fine, then here's an idea spark could do.

1) setup a version of lightbox in some teeny nothing country like, say, San Marino

2) Buy rights to distribute content in San Marino for all the awesome content. HBO, sports etc This content would be super cheap, especially stuff like the All Blacks because San marino demand for the all blacks would be very low, so it could have a vast amount of content, more than any other provider.

3) cancel content contracts for NZ version of lightbox. Have only a few token shows on there.

3) provide all lightbox customers with a free 'global mode' to allow them to view Lighbox San Marino content. make sure you tell the customers they absolutely must not use it for accessing lightbox San marino, but nudge nudge wink wink, do whatever you want.

4) profit.

This is what Premiere League Pass did, buy globally popular sports in a small market and make them available (via geo unblockers) to the rest of the world.

NZ's Premiere League Pass is rapidly becoming one of the most popular ways to watch football in the UK and around the world.

Quic Broadband

Move to New Zealand's best fibre broadband service (affiliate link). Free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE. Note that to use Quic Broadband you must be comfortable with configuring your own router.

BarTender

3607 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1276767 3-Apr-2015 16:02

So me with my devil's advocate hat on would you just prefer tvnz, sky and lightbox just not bothered setting up in NZ. As the international offerings from the US will always be cheaper than NZ because the larger companies can negotiate a cheaper deal with the content creators due to size. The money the companies initiating the legal action who invested signing content rights with the content companies was really a wasted investment not worth protecting really??

freitasm

BDFL - Memuneh
79316 posts

Uber Geek

Administrator

ID Verified

Trusted

Geekzone

Lifetime subscriber

#1276788 3-Apr-2015 16:14

Let's put in other way: now that Netflix is here and people can open a account without having US card all that is needed to access US content is a Global Mode service.

Up until now few people would bother because a Netflix US account was a hassle. But now it means these NZ services have a mighty competitor right here and people can easily switch regions - More so than before.

Obviously they can't cry and ask Netflix to go away so they decide to attack another point - the network providers.

I see this as being afraid of the competition Netflix brings to the country.

dclegg

2806 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1276797 3-Apr-2015 16:31

freitasm: Let's put in other way: now that Netflix is here and people can open a account without having US card all that is needed to access US content is a Global Mode service.

Up until now few people would bother because a Netflix US account was a hassle. But now it means these NZ services have a mighty competitor right here and people can easily switch regions - More so than before.

Obviously they can't cry and ask Netflix to go away so they decide to attack another point - the network providers.

I see this as being afraid of the competition Netflix brings to the country.

Yes. They need to figure out how they can compete, working under the assumption that users of Netflix NZ have the entire Netflix catalogue at their disposal, as trying to prevent that would be akin to a game of whack-a-mole. Thats why I think this move by the Kiwi providers is the wrong approach.

There are probably quite a lot of quality NZ & Australian shows that Netflix overlooks. They should be thinking of adding some of that to their line ups. Also, adding access to current Free to Air channels, and streaming sports content could be handy (provided its not priced at the ridiculous FanPass levels).

Out of all the providers, I see Neon as being at a bit of a content advantage, as they have access to shows that Netflix can't get at. Although this advantage will disappear somewhat when HBO launches their service later this month. But they really need to reassess their current price, and get HD support ASAP. Device support is also sorely lacking but, as we've seen with Lightbox, I expect that to improve over time.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1276799 3-Apr-2015 16:36

freitasm: Let's put in other way: now that Netflix is here and people can open a account without having US card all that is needed to access US content is a Global Mode service.

Up until now few people would bother because a Netflix US account was a hassle. But now it means these NZ services have a mighty competitor right here and people can easily switch regions - More so than before.

Obviously they can't cry and ask Netflix to go away so they decide to attack another point - the network providers.

I see this as being afraid of the competition Netflix brings to the country.

netflx us accepted nz credit cards and random us addresses. (That's how I signed up)Once you had global mode, creating a U.S. account was trivial.

Call plus always said that once netflix arrived here they would switch global mode off, so maybe sky etc were waiting for that to happen. I.e. No point creating publicity for a problem that would disappear soon.
Obviously they have decided not to switch global mode off, so now sky et al will take the action.

Being afraid of the competition is absolutely right. I'd be very afraid of competition that had a huge natural advantage over me because they were willing to (potentially) break the law and could get away with it.
Netflix have the advantages of no gst, no need to comply with any nz fair trading laws or CGA, access to global scaled content. The playing field is hugely tilted in their favour, so it's no surprise the other guys are trying to stop it.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1276800 3-Apr-2015 16:38

dclegg:
freitasm: Let's put in other way: now that Netflix is here and people can open a account without having US card all that is needed to access US content is a Global Mode service.

Up until now few people would bother because a Netflix US account was a hassle. But now it means these NZ services have a mighty competitor right here and people can easily switch regions - More so than before.

Obviously they can't cry and ask Netflix to go away so they decide to attack another point - the network providers.

I see this as being afraid of the competition Netflix brings to the country.

Yes. They need to figure out how they can compete, working under the assumption that users of Netflix NZ have the entire Netflix catalogue at their disposal, as trying to prevent that would be akin to a game of whack-a-mole. Thats why I think this move by the Kiwi providers is the wrong approach.

There are probably quite a lot of quality NZ & Australian shows that Netflix overlooks. They should be thinking of adding some of that to their line ups. Also, adding access to current Free to Air channels, and streaming sports content could be handy (provided its not priced at the ridiculous FanPass levels).

Out of all the providers, I see Neon as being at a bit of a content advantage, as they have access to shows that Netflix can't get at. Although this advantage will disappear somewhat when HBO launches their service later this month. But they really need to reassess their current price, and get HD support ASAP. Device support is also sorely lacking but, as we've seen with Lightbox, I expect that to improve over time.

How would access to FTA help? It's already free for everybody and virtually everybody has a Freeview receiver already. It would be a huge expense for very little benefit.

freitasm

BDFL - Memuneh
79316 posts

Uber Geek

Administrator

ID Verified

Trusted

Geekzone

Lifetime subscriber

#1276801 3-Apr-2015 16:38

Stop Netflix? So why don't they go after Netflix instead? Oh, I get it. Like sharks they go after the little guy not the 800 pound gorilla.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1276802 3-Apr-2015 16:39

BarTender: So me with my devil's advocate hat on would you just prefer tvnz, sky and lightbox just not bothered setting up in NZ. As the international offerings from the US will always be cheaper than NZ because the larger companies can negotiate a cheaper deal with the content creators due to size. The money the companies initiating the legal action who invested signing content rights with the content companies was really a wasted investment not worth protecting really??

I wonder how many of the people complaining about this action are the same people who have been bemoaning the lack of good local services over the last few years.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1276803 3-Apr-2015 16:41

freitasm: Stop Netflix? So why don't they go after Netflix instead? Oh, I get it. Like sharks they go after the little guy not the 800 pound gorilla.

Netflix isn't an nz company (that's why they don't pay gst) so wouldn't fall under nz legal jurisdictions I assume.
Same reason they can't target unblock-us etc.

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | ... | 54