EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

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#2428770 28-Feb-2020 12:03

jfanning:

So it is ridiculous that our Government has a robust documented procurement process? They aren't a little business, they need processes around this, other companies including a number of other EV providers have no issue following the requirements to sell to the Government, why can't Tesla?

Tesla is so busy trying to support their existing customers fleet and struggle to answer calls for service etc. This is a current fact in NZ.

I doubt they are anywhere close to supplying it to Govt and ensure service and repairs are dealt with.

Obraik

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#2428773 28-Feb-2020 12:11

jfanning:

So it is ridiculous that our Government has a robust documented procurement process? They aren't a little business, they need processes around this, other companies including a number of other EV providers have no issue following the requirements to sell to the Government, why can't Tesla?

Yeah, when it comes to finding something better, I think they should be seeking out the better alternatives rather than picking from what comes through the door.

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Scott3

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#2428778 28-Feb-2020 12:22

Obraik:

The Model S would be a decent 7 Series replacement.

Sadly there is no Long wheel base variant of the model s, unlike the 7 series.

The back seat room (especially headroom) in a model S is inferior to say a Camry... let alone a LWB 7 series.

I don't think they would be a fit replacement.

Also it is rumored that for the crown cars BMW gives a massive discount off the retail price. (pretty much they are willing to pay so that the countries leaders and foreign diplomats are seen to arrive at high profile, often televised events in BMW's, for marketing purposes). This means the crown gets a big head start on depreciation compared to private buyers.

Tesla has a strict no discounts policy (outside of clearing the stock they have on hand, which is listed online and available to the general public). This is fair on private buyers, but means the brand is less attractive for fleet use.

I think is is likely that for the next crown car procurement we will end up with the plug in hybrid BMW 7 series, even if they only have a disappointing 26km of electric range.

Obraik

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#2428784 28-Feb-2020 12:31

Scott3:

Sadly there is no Long wheel base variant of the model s, unlike the 7 series.

The back seat room (especially headroom) in a model S is inferior to say a Camry... let alone a LWB 7 series.

I don't think they would be a fit replacement.

Also it is rumored that for the crown cars BMW gives a massive discount off the retail price. (pretty much they are willing to pay so that the countries leaders and foreign diplomats are seen to arrive at high profile, often televised events in BMW's, for marketing purposes). This means the crown gets a big head start on depreciation compared to private buyers.

Tesla has a strict no discounts policy (outside of clearing the stock they have on hand, which is listed online and available to the general public). This is fair on private buyers, but means the brand is less attractive for fleet use.

I think is is likely that for the next crown car procurement we will end up with the plug in hybrid BMW 7 series, even if they only have a disappointing 26km of electric range.

Where seating room is an issue then the Model X is also available with 500km of range. I'm sure there are some heavy discounts available from BMW but going on the list price both the Model S and X are cheaper than a 7 Series. There are also the running cost savings of an EV over the diesels they currently buy.

They did evaluate the PHEV 7 Series and deemed the electric range to be unsatisfactory and rejected it as a replacement, which is fair enough IMO. A PHEV doesn't really make sense if most of the travel is "long distant" out of city driving (the test they used to evaluate was a return trip between Wellington and Taihepe) as the electric range disappears fairly quickly and it becomes a heavy petrol powered car that is less efficient than a ICE vehicle.

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DS248

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#2433275 5-Mar-2020 16:28

Tesla lead in battery tech not as big as has been suggest?

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/04/business/gm-electric-car-battery-400-miles-of-range/index.html

wellygary

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#2433285 5-Mar-2020 16:41

DS248:

Tesla lead in battery tech not as big as has been suggest?

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/04/business/gm-electric-car-battery-400-miles-of-range/index.html

GM has partnered wish LG Chem over this....

https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/general-motors-aims-for-reinvention-with-new-modular-ev-platform

and will be building a new plant in the US to produce them, it will apparently have a capacity of 30Gwh, that's 500K 60kwh packs per year

https://electrek.co/2019/12/05/gm-announces-its-own-battery-gigafactory-with-lg-chem-30-gwh-of-capacity-below-100-kwh/

BlinkyBill

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#2433351 5-Mar-2020 19:46

DS248:

Tesla lead in battery tech not as big as has been suggest?

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/04/business/gm-electric-car-battery-400-miles-of-range/index.html

the Tesla Battery and Powertrain Day is coming up soon, and there will be some significant announcements from them then.

but wouldn’t it be hopeless if the manufacturers didn’t invest in advancements?

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Obraik

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#2433531 6-Mar-2020 10:11

DS248:

Tesla lead in battery tech not as big as has been suggest?

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/04/business/gm-electric-car-battery-400-miles-of-range/index.html

Competition is good as it drives developments like this.

However, GM hasn't built a production EV that comes anywhere close to 400 miles yet, whereas the production Model S is just 10 miles shy of it. While the battery obviously plays a big part in the range, how you build the car does too. Audi's etron has a pretty big battery (95 kWH) but due to the way they built the car its range is 150miles shorter than a similar Model X.

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PolicyGuy

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#2433615 6-Mar-2020 13:11

Obraik:

DS248:Tesla lead in battery tech not as big as has been suggest?
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/04/business/gm-electric-car-battery-400-miles-of-range/index.html

Competition is good as it drives developments like this.

However, GM hasn't built a production EV that comes anywhere close to 400 miles yet, whereas the production Model S is just 10 miles shy of it. While the battery obviously plays a big part in the range, how you build the car does too. Audi's etron has a pretty big battery (95 kWH) but due to the way they built the car its range is 150miles shorter than a similar Model X.

Also, this is GM promising to produce vehicles in 2024/25 that are comparable in performance to vehicles Tesla produced in 2019.
I would be deeply disappointed if Tesla is still producing the same storage & drivetrain technology in 2024 as it was last year

Looks like a 5-year lead to Tesla, I'd say!

tdgeek

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#2433622 6-Mar-2020 13:32

PolicyGuy:

Also, this is GM promising to produce vehicles in 2024/25 that are comparable in performance to vehicles Tesla produced in 2019.
I would be deeply disappointed if Tesla is still producing the same storage & drivetrain technology in 2024 as it was last year

Looks like a 5-year lead to Tesla, I'd say!

The issue was battery tech (and price) not vehicles.

However, GM do say they have cars coming that will be doing 400 miles. And one would assume price based on lower battery costs. Tesla has a good lead, others will nibble at that, but at the end of the day its about new EV's on the road. Its pointless having one brand

tripper1000

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#2433639 6-Mar-2020 13:40

It's a bit of a bugger for us that GM has gotten out of the right-had drive market so we'll never see those cars here.

kingdragonfly

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#2433640 6-Mar-2020 13:45

Mini E: ultimate electric hot hatch? Full road test

Jonny Smith CarPervert

The Mini E - or Mini Cooper se to be precise - is Mini's first mass produced electric car... The latest UK-built British icon has been gifted the electric powertrain of its BMW i3 cousin and a few minor trim tweaks to provide a quicker 0-62 than its Honda e arch rival, as well the Peugeot e208, revised VW e-Up! and Renault Zoe.

tripper1000

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#2433645 6-Mar-2020 13:52

tdgeek: The issue was battery tech (and price) not vehicles.....

The link spoke to that point:

GM promised the new battery cells will quickly come down in price to below $100 per kilowatt hour. Batteries make up a very large part of an electric vehicle's cost and $100 per kilowatt hour is often cited by industry analysts as the threshold that will enable electric cars to become truly cost competitive with traditional gasoline-powered vehicles.

Edit: Tesla is rumoured to already be at or below the magical $100 threshold with the Model 3 already, so I wouldn't be too quick to down play their head start.

tdgeek

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#2433656 6-Mar-2020 14:05

tripper1000:

GM promised the new battery cells will quickly come down in price to below $100 per kilowatt hour. Batteries make up a very large part of an electric vehicle's cost and $100 per kilowatt hour is often cited by industry analysts as the threshold that will enable electric cars to become truly cost competitive with traditional gasoline-powered vehicles.

Edit: Tesla is rumoured to already be at or below the magical $100 threshold with the Model 3 already, so I wouldn't be too quick to down play their head start.

Not downplaying their head start, its a fair war for the market by Tesla and anyone else. Some huge $ have been thrown around for the cost of batteries. If 80kWh is 80 X US$100 thats chicken feed. Especially when an ICE engine is very expensive. That would indicate a lot of gain in price parity, and that's the main issue for people and climate change benefits

kingdragonfly

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#2434038 7-Mar-2020 08:39

This has a RHD model, unlike the California only model, so could be used in NZ easily.

Next-generation Fiat 500: *Not* the Same As It Ever Was

TheTruthAboutCars.com by Steph Willems on March 4, 2020

...The Fiat 500e promises far greater range to go with its retro looks and park-anywhere footprint. Fiat claims a range of [320 KM, about the distance from Auckland to New Plymouth].

..It seems bumping up the model’s capacity to 42 kWh, something you can do when you’re not just retrofitting an existing ICE car, paid off. For a European city car, this sounds fine, and it’s topped off with an 85 kW charger system that can dump 50 KM into the “tank” in 5 minutes, assuming you find the right kind of hookup.

...To compensate for the additional weight, the model’s motor grows slightly to 87 kW (117 horsepower), affording a top speed of 150 KPH and a 0-100 kph time of 9 seconds. Overall, the next-gen 500 stretches an extra 2.4 inches front to back and side to side, with its wheelbase and height growing by eight-tenths of an inch.

...The new 500 boasts a 10.3-inch touchscreen, up-to-date Uconnect 5 infotainment system, and a host of driver-assist aids.

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