EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › EV (electric vehicle) News and Discussion

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#3309723 16-Nov-2024 16:24

johno1234:

Not BS IMHO. I would have to wait for a pump about once per year, and that guy will fill and be gone in 5 min. However I don't pick and choose a station to save a few dollars on the fill - time is worth more than the money.

Im sorry, but just because you may only have to do it once per year doesn't make it BS, your anecdote doesn't make mine less valid. Like i said, those 2 stations are routinely busy and you more often than not have to wait, even with 16 pumps at each station.

Go past most South Auckland petrol stations on a cheap fuel day, and you will find queues.

MarkH67

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#3309726 16-Nov-2024 16:32

Handsomedan:

It’s not just the time to charge, but the fact that chargers don’t have payment terminals on them.
You can’t just rock up to a charger that you don’t have an account for and charge (as far as I am aware), so it’s less convenient - whether in reality or perception.

I would have to agree with this point. We absolutely should be able to go to any publicly available fast charger and pay with EFT-POS or Paywave. Hopefully this will happen, but right now things are harder than they need to be.

Of course, we shouldn't overlook the fact that most of the time for most drivers, EVs are easier than ICE vehicles, not even needing to visit a charger for normal day-to-day living. Until ICE vehicles can fill their gas tanks while parked at home in their garage, they will remain inferior. EVs are cheaper and easier for servicing and maintenance as well as for energy costs. EVs are also smoother and quieter with no fumes. ICE vehicles have a goofy torque curve with low power from the start, EVs are so much better with all the power available when you want to go from stationary to driving at normal road-going speeds.

I long for the day when the work trucks charge each night and happily get through every work day without needing to stop to take on smelly & dirty diesel.

RunningMan

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#3309732 16-Nov-2024 16:58

Handsomedan: [snip]
The biggest issue for a new EV driver coming from ICE driving is the inconvenience of charging.
It’s not just the time to charge, but the fact that chargers don’t have payment terminals on them.
You can’t just rock up to a charger that you don’t have an account for and charge (as far as I am aware), so it’s less convenient - whether in reality or perception.

This is definitely something that needs to improve. You can go to any petrol station and pay in pretty much any format. Almost every charging network requires the use of an app. That's not always a bad thing, as you can pay by app for petrol which make it easy if you regularly use the same company to fill up.

That works great for the compaany becaause it helps tie you to them (as @handsomedan found out) but not so good for the consumer.

Not sure if it's still the case, but you could charge at BP with no account I think, but still needed to use the app.

I guess the issue is the cost saving per charger by not needing a payment terminal on it

HarmLessSolutions

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#3309734 16-Nov-2024 17:18

The myriad of public charger networks on offer in the UK often offering their own membership/app system for customers has increasingly been regarded as a restriction of their use and significantly inconvenient. The UK government has recognised this among other factors in the revised Charge Point Regulations which have recently come into force there.

"New public charge points of 8kW and above and existing charge points of 50kW and above must offer contactless [payment] to consumers.
Proprietary networks that open their charge points for public use will have one year from the date that the charge point becomes public to offer contactless."

"The contactless payment may accept payment such as Apple and Google Pay but must also accept contactless bank cards. A public charge point may offer contactless alongside additional payment methods, such as an app or QR code."

Hopefully our government will move similarly to streamline NZ's public charging network as part of their national EV charging network policy, though I'm not holding my breath in either regard. Though as an EV owner that does >95% of our charging at home (from solar) the vagaries of EV infrastructure development isn't high on my Xmas gift list.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

Handsomedan

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#3309735 16-Nov-2024 17:23

Yup - make charging as easy to initiate as filling with gas and a lot of the issues go away in longer trips or for people who don’t have home chargers.

To be fair - home charging makes round town running so easy. For the average non-traveller, an EV with a home charger totally makes sense!

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Scott3

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#3309742 16-Nov-2024 18:46

exador: Picked up my car yesterday. It’s brand new, 2024 registered to me as first owner.
According to VIN number it doesn’t have the LFP battery.

I went past the Ford storage yard in South Auckland and there is still a handful of Mach-E’s left.

Congrats on the car, looks stunning in that color.

I think wheel's on the non LFP RWD car's look better, and being 18" rather than 19" means a taller sidewall which means typically cheaper tires, better ride comfort, less prone to pothole damage etc.

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exador

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#3309771 16-Nov-2024 20:02

Scott3:
Congrats on the car, looks stunning in that color.

I think wheel's on the non LFP RWD car's look better, and being 18" rather than 19" means a taller sidewall which means typically cheaper tires, better ride comfort, less prone to pothole damage etc.

Cheers. Looking forward to my EV adventure.

deepred

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#3309776 16-Nov-2024 20:21

Scott3:

exador: Picked up my car yesterday. It’s brand new, 2024 registered to me as first owner.
According to VIN number it doesn’t have the LFP battery.

I went past the Ford storage yard in South Auckland and there is still a handful of Mach-E’s left.

Congrats on the car, looks stunning in that color.

I think wheel's on the non LFP RWD car's look better, and being 18" rather than 19" means a taller sidewall which means typically cheaper tires, better ride comfort, less prone to pothole damage etc.

Apparently it's officially known as Grabber Blue:

https://www.goldeagle.com/tips-tools/history-of-ford-grabber-blue/

https://www.motortrend.com/news/2024-ford-mustang-paint-colors-grabber-blue/

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dafman

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#3309824 17-Nov-2024 09:59

MarkH67:

Until ICE vehicles can fill their gas tanks while parked at home in their garage, they will remain inferior.

Yes, if you have a garage, or off street parking. If you don’t, ICE are superior for ease of use for people without off street parking.

And for people living in shared accommodation, EVs ownership could be more problematic than ICE (Hey Steve, can you move the Camira? I need to get the Torana out to get to the Commodore up to the charger). And if you have some EV owners flatting with non-EV owners, how do they divvy up the power bill? In both cases, it is workable, but there is additional hassle for the EV scenario over ICE.

I get that for some people, EVs are great. And all power to them. I just go back to my original point, EV owners are a subset of overall vehicle owners and recent sales volumes suggest this subset is close to being fully tapped out (for the current technology).

dafman

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#3309825 17-Nov-2024 10:09

MarkH67:

In an EV, with a couple of stops for eating, peeing, stretching the legs, taking a much needed break from driving - with charging happening during those breaks, you would end up getting to the destination at the same time as a normal & sensible ICE driver taking the same breaks (even if the car isn't charging while he/she is eating).

Agree, as long as you are happy to restrict your eating, peeing and stretching your legs to a predefined location with an available EV charging station. I’m not.

Ge0rge

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#3309843 17-Nov-2024 13:19

I'm currently in the US. The rental car I have is a PHEV. Came with a full tank of petrol and a flat battery.

This morning, I had about an hour before my first timing, so I thought I'd go throw some electrons in it, see how it drove on those.

Google maps tells me there are six charging stations within a mile of me, all located around the outside of a mall, and all different brands.

First one is chokka. Eight cars, one at every stand, and another seven lined up waiting. Second one, two stands, empty but didn't have the cable type I needed. Third one was out of order. Forth - yes! Right cable, free bay. App or fob. No fob with the car, sweet I'll download the app. "This app is not available in your country". Ok, google how to change my country. "You can only change country once annually, and must wait 12 months before you can make another change".

Bugger it, I'm just going to burn dead dinosaurs for the remainder of the trip.

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HarmLessSolutions

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#3309846 17-Nov-2024 13:36

Ge0rge: I'm currently in the US. The rental car I have is a PHEV. Came with a full tank of petrol and a flat battery.

This morning, I had about an hour before my first timing, so I thought I'd go throw some electrons in it, see how it drove on those.

Google maps tells me there are six charging stations within a mile of me, all located around the outside of a mall, and all different brands.

First one is chokka. Eight cars, one at every stand, and another seven lined up waiting. Second one, two stands, empty but didn't have the cable type I needed. Third one was out of order. Forth - yes! Right cable, free bay. App or fob. No fob with the car, sweet I'll download the app. "This app is not available in your country". Ok, google how to change my country. "You can only change country once annually, and must wait 12 months before you can make another change".

Bugger it, I'm just going to burn dead dinosaurs for the remainder of the trip.

So it would seem that 'bring it back with a full tank or you will be billed for filling it' doesn't apply to a PHEV's battery.

I've read a few posts on the Polestar forum about rental companies just passing over the fob on pick-up of a car with no charging advice or charging dongle. Our Polestar2 came with an RFID card preregistered to Chargenet. How difficult would it be for the rental company to provide this (or a less pocketable device) as part of their service and then oncharge any charging carried out during the rental period? Guess rental companies promoting EVs by increasing the convenience of hirers is just too much to expect.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

Ge0rge

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#3309847 17-Nov-2024 13:48

How simple would it be if you just had to wave a credit card at the charging station in order to charge the vehicle? Why this kafaful with fobs and apps etc in the first place?

Hell, charge me a couple of extra cents per electron if I don't have your secret handshake on arrival but I kinda figured charging companies were in the business of making money from charging...

gzt

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#3309850 17-Nov-2024 14:09

dafman: I get that for some people, EVs are great. And all power to them. I just go back to my original point, EV owners are a subset of overall vehicle owners and recent sales volumes suggest this subset is close to being fully tapped out (for the current technology).

Tapped out - no not at all. Recent sales volumes clearly demonstrate price is the issue.

The issue the subsidy was designed to mitigate while manufacturing volume increases.

Subsidies worldwide have worked well to achieve this.

gzt

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#3309851 17-Nov-2024 14:23

Ge0rge: How simple would it be if you just had to wave a credit card at the charging station in order to charge the vehicle? Why this kafaful with fobs and apps etc in the first place? Hell, charge me a couple of extra cents per electron if I don't have your secret handshake on arrival but I kinda figured charging companies were in the business of making money from charging...

It costs significantly more to install, operate and maintain eftpos payment systems compared to keyfob or app.

I do agree though.

I have a couple of chargenet keyfobs one for each key. I have needed to use it only once.

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