Credit Card Chargeback Advice

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Forums › Finance and wealth management › Credit Card Chargeback Advice - Viagogo

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#1785870 22-May-2017 11:27

sbiddle:

sonyxperiageek:

$130 in booking fees?! Wow! Definitely worse than Ticketmaster etc.

They're a reseller. It's how they make money. They also need to absorb losses (such as a cancelled event) when they have to pay out to people who have purchased tickets.

Pretty darn good amounts of it! If an event is cancelled and tickets are refunded, surely they just pay back what they got? Especially if "The ticket was not available instantly indicating to me that the ticket was never actually available at time of purchase and only purchased by Viagogo after I paid for it on the Viagogo website"...

I also wouldn't think they have many overheads if they're simply re-buying and selling tickets? Not entirely sure of their exact processes. But like someone said, most of that $130 is probably paying for Google Adwords or something like that.

Sony

mattwnz

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#1785961 22-May-2017 13:33

Athlonite:
sbiddle:

firefuze:

During the buy process online all amounts were shown as $NZD but upon checking my credit card I was charged the same amount but in Euro's resulting an extra ~$100NZD after currency conversion. i.e $220NZD at checkout became €220 on my credit card resulting in $350NZD

Was that because of the booking fees though? $130 in booking fees/extras sounds about right for a $220 ticket.

Note I'm not defending them - they operate along the lines of scammer but are a legitimate business. It's more than there is nothing I've seen you post that would be deemed as legitimate reasons for a charge back.

Did you miss the bit where it said price advertised in NZD$ right up until actual payment taken which was in Euro's not NZ dollars in NZ that's completely illegal to say your paying in one currency only to charge you in a completely other currency you must inform a buyer of the currency they'll be charged in right from the get go

Are they s NZ company though? They should definitely showproof of that to the credit card company. But I have found that sort of thing before, although normally if it will convert it

sen8or

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#1786088 22-May-2017 16:41

It may depend on where they are based and what laws they have to operate under. Under the Fair Trading Act, they can't advertise in a way that is intended or likely to mislead a reasonable person as to the price, quality, origin etc of the goods (there is more too it than that, but thats the cliffs), this is the basic law that all retailers have to abide by when competing for business. Unfortunately, if they are based offshore, then any enforcement of NZ law becomes problematic.

I did a quick look on their site for Ed Sheran tickets, they were around $200ea stated in NZ$. I didn't go any further than looking at the initial pricing, so not sure when the additional charges show, but it did state in their FAQ about additional service charges which they claim are shown in the checkout process.

I would think you are pretty out of luck on this one, there is not a valid reason for chargeback as you were delivered the goods you were sold (which is one of the very few reasons credit card companies can chargeback) and ultimately you decided not to use the goods you had paid for.

Chalk it up to a life lesson

mattwnz

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#1786118 22-May-2017 18:10

I just tried out the website to see what the order process is like. It says that the Ed Sherran tickets are about $200 NZ, which seems OKish. Then it says it is + booking fee +VAT. Why are they charging VAT to NZers?

Also it requires me to go onto the payment page and enter in my credit card details, before it actually gives me the final price (including the booking fee) . Although on the payment page it now adds on a $7.99 'secure handling fee'. But it still says +Booking Fee + VAT. So why it doesn't quote the booking fee at that stage, I don't know. So I don't know what the booking fee amount is, until it has already got my credit card details. I didn't enter those details, as I didn't want to risk buying the tickets. Is this normal these days? Normally you don't give over your credit card details, until you know the final price you have to pay. However it does quote the pricing in NZD for me.

Oblivian

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#1786120 22-May-2017 18:13

sen8or:

It may depend on where they are based and what laws they have to operate under. Under the Fair Trading Act, they can't advertise in a way that is intended or likely to mislead a reasonable person as to the price, quality, origin etc of the goods (there is more too it than that, but thats the cliffs), this is the basic law that all retailers have to abide by when competing for business. Unfortunately, if they are based offshore, then any enforcement of NZ law becomes problematic.

I did a quick look on their site for Ed Sheran tickets, they were around $200ea stated in NZ$. I didn't go any further than looking at the initial pricing, so not sure when the additional charges show, but it did state in their FAQ about additional service charges which they claim are shown in the checkout process.

I would think you are pretty out of luck on this one, there is not a valid reason for chargeback as you were delivered the goods you were sold (which is one of the very few reasons credit card companies can chargeback) and ultimately you decided not to use the goods you had paid for.

Chalk it up to a life lesson

This is exactly what the commerce commission are stewing over at present after an 11yr old spend 3x face value for her mum in a similar instance.

The coverage of an overseas site not representing face value clearly. And if it is misleading to NZ buyers.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/91729606/ticket-reselling-prompts-investigation-by-consumer-new-zealand

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11857922

And to those wondering how it faces in fair trading etc. They are the equivalent of trademe. A middle man doing scalpers a favour with inflated fees to cover. Since TM now block sales if the product doesn't exist most of them are now using Viagogo.

Instead of warning everyone over it I'm not sure why ISPs aren't doing us a favour and just nullrouting the domain in the meantime. They do it for other scam and or malicious domains as required.

sbiddle

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#1786122 22-May-2017 18:23

mattwnz:

sbiddle:

sonyxperiageek:

$130 in booking fees?! Wow! Definitely worse than Ticketmaster etc.

They're a reseller. It's how they make money. They also need to absorb losses (such as a cancelled event) when they have to pay out to people who have purchased tickets.

Wouldn't they themselves get a refund though from the event ticketing company, if an event got cancelled? Or wouldn't they be able to get this?

Refunds are normally a credit card reversal to the person who purchased the ticket. As they're just a reseller they're not going to get that, the person who purchased the ticket originally will.

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sbiddle

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#1786124 22-May-2017 18:24

Athlonite:

sbiddle:

firefuze:

During the buy process online all amounts were shown as $NZD but upon checking my credit card I was charged the same amount but in Euro's resulting an extra ~$100NZD after currency conversion. i.e $220NZD at checkout became €220 on my credit card resulting in $350NZD

Was that because of the booking fees though? $130 in booking fees/extras sounds about right for a $220 ticket.

Note I'm not defending them - they operate along the lines of scammer but are a legitimate business. It's more than there is nothing I've seen you post that would be deemed as legitimate reasons for a charge back.

Did you miss the bit where it said price advertised in NZD$ right up until actual payment taken which was in Euro's not NZ dollars in NZ that's completely illegal to say your paying in one currency only to charge you in a completely other currency you must inform a buyer of the currency they'll be charged in right from the get go

I didn't miss that. Having purchased from Viagogo before I simply wonder if the OP has mistakenly confused what he saw. Ticket prices are in NZD but then have the processing fee on top which you don't see right until the end.

Oblivian

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#1786125 22-May-2017 18:25

Oh, and there *is* a ticketmaster reseller. That flicks cancelled and or expanded release tickets. They themselves got so much finger pointing that they are blocked by promoters for some shows now..

http://resale.ticketmaster.co.nz/

he majority of tickets may exceed face value and prices are set by the Sellers of the tickets. Ticketmaster Resale does not sell tickets, set ticket prices or control the ticket inventory available on the website - we provide the platform from which other people can buy and sell their tickets.

Essentially. If noone used these services, the guys reaping it would be out of pocket and think twice. The fact people do, means itll keep happening :(

sbiddle

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#1786127 22-May-2017 18:31

mattwnz:

I just tried out the website to see what the order process is like. It says that the Ed Sherran tickets are about $200 NZ, which seems OKish. Then it says it is + booking fee +VAT. Why are they charging VAT to NZers?

Also it requires me to go onto the payment page and enter in my credit card details, before it actually gives me the final price (including the booking fee) . Although on the payment page it now adds on a $7.99 'secure handling fee'. But it still says +Booking Fee + VAT. So why it doesn't quote the booking fee at that stage, I don't know. So I don't know what the booking fee amount is, until it has already got my credit card details. I didn't enter those details, as I didn't want to risk buying the tickets. Is this normal these days? Normally you don't give over your credit card details, until you know the final price you have to pay. However it does quote the pricing in NZD for me.

Their website and means of doing business are incredibly scammy - they even make you wait for minutes for tickets to show up at times "due to the high demand" and then give you a countdown timer to avoid losing your tickets.

There are huge numbers of websites that charge VAT or sales tax for products that are sold outside the country they're actually in.

mattwnz

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#1786133 22-May-2017 18:42

I got that 2 minute delay thing too. I guess it builds up the anticipation, and makes sure buyers are more juiced up to buy.

mattwnz

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#1786134 22-May-2017 18:46

sbiddle:

Refunds are normally a credit card reversal to the person who purchased the ticket. As they're just a reseller they're not going to get that, the person who purchased the ticket originally will.

Although wouldn't the ticket selling company be able to claim it off the party they purchased it from. eg Sending them a bill, or even a chargeback or reversal themselves? Otherwise the ticket seller gets the money they sold the ticket for, plus the refunded amount. I would feel sorry for the ticket selling company, if they did actually lose money in the case of a cancelled event.

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sonyxperiageek

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#1786179 22-May-2017 20:18

I got the two minute delay too for trying to purchase Lions Tour tickets... The tickets even disappear before your eyes when you scroll down saying they were "sold recently"... Go figure.

Sony

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#1786242 22-May-2017 20:49

My mum purchased Adele tickets from Viagogo recently. In the rush to get tickets before they sold out, she googled, and guess who the top google result is.

She thought that she was buying from an official source, and only found out later that Viagogo was actually a ticket reseller. I can understand why too, as I just had a look for myself (searched Ed Sheeran), and if they tell you that the tickets are resold, it's in very small print somewhere that I did not see, or they tell you much later in the checkout process.

They were able to gain entry, and even had decent seats, but mum was worried for the few months leading up to the concert that they would have terrible seats, or not able to gain entry to the concert.

I personally feel that they border on false advertising, if not being outright false advertising. Even the google search result is highly deceptive. For example: "Ed Sheeran Tickets 2017 - Buy Now, viagogo Official Site - viagogo.com‎". They do everything they can to give the impression of being an official ticket seller, without actually explicitly stating so.

Goosey

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#1786270 22-May-2017 22:21

Im just wow at the number of people who get caught out like this.

My two cents....some sarcasim....

Ok, so X event is advertised by X promoter and this advertisement will almost certainly contain the words (both spoken or oral depening on the advert), when and where tickets are avalible from. At this point person A simply needs to remember this....remember this.....maybe even go and log into the website of what X promoter said in their advertisment (because if your a newbie, you might need to create an account or somthing right), or most likley go and read up on more details like dates/venues/ticket categories etc etc etc and sort themselfs out before the "big day / On sale time/date".

THIS should happen right?

Back in the old days... if you didnt go & buy your ticket from the ticket agency and instead brought it from some guy around the corner of the building.....then you knew it wasnt 100% legit / scalper. The same logic applies here, i.e. goto ticket sellers website (the one the promoter tell you to use).

:-)

floydbloke

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#1786400 23-May-2017 09:10

Goosey:

Im just wow at the number of people who get caught out like this.

.....

:-)

I expect you over-estimate the nous of the average internet shopper.

Sometimes I use big words I don't always fully understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.

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