Rules around discussing illegal and/or dangerous DIY electrical work

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BDFL - Memuneh
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#973033 23-Jan-2014 17:37

Don't need to block the conversation. Just a warning that some work is required to be done by professionals. But have to be really a complete idiot to do it without regard for safety or law.

DarthKermit

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#973034 23-Jan-2014 17:37

We have a sign at work in the staff room telling people to not close the dishwasher or the cupboard doors or the drawers with their feet as it may damage them.

There's also another sign telling people to make sure the pointy end of anything sharp faces downwards in the dishwasher basket thingy.

I kid you all not about these two examples.

Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?

freitasm

BDFL - Memuneh
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#973035 23-Jan-2014 17:39

And you find these people are purportedly "intelligent" but reality is different...

andrewNZ

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#973056 23-Jan-2014 18:04

How about a Peter Reader reply like.

Doing your own electrical work?
Here’s a few basic things you should know.

You must be the owner of the property or equipment. If you’re not, you can't do any electrical work on it.
You're not allowed to work on anything live.
All work done and equipment used has to comply with all the current regulations.
If you're replacing something, the replacement has to be basically the same. You can't replace single sockets with doubles, or put a bigger water heater element in.

See http://www.ewrb.govt.nz/ for more detail.

And a few safety tips:

If you don't know how to do something, ask a properly trained professional before you start.
Turning off a switch does not guarantee something is off.
Most cheap testers are not suitable for mains work. Use a good quality tester, your life depends on it.

Klipspringer

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#973057 23-Jan-2014 18:05

When I go to the toilet at work I'm reminded that I need to wash my hands ...

In the kitchen we have another sign that says "always wash your hands before handling food"

Have similar signs at the dishwasher, toaster, coffee machine etc ...

Klipspringer

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#973059 23-Jan-2014 18:08

andrewNZ: How about a Peter Reader reply like.

Doing your own electrical work?
Here’s a few basic things you should know.

You must be the owner of the property or equipment. If you’re not, you can't do any electrical work on it.
You're not allowed to work on anything live.
All work done and equipment used has to comply with all the current regulations.
If you're replacing something, the replacement has to be basically the same. You can't replace single sockets with doubles, or put a bigger water heater element in.
See http://www.ewrb.govt.nz/ for more detail.
And a few safety tips:

If you don't know how to do something, ask a properly trained professional before you start.
Turning off a switch does not guarantee something is off.
Most cheap testers are not suitable for mains work. Use a good quality tester, your life depends on it.

If there was ever a need for a "-1" button this is it. If I had to see something like this on geekzone I would be out of here, ha and some of you would probably appreciate that. ;-)

andrewNZ

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#973060 23-Jan-2014 18:11

So what about dropping the safety bit? then you're just left with some solid advice...

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ubergeeknz

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#973065 23-Jan-2014 18:17

andrewNZ: So what about dropping the safety bit? then you're just left with some solid advice...

I think the safety bit should stay, just because people are not knowledgeable about electrical safety doesn't mean they deserve to die IMO, or necessarily that they are stupid.

gregmcc

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#973070 23-Jan-2014 18:33

KiwiNZ: What can you do? There is a limited amount of electrical work you can do when it comes to wiring in your own home. This is listed in regulation 64 of the Electricity (safety) Regulations 2010 and includes:
Replacing switches,
socket outlets,
lamp holders,
ceiling roses,
water heater switches,
thermostats and elements.
Repairing light fittings.
Moving, repairing or replacing flexible cords connected to permanently connected outlets or ceiling roses.
Disconnecting and reconnecting permanently wired appliances.
Moving switches, sockets and lighting outlets, but only if they are wired with tough plastic-sheathed cables.
Installing, extending, or altering any cables (except the main cables that come from the street to your switchboard).
You have to get the finished job checked and tested by a licensed electrical inspector. You cannot connect your work to the electricity supply yourself. The inspector will connect it, test it, and issue you with a Certificate of Compliance (see below) if it complies with safety requirements. Fitting plugs, cord extension sockets or appliance connectors to a flexible cord.
Replacing fuse wires and fuse cartridges. Repairing appliances.

http://consumerbuild.org.nz/publish/diy/diylegal-electrical.php

Remember that this guide is now 4 years old.

An interesting fact, any electrical work now either requires and electrical safety certificate or a certificate of compliance.

It's a bit of a mess because the rules say "any electrical work" which technically would mean that your auto electrician should issue a ESC, Security alarm installers should issue a ESC, phone/data/comms tech should issuse a ESC.

this is where common sense should kick in, a lot of people 'think' they know what they are doing, but have no understanding of current regs and best practice's, or any clue about calculating cable sizes, prospective short circuit current, earth loop impedance testing and a whole lot of other pescribed tests that must be carried out when work is done.

DarthKermit

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#973072 23-Jan-2014 18:49

gregmcc: It's a bit of a mess because the rules say "any electrical work" which technically would mean that your auto electrician should issue a ESC, Security alarm installers should issue a ESC, phone/data/comms tech should issuse a ESC.

Is this also required for extra low voltage? EG, a car's 12 volt systems?

Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?

andrewNZ

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#973083 23-Jan-2014 19:03

I'm open to being proved wrong greg, but my understanding is a safety certificate is only required for prescribed electrical work. This eliminates compliant home owners work.

Regualtion 74A Electrical safety certification
After prescribed electrical work on an installation or part installation is complete, the person who completed the work must issue an electrical safety certificate for the installation or part installation

Klipspringer

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#973084 23-Jan-2014 19:04

ubergeeknz:
andrewNZ: So what about dropping the safety bit? then you're just left with some solid advice...

I think the safety bit should stay, just because people are not knowledgeable about electrical safety doesn't mean they deserve to die IMO, or necessarily that they are stupid.

Well that could then be said about anything really.

I'm not very knowledgeable about chemistry. I don't go drinking or mixing and shaking different chemicals. Stupid people do stupid things and its probably best we let life just take care of it without trying to regulate and apply rules to everything.

freitasm

BDFL - Memuneh
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#973085 23-Jan-2014 19:08

Klipspringer: If there was ever a need for a "-1" button this is it. If I had to see something like this on geekzone I would be out of here, ha and some of you would probably appreciate that. ;-)

No, no, no. Just because the site name is "Geekzone" doesn't mean EVERY SINGLE VISITOR to the site is a geek, or have high knowledge of electronics, computing, etc.

Our demographics vary quite wildly and the number of visitors we have landing here from search engines is huge. These people AREN'T GEEKS and we should make sure everyone get the information they seek but also give sound advice.

DarthKermit

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#973086 23-Jan-2014 19:08

Klipspringer:
andrewNZ: How about a Peter Reader reply like.

Doing your own electrical work?
Here’s a few basic things you should know.

You must be the owner of the property or equipment. If you’re not, you can't do any electrical work on it.
You're not allowed to work on anything live.
All work done and equipment used has to comply with all the current regulations.
If you're replacing something, the replacement has to be basically the same. You can't replace single sockets with doubles, or put a bigger water heater element in.
See http://www.ewrb.govt.nz/ for more detail.
And a few safety tips:

If you don't know how to do something, ask a properly trained professional before you start.
Turning off a switch does not guarantee something is off.
Most cheap testers are not suitable for mains work. Use a good quality tester, your life depends on it.

If there was ever a need for a "-1" button this is it. If I had to see something like this on geekzone I would be out of here, ha and some of you would probably appreciate that. ;-)

Hey what about that stupid person in the USA who spilled hot McDonalds coffee on her lap and won millions when she sued them for not having a warning stating that it was HOT? On second thought, maybe she wasn't stupid. Got millions for her silly act.

Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?

gregmcc

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#973087 23-Jan-2014 19:09

andrewNZ: I'm open to being proved wrong greg, but my understanding is a safety certificate is only required for prescribed electrical work. This eliminates compliant home owners work.

Regualtion 74A Electrical safety certification
After prescribed electrical work on an installation or part installation is complete, the person who completed the work must issue an electrical safety certificate for the installation or part installation

You may just be right on that........

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