Woman duped into sending nearly $1million overseas in a romance scam

Forums › Off topic › Woman duped into sending nearly $1million overseas in a romance scam

1 | 2 | 3

28199 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2627358 28-Dec-2020 12:35

You also have to remember that people like this will not be all there, they will think its all a conspiracy to stop them being happy. They are probably not far off losing the remote or landline phone and starting to accuse people of stealing it.

Richard rich.ms

sbiddle

30853 posts

Uber Geek

Retired Mod

Trusted

Biddle Corp

Lifetime subscriber

#2627367 28-Dec-2020 12:54

mudguard:

It happened occasionally when I was at Westpac. I remember showing someone new the procedure for releasing telegraphic transfers, this happened at the end of the day. I was joking about how we have to check and make sure they're not sending them to Nigeria etc, when I came across one that was going to Nigeria! We delayed it one day, called the chap, investigated his account to see he'd been borrowing money to do it. In the end we let it go after he came in, in person to confirm. There wasn't anything we could do to stop it.

It's sad, but there isn't much more the bank can do. If they put stops in place it would have a cascading effect for those who had genuine reasons for sending money.

And it is worth pointing out that for any xfer over 10K whether it's international or even domestic depending on certain criteria that banks have to follow up anyway due to AML regulations.

larknz

1701 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Lifetime subscriber

#2627394 28-Dec-2020 14:11

richms:
You also have to remember that people like this will not be all there, they will think its all a conspiracy to stop them being happy. They are probably not far off losing the remote or landline phone and starting to accuse people of stealing it.

I think you are completely wrong being lonely doesn't mean you have dementia.

neb

11294 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2627408 28-Dec-2020 16:16

larknz: I think you are completely wrong being lonely doesn't mean you have dementia.

It's not dementia, it's what a friend of mine called "being an eighty-year-old". Having a number of older relatives, some of them can get a bit funny over things without any of them having dementia. I haven't experienced it directly but have heard several stories from them of friends where their children have had to step in to prevent self-destructive behaviour brought on by gold-diggers. Having said that, there are at least two cases where the children more probably stepped in out of self-interest than from trying to protect a parent.

In any case, people in that age range often have impaired judgement. This is what makes them such popular targets for scammers, and as @richms pointed out, their children trying to protect them are seen as interfering or acting out of self-interest.

larknz

1701 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Lifetime subscriber

#2627451 28-Dec-2020 16:31

neb:
larknz: I think you are completely wrong being lonely doesn't mean you have dementia.

It's not dementia, it's what a friend of mine called "being an eighty-year-old". Having a number of older relatives, some of them can get a bit funny over things without any of them having dementia. I haven't experienced it directly but have heard several stories from them of friends where their children have had to step in to prevent self-destructive behaviour brought on by gold-diggers. Having said that, there are at least two cases where the children more probably stepped in out of self-interest than from trying to protect a parent.

In any case, people in that age range often have impaired judgement. This is what makes them such popular targets for scammers, and as @richms pointed out, their children trying to protect them are seen as interfering or acting out of self-interest.

Except that the woman in this case is in her sixties and still working.

frankv

5680 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#2627452 28-Dec-2020 16:31

quickymart:

Reminded me of this story a while ago. The children were trying to help but their father had basically cut them off, believing in the scammer's lies as gospel.

Yeah, it is standard scammer tactics to sow distrust of family members. For whatever reason, the transaction & relationship must be kept secret. And, when the victim gets an inkling of what's happening, the embarrassment at being sucked in means they (a) off their own bat try to hide it from their children/spouse/whatever, and (b) try to recoup their losses with the help of "lawyers" and "policemen" and "the CIA" in Nigeria. Inevitably there are fees involved...

Many years ago, I met face-to-face with a (50ish, respected member of the community, tradesperson) guy who had been taken for $620K. An old & trusted friend of his in NZ got an email looking for people to invest in South Africa, and mentioned it to him. He had just sold his house. Details are hazy, but his story was that he loaned the money to the friend (with no paperwork) for her to invest. She said that she wasn't involved in the transaction, but OTOH she had gone to Jo'burg and met with the "lawyer", and had sent photos of him. (She was lucky not to get murdered herself, I've got to say). You can immediately see that the whole truth is not being told. My guy had also been taken on the "lawyer to recover your money" ride, and also was looking into suing the trusted friend to get the loan back. Desperate attempts to escape the loss, whilst concealing it from family and friends.

[Edit: pre anti-money-laundering days, over 15 years ago]

neb

11294 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2627455 28-Dec-2020 16:44

larknz: Except that the woman in this case is in her sixties and still working.

I was commenting on the more general issue that came up of older lonely people being easy targets for scammers.

Sharesies

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

neb

11294 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2627456 28-Dec-2020 16:47

frankv: My guy had also been taken on the "lawyer to recover your money" ride, and also was looking into suing the trusted friend to get the loan back. Desperate attempts to escape the loss, whilst concealing it from family and friends.

Friend of mine's father got taken in by scammers as well. After he (the friend) cancelled all his father's credit cards and locked accounts and whatnot, the scammers came back saying they were law enforcement and would help him catch the scammers, they just needed access to his credit cards and bank accounts to help track them down. Luckily the son was still there cleaning up the mess and stopped his father from giving them the account info.

larknz

1701 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Lifetime subscriber

#2627457 28-Dec-2020 16:48

neb:
larknz: Except that the woman in this case is in her sixties and still working.

I was commenting on the more general issue that came up of older lonely people being easy targets for scammers.

I don't disagree with your comment, my wife works in a retirement village and is aware of a number of cases.
However this case is different.

quickymart

13974 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

#2682327 29-Mar-2021 09:26

Another case where the person scammed thinks the bank should have stopped her - but they tried to! Not the bank's fault.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300264106/scam-victim-says-bank-didnt-do-enough-to-stop-her-losing-80k

networkn

Networkn
32363 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2682331 29-Mar-2021 09:36

I don't think it's the banks fault, though to be honest, I do think it's not unreasonable to consider whether some non-invasive safeguards could be implemented.

I think loneliness is a terrible thing, it's like grief, it affects you in ways you can't really comprehend unless you have known the deep emptiness and desolation it can cause.

I honestly feel very sorry for these people.

I have a friend, in his 60's now. He isn't much to look at and has had really no luck with love most of his life. He is a nice man, but lacks social graces. He has an overseas 'girlfriend'. He knows what's up with it, she is after his money, but he makes plenty, doesn't have anyone else to spend it on, and she is meeting his needs in a variety of ways. He has sent quite a lot of money overseas, more than I could ever justify, but it's his money and he is aware. I have a client in a similar boat.

People can be quick to judge harshly, I feel that's a sad indictment of our society.

I am also not sure what the fix is honestly. Where the line gets crossed is very murky, it's a very complex social construct.

frankv

5680 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#2682526 29-Mar-2021 14:27

networkn:

I don't think it's the banks fault, though to be honest, I do think it's not unreasonable to consider whether some non-invasive safeguards could be implemented.

When I've done some unusual transaction such as sending money overseas or buying a car, the bank calls me and checks that it is actually me doing the transaction. This isn't something I've asked for, but I'm happy that it's there. Presumably, their banks would have done the same for the victims above?

But perhaps the banks & credit card providers could offer tiers of protection that the consumer can opt out of... if you're confident, scam-aware, and often transact large sums of money, you could opt out entirely. If you're an average person, you could opt out of the most onerous tier which might include:

a friendly person to warn the victim about love scams and Nigerian princes when a dubious transaction is detected
a cool-down period before money is sent overseas
a notification to a nominated friend/family member about any dubious transactions
a notification to a nominated friend/family member before opting out of this tier

Conversely, a caring person might assist their suggestible nana to opt-in to that layer.

So the scammer has to persuade their victim to go through some rigmarole, including warning someone caring, before they can access any money. The target still has full control over their money and finances, but with a bit of support.

networkn

Networkn
32363 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2682528 29-Mar-2021 14:35

frankv:

When I've done some unusual transaction such as sending money overseas or buying a car, the bank calls me and checks that it is actually me doing the transaction. This isn't something I've asked for, but I'm happy that it's there. Presumably, their banks would have done the same for the victims above?

But perhaps the banks & credit card providers could offer tiers of protection that the consumer can opt out of... if you're confident, scam-aware, and often transact large sums of money, you could opt out entirely. If you're an average person, you could opt out of the most onerous tier which might include:

a friendly person to warn the victim about love scams and Nigerian princes when a dubious transaction is detected
a cool-down period before money is sent overseas
a notification to a nominated friend/family member about any dubious transactions
a notification to a nominated friend/family member before opting out of this tier
Conversely, a caring person might assist their suggestible nana to opt-in to that layer.

So the scammer has to persuade their victim to go through some rigmarole, including warning someone caring, before they can access any money. The target still has full control over their money and finances, but with a bit of support.

As others have alluded to, age can take away your independence which can cause the aged to become defensive or protective, even when the approach is done out of love. No-one loves to admit when they are duped, and add to this the weight that if they admit it, they may have more independence removed, then it's really a hell of a situation. We talk to our older clients about it outside of an event where possible. I too have had calls about 'suspicious' transactions which I appreciate the extra layer of protection. There probably isn't enough information to accurately determine if this woman was genuinely unaware she was being scammed as the protest is coming from a third party. If the bank had called and warned her, would she have insisted anyway? I guess if that occurred then the third party wouldn't have been so upset, who knows.

I don't think you can prevent this entirely sadly, people still must have free choice, even if we consider those choices bad, and it's unfortunate the consequences of this, in this instance are so huge.

There is a special place in hell I like to think, for the people who prey on the elderly.

eracode

Smpl Mnmlst
8875 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Subscriber

#2682551 29-Mar-2021 14:40

quickymart:

Another case where the person scammed thinks the bank should have stopped her - but they tried to! Not the bank's fault.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300264106/scam-victim-says-bank-didnt-do-enough-to-stop-her-losing-80k

Unlike some of the scam cases discussed in this thread where some sympathy has been expressed for elderly or lonely people and so on, this case has nothing to do with loneliness and romance - seems to be a simple case of gullibility and/or greed. She lied to bank about the reason for the funds transfer. The story doesn’t even say she is elderly. Don’t think this case deserves any sympathy and she had a cheek to blame the bank.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

neb

11294 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2682553 29-Mar-2021 14:43

eracode:
Unlike some of the scam cases discussed in this thread where some sympathy has been expressed for lonely people and so on, this case has nothing to do with loneliness and romance - seems to be a simple case of gullibility and/or greed. Don’t think this case deserves any sympathy and she had a cheek to blame the bank.

She also went out of her way to evade the bank's attempts to prevent this sort of thing. So yeah, I'm not feeling much sympathy there, and more controls wouldn't have helped since she'd just have evaded those as well.

1 | 2 | 3