Interesting video about Brexit

Forums › Off topic › Interesting video about Brexit

1 | ... | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | ... | 38

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580700 26-Jun-2016 21:49

mattwnz:
Rikkitic:

It is fascinating to see how this plays out. Is it possible that Parliament could legislate to invalidate the result in view of the reactions? Would they even have to, since the referendum wasn't binding? With enough public support, could they not say it was in the national interest to ignore the result or to hold a second vote?

I suspect at least some who voted to leave probably thought they were just casting a protest vote against the government. That seems to be indicated by some of the responses. How could they be so stupid, indeed?

With the pm resigning that would be unlikely to happen. They will just have to live with it. Maybe they can negotiate with them and get a better deal.

Unsure, Brussels wants them out pronto, France said there will be consequences.

Common sense tells us this is a big deal, its just a referendum, not binding, the political fiasco should have held the reins, seen what developed over the first few days, hindsight is easy, yes. But particularly with a narrow result. A very small win is still a mandate, but its a big deal, bigger than any UK election. Its fine to have a Govt scrape in with a 50.5% mandate, but thats JUST an election, EEC, EU, they are a long term membership.

Batman

Mad Scientist
30015 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6217

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580704 26-Jun-2016 21:52

France said?

I thought France wants out too. Just like every other EU nation. A successful Brexit will trigger the collapse of the EU slowly but surely.

PhantomNVD

2619 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 759
Inactive user

#1580708 26-Jun-2016 22:00

While some may indeed have cast a "protest vote", they got what they voted for anyway, and although 2% sounds close, it was won by nearly 1.5 million votes... Realistically, how many people who bothered to register and turn up to vote really thought it wasn't possible to win? More likely is "buyers remorse" TBH...

Also, the 2million online petitioners for a recite would need to be nearer 17 million to actually matter... Seriously, if 16 million REGISTERED voters already voted remain, these 'nearly 3 million' are not even 20% of the actual Remain camp in the real election.

IMHO (and many politicians are quoted as saying so too)

There IS no going back from this.

tdgeek

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580709 26-Jun-2016 22:01

joker97: France said?

I thought France wants out too. Just like every other EU nation. A successful Brexit will trigger the collapse of the EU slowly but surely.

France has said recently that there would be "consequences" for Britain if it left the EU.

Source, www.theweek.co.nz on the pros and cons of leaving

That and the now desire by Brussels to get them out as soon as possible seems to me like hardball, sour grapes. Perhaps a non direct message to other countries, to avoid others considering leaving.

tdgeek

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580710 26-Jun-2016 22:06

Had visitors today, one Englishman who left 8 months ago to NZ. He favoured leaving, his issue is the relentless immigration. NHS can't keep up, and the infrastructure. These immigrants arent filling spaces for needed jobs, many go onto benefits.

Batman

Mad Scientist
30015 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6217

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580711 26-Jun-2016 22:09

tdgeek:

Had visitors today, one Englishman who left 8 months ago to NZ. He favoured leaving, his issue is the relentless immigration. NHS can't keep up, and the infrastructure. These immigrants arent filling spaces for needed jobs, many go onto benefits.

I read on the Herald (shock!) that 3% of people pay 24% of the taxes, and another massive percentage get more in tax credits than they pay in tax in NZ.

Well if the tax system is to dish out free money I wouldn't blame people helping themselves. Why can't they just change their free money rules .. ok I better stop, this is a very complex scenario - social support is important. *gulp

Samsung

Shop now on Samsung phones, tablets, TVs and more (affiliate link).

SJB

2945 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2287
Inactive user

#1580713 26-Jun-2016 22:22

joker97: France said?

I thought France wants out too. Just like every other EU nation. A successful Brexit will trigger the collapse of the EU slowly but surely.

The far right in France may want a vote but I can't see the general population voting for frexit. They are too immersed in European culture. And the far right in Holland have called for a referendum too but they have very little general support.

In years to come things might change but I can't see anyone else trying to leave for the foreseeable future.

alexx

867 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 291

#1580714 26-Jun-2016 22:26

mattwnz:
Rikkitic:

It is fascinating to see how this plays out. Is it possible that Parliament could legislate to invalidate the result in view of the reactions? Would they even have to, since the referendum wasn't binding? With enough public support, could they not say it was in the national interest to ignore the result or to hold a second vote?

I suspect at least some who voted to leave probably thought they were just casting a protest vote against the government. That seems to be indicated by some of the responses. How could they be so stupid, indeed?

With the pm resigning that would be unlikely to happen. They will just have to live with it. Maybe they can negotiate with them and get a better deal.

The next PM could be on a hiding to nothing.

Decide to ignore the referendum and you have almost 52% of the voters angry that you overrode their democratic rights. Most of them are older people who turn out to every election and won't forgive you.

Be the one to invoke article 50 and you're going to be remembered as the one to blame, by the more than 48% who voted to Remain. Those people are mostly young and could be voting against you in every election until you retire from politics.

if it turns out bad and you don't deliver the things that were promised, the ones that voted Leave will punish you at the next election too.

#include <standard.disclaimer>

networkn

Networkn
32876 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 15478

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580738 26-Jun-2016 22:41

Cameron was smart to resign. I think he would have been smarter to take the route I already mentioned which was to stick to his guns on the fact he said he wanted a decent margin. He should have said "it's too close to call on such an important issue. There is an election coming up, if you want to leave, vote in the party that will offer you that, and that IS binding".

Reality is that would have been a much MUCH better way to handle it for my money.

There is a way out of the Brexit mess, but I think they won't opt for that sadly.

Batman

Mad Scientist
30015 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6217

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580771 26-Jun-2016 23:03

alexx:

The next PM could be on a hiding to nothing.

Decide to ignore the referendum and you have almost 52% of the voters angry that you overrode their democratic rights. Most of them are older people who turn out to every election and won't forgive you.

Be the one to invoke article 50 and you're going to be remembered as the one to blame, by the more than 48% who voted to Remain. Those people are mostly young and could be voting against you in every election until you retire from politics.

if it turns out bad and you don't deliver the things that were promised, the ones that voted Leave will punish you at the next election too.

Don't worry, politics is a long term game with voters with short term memory. You have nothing to fear my friend.

Geektastic

18012 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 8470

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580772 26-Jun-2016 23:05

joker97:

tdgeek:

Had visitors today, one Englishman who left 8 months ago to NZ. He favoured leaving, his issue is the relentless immigration. NHS can't keep up, and the infrastructure. These immigrants arent filling spaces for needed jobs, many go onto benefits.

I read on the Herald (shock!) that 3% of people pay 24% of the taxes, and another massive percentage get more in tax credits than they pay in tax in NZ.

Well if the tax system is to dish out free money I wouldn't blame people helping themselves. Why can't they just change their free money rules .. ok I better stop, this is a very complex scenario - social support is important. *gulp

In essence, you cannot change the 'free money rules' unless you change them for everyone. i.e., you cannot say "Our citizens get this much but EU citizens from other EU nations get only 65% of that". It's against the rules.

Mighty Ape

Shop now at Mighty Ape (affiliate link).

Geektastic

18012 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 8470

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580773 26-Jun-2016 23:08

SJB:

joker97: France said?

I thought France wants out too. Just like every other EU nation. A successful Brexit will trigger the collapse of the EU slowly but surely.

The far right in France may want a vote but I can't see the general population voting for frexit. They are too immersed in European culture. And the far right in Holland have called for a referendum too but they have very little general support.

In years to come things might change but I can't see anyone else trying to leave for the foreseeable future.

Not sure. A poll recently said around 60% wanted out.

I can't see France - or Germany for that matter - going, because if they do, the whole thing is toast.

Better that they had left it as a common trade block and forgotten all about their Utopian dreams.

networkn

Networkn
32876 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 15478

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580798 26-Jun-2016 23:26

What I don't get is that other than the immigration issue they really benefit no way unless I am mistaken. They would have been better to identify that as a key thing and approached brussels about some way to limit immigration through the EU. Or is that not possible? I would imagine they would have been able to use exiting the EU as a big stick in negotiations.

I believe that the EU is stronger than the UK and the EU intends to make Britan sorry for it's lack of forethought and vision.

tdgeek

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#1580802 27-Jun-2016 00:09

networkn:

What I don't get is that other than the immigration issue they really benefit no way unless I am mistaken. They would have been better to identify that as a key thing and approached brussels about some way to limit immigration through the EU. Or is that not possible? I would imagine they would have been able to use exiting the EU as a big stick in negotiations.

I believe that the EU is stronger than the UK and the EU intends to make Britan sorry for it's lack of forethought and vision.

I gather from my visitor today that the crowding in the UK is bad. 65 million in country a bit smaller than NZ. His real world experience is that everything you do is too many people, and thats aside form the health service and infrastructure not keeping up, and the wanderers going onto benefits. While immigration is but one topic, and there are others, its perhaps a huge topic for them. Less so for the well off who don't have to live in that crowded environment. The more I read, the more I see its UK living in two ways. As the UK, where they have lost some control over their destiny, and as part of one big country, EU, where asking for immigration rules is perhaps a no go, as in many ways they are provinces of the EU. .I agree with GK, it should have remained as a free trade region, and not a Utopia. You cant manage all that and keep everyone happy, or vaguely satisfied.

alexx

867 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 291

#1580803 27-Jun-2016 00:12

joker97:

alexx:

The next PM could be on a hiding to nothing.

Decide to ignore the referendum and you have almost 52% of the voters angry that you overrode their democratic rights. Most of them are older people who turn out to every election and won't forgive you.

Be the one to invoke article 50 and you're going to be remembered as the one to blame, by the more than 48% who voted to Remain. Those people are mostly young and could be voting against you in every election until you retire from politics.

if it turns out bad and you don't deliver the things that were promised, the ones that voted Leave will punish you at the next election too.

Don't worry, politics is a long term game with voters with short term memory. You have nothing to fear my friend.

I'm not sure about that. Are you suggesting that there is no long term animosity towards Tony Blair?

Tony Blair was last decade.

For another example search for: Margaret Thatcher death celebrations

#include <standard.disclaimer>

1 | ... | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | ... | 38