Home security camera seeing neighbour's property

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chevrolux

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#2073144 14-Aug-2018 10:28

No idea if it is illegal. But definitely plain rude.

Tell your friend to not be a nosey sh1t, mind his own business, and re-position the camera so you can't see the neighbors property.

You can aim cameras to simply follow a fence line, or have the top of the image stop at the gate. It will still catch someone climbing the fence/gate and you aren't encroaching and peoples privacy.

tdgeek

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#2073145 14-Aug-2018 10:29

tripper1000:

The essence of the question is what, if anything, is allowed to be filmed on CCTV other than your own property. It's a straight forward question and doesn't take a $350 p/h lawyer to answer it. Magnitude of the act is irrelevant if evidence is inadmissible. Maybe you need to call the cops and ask. They're pretty straight up and aren't going to charge people for minor breaches of CCTV rules.

Watching thread with interest as I'm thinking about recording the cars parked on the public road in front of my house due to repeated break-ins.

Its about breaching privacy, the privacy that an individual would expect in their own property. The street is a public place, I imagine record whatever you like, but if there is a 1.8 metre fence in view, that it can't record behind that (if CCTV was high it might) or house windows, which might be an issue. Asking those with viewable windows might be wise. If one is kitchen, over the road and down a bit, most would not mind, especially if its a street security camera (others also benefit)

Fred99

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#2073147 14-Aug-2018 10:34

tdgeek:

tripper1000:

The essence of the question is what, if anything, is allowed to be filmed on CCTV other than your own property. It's a straight forward question and doesn't take a $350 p/h lawyer to answer it. Magnitude of the act is irrelevant if evidence is inadmissible. Maybe you need to call the cops and ask. They're pretty straight up and aren't going to charge people for minor breaches of CCTV rules.

Watching thread with interest as I'm thinking about recording the cars parked on the public road in front of my house due to repeated break-ins.

Its about breaching privacy, the privacy that an individual would expect in their own property. The street is a public place, I imagine record whatever you like, but if there is a 1.8 metre fence in view, that it can't record behind that (if CCTV was high it might) or house windows, which might be an issue. Asking those with viewable windows might be wise. If one is kitchen, over the road and down a bit, most would not mind, especially if its a street security camera (others also benefit)

The way I read what the OP said, it ("the alleged criminal act") was on the frontage/berm, where the neighbour shouldn't have had any expectation of privacy, probably wouldn't sunbathe naked and could probably be arrested for something if they did.

tdgeek

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#2073151 14-Aug-2018 10:45

Fred99:

tdgeek:

tripper1000:

The essence of the question is what, if anything, is allowed to be filmed on CCTV other than your own property. It's a straight forward question and doesn't take a $350 p/h lawyer to answer it. Magnitude of the act is irrelevant if evidence is inadmissible. Maybe you need to call the cops and ask. They're pretty straight up and aren't going to charge people for minor breaches of CCTV rules.

Watching thread with interest as I'm thinking about recording the cars parked on the public road in front of my house due to repeated break-ins.

Its about breaching privacy, the privacy that an individual would expect in their own property. The street is a public place, I imagine record whatever you like, but if there is a 1.8 metre fence in view, that it can't record behind that (if CCTV was high it might) or house windows, which might be an issue. Asking those with viewable windows might be wise. If one is kitchen, over the road and down a bit, most would not mind, especially if its a street security camera (others also benefit)

The way I read what the OP said, it ("the alleged criminal act") was on the frontage/berm, where the neighbour shouldn't have had any expectation of privacy, probably wouldn't sunbathe naked and could probably be arrested for something if they did.

Agree

"neighbours' property/frontage" So, property no, frontage yes, assuming frontage is berm. If its the front lawn, no or low fence, maybe a grey area as its still private but viewable by the public

robfish

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#2073178 14-Aug-2018 11:08

As mentioned earlier, this camera peripheral view can see a small part of an un-fenced front yard. It does not "point to' the neighbouring property nor is motion detected outside the "detection zone" so recordings are only made when motion is detected on the owner's property.

My question has been answered (Thanks https://www.geekzone.co.nz/user_public.asp?user_id=74702 and https://www.geekzone.co.nz/user_public.asp?user_id=29761)

Rob

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#2073193 14-Aug-2018 11:13

I think we are all curious about the illegal act!

robfish

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#2073219 14-Aug-2018 11:40

To be honest, I reworded it to "illegal" to try to get an answer to my question about the camera.

The act was to dump a locked steel box on my friend's property. My friend simply handed it over to the police without knowing the contents.

Rob

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tripper1000

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#2073307 14-Aug-2018 14:50

Seems like kosher footage as it films an act occurring on his property (dumping over the fence). I'm sure if the box contains something of interest to the police they'll come back and be keen to view the footage.

dejadeadnz

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#2073490 14-Aug-2018 20:22

tripper1000:

The essence of the question is what, if anything, is allowed to be filmed on CCTV other than your own property. It's a straight forward question and doesn't take a $350 p/h lawyer to answer it.

Guess what? I am a lawyer, I do this kind of thing for my job; the privacy officer (another lawyer) of my work (a listed company) and I pondered an issue which on the face of it was quite similar to the OP's and decided there wasn't a simple and absolute answer. A highly regarded partner at a specialist law firm also agreed with us.

We evidently aren't as smart as you. The other thing to remember is that the Privacy Commissioner's office is not a judicial body. Most of their guidelines (however well written and informed they usually are), simply through the nature of a lot of privacy issues that don't touch on the criminal law sphere being rarely tested in court, cannot be treated as the definitive, final word.

Edit: I also would not venture any firm opinions based on the vagueness of the OP's question.

tripper1000

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#2073708 15-Aug-2018 09:36

Thanks for contributing to the thread. My takeaway is that imprecision and the grey areas are fertile ground for the judiciary.

There are clearly defined rules on where I can put a fence and where I can park my car. It is not unreasonable to expect similar rules for where you can erect and direct cameras. It seems that for the sake of efficiency this needs to be defined in law more precisely but it will have to be driven from outside of judiciary due to the financial conflict of interest.

I never claimed to have an answer (quite the opposite) so I never asserted that I was smarted than a $350 p/h lawyer. My mistake was to assume a $350 p/w lawyer would have the answer and you have clarified that they don't. So technically speaking rather than me claiming I am smarter than a lawyer, a lawyer is claiming to be as ignorant as I.

afe66

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#2073725 15-Aug-2018 10:08

Mmm but the lawyer is informed ignorance with understanding of background issues and processes.

Dratsab

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#2073861 15-Aug-2018 12:54

tdgeek: If one is kitchen, over the road and down a bit, most would not mind, especially if its a street security camera (others also benefit)

This is a bit off topic but I smirked a little at this comment as it reminded of a conversation I had a number of years ago with a chap who lived in a cul-de-sac in the Wellington suburb of Khandallah. Said chap had installed CCTV on his house and one camera pointed along his driveway and covered part of the road. As a result of its positioning it also covered a part of one neighbours property. That neighbour went to see the chap just after the CCTV was installed and *demanded* to know what the camera covered. Apparently he got quite angry when he was shown and insisted the camera angle be moved to not cover any of his property. The chap complied and moved the camera to cover only the majority of his driveway. A few weeks later the arrogant neighbour was burgled and went to see the chap and asked what images of the burglars had been captured, only to be laughed at and told none.

coffeebaron

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#2073880 15-Aug-2018 14:03

robfish:
To be honest, I reworded it to "illegal" to try to get an answer to my question about the camera.

The act was to dump a locked steel box on my friend's property. My friend simply handed it over to the police without knowing the contents.

So your neighbour is your friend? If so, and their happy to have your camera pointing their way a bit, then there is no issue.

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robfish

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#2073882 15-Aug-2018 14:13

The "culprit" is my friend's neighbour (in another neighbourhood).

My neighbours are also my friends who, incidentally, like the idea of my cameras monitoring as much of our neigbourhood as possible.

Rob

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#2073894 15-Aug-2018 14:56

One of my neighbours a few doors up has several cameras monitoring the area in front of his garage. I know they cover the footpath past our place and have no problem with that.

The times that cars have been broken into it was as if the crims knew precisely how to avoid having their faces in view. They walked past our place looking down then turned and walked backwards to the vehicles near the cameras.

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