Smart wiring

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andrew027

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#177571 7-Aug-2015 06:57

After a few months of upheaval we have finally sold our house and bought a new one. The house we bought has "smart wiring", which was emphasised as a big selling point by the real estate agent, until I started asking questions and he really had no idea what it was and what it was for. Now we've gone unconditional I was hoping to get up to the house to take a couple of detailed pictures but instead the agent sent me this one shot, so for now it's all I have.

It looks like panel on the right is communications - the white BT box in the middle has ADSL written on it and there are two banks of six RJ45 looking ports, and I know there RJ45 ports in most rooms in the house. Will I need any other equipment, other than the standard Spark modem/router I have, to take advantage of all this?

There also seems to be a co-ax splitter, presumably directing the one cable from the TV aerial on the roof to some different rooms.

As for the panel on the left - I don't know what that is. There are three fans at the top labelled LON ONE, LON TWO and LON THREE and three boxes on the right side labelled RON ONE, RON TWO and RON THREE. If anyone can tell me what all this is for that would be great!

Also, in at least two rooms, there are bundles of wires coming out of the wall, all wrapped up with twist ties as though they're waiting for something to be connected. They look like a number (maybe half a dozen in each bundle) of low grade speaker wires, but my initial thought was that if it was audio they would terminate at speaker connections or RCA sockets, rather than just have wires poking out of the wall. I wanted to get some pictures of these, but the agent hasn't sent any. Does this ring any bells with anyone?

I'm hoping to get to talk to the people selling the house, but they're currently overseas, and I'll be overseas myself in a week so thought I'd start with the wealth of knowledge on GZ first...

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#1360423 7-Aug-2015 07:31

The right hand side looks to be "real" home automation. Although I have no idea about this specific type.
I'd guess you can program it so the bathroom light turns on with the kitchen lightswitch.

For the left. You'll need a few patch cables to connect your router to the appropriate ports. If you want to use them all, or your router isn't gigabit, you'll need a basic network switch too.

For what it's worth, someone has done a very nice job.

davidcole

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#1360424 7-Aug-2015 07:32

The wiring looks like speaker wire rather than network/data/tv - options could be Home automation? Are there any sensors or other gizmos for turning on lights, opening curtains or anything like that?

Or is it alarm components?

I can't guess what the fans are for, something that either does some processing, or gets hot, and those things in the middle, they look like connectors, but does it have radiators for heat dissipation?

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andrew027

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#1360429 7-Aug-2015 08:14

Regarding LON 1/2/3 in the left panel, a bit of googling suggests this is could be Local Operating Network ("a networking platform...built on a protocol created by Echelon Corporation for networking devices over media such as twisted pair, power lines, fibre optics and RF. It is used for the automation of various functions within buildings such as lighting and HVAC." - Wikipedia). So my brain makes the not necessarily logical leap to RON 1/2/3 being Remote Operating Network.

andrewNZ: The right hand side looks to be "real" home automation. Although I have no idea about this specific type.
I'd guess you can program it so the bathroom light turns on with the kitchen lightswitch.

At the first open home we went to, there certainly were a couple of light switches we pressed that didn't seem to do anything. Perhaps they were doing something, just not in that room?

Jaxson

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#1360430 7-Aug-2015 08:18

Yep that's quite an industrial installation you have there. All nicely terminated down the left hand side too.

Looks like it's fairly nicely labelled, so can you get some better quality close up photos of the devices, the labelling, any brand name reference etc please?

andrew027

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#1360443 7-Aug-2015 08:28

Jaxson: Looks like it's fairly nicely labelled, so can you get some better quality close up photos of the devices, the labelling, any brand name reference etc please?

At the moment this one grainy pic is all I have. It's unlikely I'm going to be able to get up to the new house for at least another couple of days, and that's assuming I can get access as we don't settle until mid-September.

I hope this house comes with a manual!

andrew027

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#1360460 7-Aug-2015 08:53

I did manage to find this picture, that I cropped from one of the photos of the master bedroom that was online when the house was still being advertised. It's not very good, but apart from the picture already posted it's all I have for now. It shows the "bundles of wires" coming through the wall:

Although obscured by a stool, the wires come out of the middle plate on the wall (between the double power point on the left and the TV antenna socket on the right). The plate has a convex grey cover that's open at the bottom, and the wires come out of this opening. The current owner has put the bundle into a white cotton bag that you can just see under the stool. I did pull the wires out of this bag but there's no device or any kind of terminating on the end, just the cut off wires.

Jaxson

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#1360589 7-Aug-2015 10:59

Initial guess is lighting control.

Top wires in look to be power to the individual modules.

Look to be hot having fans on them, and then heavy heat sinks on the lower ones.
Think the labels say room one, room two.

LONworks is a building controls communication protocol, but RON isn't so I don't think it's that

I tried running enhance in photoshop but it didn't work.

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mdooher

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#1360592 7-Aug-2015 11:10

It is really hard to tell from that photo, But the layout looks like a KNX system, do you have a photo of any of the switches?

Matthew

andrew027

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#1360629 7-Aug-2015 12:20

mdooher: It is really hard to tell from that photo, But the layout looks like a KNX system, do you have a photo of any of the switches?

Do you mean the light, etc. switches around the house?

Again, until I can get back up to the house all I have is what the agent sent me (which is just the first photo) and what I can pull off the photos that were on open2view before the house was taken off the market. Here are some switches cropped out of the marketing shots - the one on the left is in a bathroom, just inside the door, and the one on the right (zoomed in) is in a hallway, just at the top of some stairs. They are all soft-touch buttons and the dark spots at the top of each button have LEDs behind them that glow red when the switch is pressed. I'm not sure what the larger circle is on the lower switches - a sensor of some kind perhaps?

andrew027

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#1360631 7-Aug-2015 12:29

Jaxson: Think the labels say room one, room two.

LONworks is a building controls communication protocol, but RON isn't so I don't think it's that

I tried running enhance in photoshop but it didn't work.

The labels on the boxes on the right side of the left panel definitely say RON ONE, RON TWO, RON THREE. I remember looking at them the very first time I was in the house for an open day (I wish I had taken pictures myself then, but I hadn't decided to buy the house at that point) and googling "LON RON" when I got home - all it came up with was entries for L Ron Hubbard, and Facebook and LinkedIn pages for some guy(s) named Ron Lon.

Excellent video, by the way!

mdooher

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#1360632 7-Aug-2015 12:29

andrew027:
mdooher: It is really hard to tell from that photo, But the layout looks like a KNX system, do you have a photo of any of the switches?

Do you mean the light, etc. switches around the house?

Again, until I can get back up to the house all I have is what the agent sent me (which is just the first photo) and what I can pull off the photos that were on open2view before the house was taken off the market. Here are some switches cropped out of the marketing shots - the one on the left is in a bathroom, just inside the door, and the one on the right (zoomed in) is in a hallway, just at the top of some stairs. They are all soft-touch buttons and the dark spots at the top of each button have LEDs behind them that glow red when the switch is pressed. I'm not sure what the larger circle is on the lower switches - a sensor of some kind perhaps?

It is really hard to tell, the switches look like they are momentary type with LED feedback. It appears both of those also have occupancy sensors built in.

I'm still suspecting KNX rather than an industrial PLC

Edit: each unit appears to have a blue two position molded plug. This is a standard for KNX network cabling. If it is KNK you are in for some fun. It is quite difficult to learn to program, and you need to buy the software but because it is a true standard you can get all sorts of things from various manufactures and it will work

Matthew

Jase2985

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#1360641 7-Aug-2015 13:08

yea its looking like a smart lighting system

Jaxson

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#1360658 7-Aug-2015 13:25

mdooher:

I'm still suspecting KNX rather than an industrial PLC

Oh agree, just saying it looks like a solid install job, rather than just some structured data cabling.
And quite professional cabinet layout, with nice terminations etc.

Personally, and work related I guess, I ensure I have a copy of the code for any such installation.
In there somewhere will be a processing component that runs some code to do different things with the outputs (most likely lighting related) based on inputs (your wall switches).
If you want to modify that in future, so two presses here turns off all the house lights etc, then you're in a much stronger position if you have a copy of the code yourself, and where it's not password protected.
- Even if you don't have the software or connection cables required to manipulate it yourself.

I know of instances where the homeowner has essentially been held to ransom as the original controls company installed the system as per their brief at the time, but retained the code and password protected the unit.
Any future alterations/additions etc required that company to be contacted to make the modifications.
In some cases the whole controller gets replaced with another unit, or another brand/model so that someone else can modify it.

Sorry if that sounds scary, just something to consider.
If it all works as you want it to right now then it's not an issue.

Zeon

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#1360698 7-Aug-2015 14:42

Looks like a pretty sweet setup and good quality work.

Speedtest 2019-10-14

gregmcc

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#1360717 7-Aug-2015 15:18

the cubical on the left looks like it's full of dimming control modules (the gold coloured heat sinks), looking at them, the red/black/white look like the common data bus linking each module, the reds look like power in from particular circuit, and out reds out to particular lights, with a common black (Neutral), looks like there are a couple of just on/off controls on the R/H side of each row.

best bet is some more detailed photos with make/model numbers of units

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