Formula 1 2022 Season Discussion

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#2959306 25-Aug-2022 13:48

Unfortunate for Ricciardo but he was probably always dead man walking when Zac Brown started offering every man and his dog a chance at an F1 seat. I'm sure the hefty payout from McLaren will soften the blow a little bit. Just remains to be seen if he still has the fire in the belly to find another seat, or whether any of the other teams will want to take a chance on him after the last couple of seasons.

Some people carry on like Piastri is the second coming of Fangio and, while his performance up until now has been pretty decent, it's an entirely different game in the big pool. It seems he's tied his wagon to the McLaren horse if all the rumours are to be believed. I hope for his sake he and Weber have made the right call. Norris is driving the wheels off a pretty average car, it remains an open question whether Piastri will be able to do the same.

Anyway, just looking for a dry FP1 session tomorrow night so that Lawson can show what he's got. The early talk is that the weather is going to be changeable at Spa this weekend, so hope the spectacle isn't ruined by rain. If Lawson does acquit himself well, it will give Tost and Marko food for thought with Tsunoda's seat still undecided.

tdgeek

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#2959317 25-Aug-2022 14:12

Piastri is fine. His record is better then most F3/F2 to F1 rookies. You can only win, but Ive not read about him being the second coming, its more like he is a proven winner, it just makes sense

Jaxson

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#2959335 25-Aug-2022 14:42

Stick him in a slow car and he'll still not be able to win.

Honestly I think we're at a point where it's 80%+ the car nowadays, and the 20% only comes into play when there is racing against others with similar performance machinery.

thermonuclear

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#2959347 25-Aug-2022 15:21

Jaxson:

Stick him in a slow car and he'll still not be able to win.

Honestly I think we're at a point where it's 80%+ the car nowadays, and the 20% only comes into play when there is racing against others with similar performance machinery.

I agree it's mostly the car and support team ability that largely determine results. As tdgeek rightly pointed out all you can do is win and Piastri has done that as I acknowledged. Nevertheless it's a ballsy move by him and his management to turn down the drive with Alpine and seemingly join McLaren when he hasn't raced a lap in anger at the top level yet.

There doesn't appear to be a lot to pick between the Alpine and McLaren currently and it's an unknown which team has the ability to improve and possibly get up into the top tier with RB, Ferrari and Merc. If Piastri has agreed a deal with McLaren, Woking have obviously impressed him and his management team with their plans moving forward. Or a longer deal, or more cash.

All yet to be determined though. I believe McLaren have said they won't announce Ricciardo's replacement immediately. Maybe still trying to settle terms with Alpine over Piastri? Maybe they think there is legal action coming from Alpine? Gotta love the silly season.

tdgeek

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#2959383 25-Aug-2022 16:30

Agree. I'd stick to a large proven performer in McLaren if I was given the drive. I just checked my mailbox, no offers as yet! :-)

Jaxson

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#2959407 25-Aug-2022 17:17

Yeah the Piastri move away from Alpine is quite a middle finger to a team that has supported you and from memory had to find you a place for next year (likely to have been Williams from memory).
I suspect they regret it all now, walking away from all of that when an Alpine seat would have been his after Alonso left just a little while after they'd decided to break away.

thermonuclear

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#2959408 25-Aug-2022 17:20

As someone who owns a Lando Norris hoodie and beanie, I agree that McLaren feels like the better option if you only had a choice of drive between them and Alpine. But Alonso has done pretty well in the '22 Alpine and had a fair share of bad luck in the season so far.

I'd need to have a closer look at Norris v Alonso to be sure though, my gut feeling is that the Alpine is pretty slippery in the right hands. Piastri could have slotted into that seat and looked a superstar versus Ocon. I think it will be harder for him to get over the top of Norris.

Of course, the biggest unknown (amongst many) is how good the 2023 cars will be for Alpine and McLaren. I think it's mostly agreed that the 2022 McLaren is a bit of a dog and great respect to Norris for getting the most out of it and keeping the battle close between them and Alpine.

If Piastri ends up at McLaren and their 2023 car is a decent improvement on this year's one, then he and Weber are going to look like geniuses. Only time for tell.

No, haven't had the email with a 1+1 deal either. Wouldn't mind Will Buxton's or perhaps even Martin Brundle's job ... though I think I'd need to be able to drive about 100k faster than I can for that!

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tdgeek

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#2959627 26-Aug-2022 07:05

thermonuclear:

I think it will be harder for him to get over the top of Norris.

He doesn't have to. A rookie, first time racing in F1, he has a year to go from 6/10 behind to 2/10 behind. If he was consistently 2/10 behind end of 2023, thats a win

Jaxson

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#2959694 26-Aug-2022 10:43

Bottom line is all teams need to provide a competitive car for them and their drivers to be competitive.
And their team needs to back that up with sensible strategy calls.

In terms of the teams championship, that means consistency mainly.
Mercedes had a radical car design this year that just didn't work, but they're still right up there by consistently bringing their shtbox car home.
Compare that to likes of Ferrari who were dominant initially, who have consistently thrown it away.

McLaren need to put their money where their mouth is as such, and deliver a product that can be driven to success.
This goes for all teams, giving talented drivers a car that can only ever hope to be driven around the middle or back of the grid won't win races, no matter how great the drivers are.

langi27

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#2959699 26-Aug-2022 11:06

Liam Lawson about to hit the big time with FP1 session at Alpha. Bet he is fizzing at the bung-hole. Hope he can post some respectable times. Dr Marko isn't one for giving out second chances. Its a sink or swim for Liam.

GV27

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#2959707 26-Aug-2022 11:25

Jaxson:

McLaren need to put their money where their mouth is as such, and deliver a product that can be driven to success.
This goes for all teams, giving talented drivers a car that can only ever hope to be driven around the middle or back of the grid won't win races, no matter how great the drivers are.

McLaren is a one-car team posing as a two-car operation and has been for some time.

Jaxson

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#2959712 26-Aug-2022 11:49

GV27:

McLaren is a one-car team posing as a two-car operation and has been for some time.

Care to elaborate, as without it we'll just be guessing what you're intending to convey here.

Definitely a car tailored in a particular way, and then honed to suit as best as possible one driver.
That could be said of most teams though really.

Able to individually adjust settings, but the core design likely includes performance behaviours that can't be removed via tuning adjustments.

Benoire

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#2959713 26-Aug-2022 11:54

I would say that right now the Mclaren is a 0 car team posing as two car op as the car is not suited to either driver at all well and has been doing the lead driver a considerable diservice.

GV27

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#2959763 26-Aug-2022 12:16

Jaxson:

Care to elaborate, as without it we'll just be guessing what you're intending to convey here.

Definitely a car tailored in a particular way, and then honed to suit as best as possible one driver.
That could be said of most teams though really.

Able to individually adjust settings, but the core design likely includes performance behaviours that can't be removed via tuning adjustments.

I'm talking where both drivers had the capability to show up at a weekend and regularly scrap for podiums on outright pace. Think DC/Mika, or LH/FA. Where the car was of a standard where both drivers could really do something with it, and it not merely be a one-driver benefit act.

The earliest back I can think is possibly 2010 although I'm conscious that Button at Albert Park shouldn't really count and they weren't really at the point end that much.

Pre-that, maybe Alonso and Hamilton? It's like they never really recovered from having the whole operation built around LH. Even now I'd say the car isn't specifically tailored to Lando but he's just able to make more of it, and I think having a car that neither one of your drivers can really make work is probably worse.

There's just a lot of the shades of the Williams decline, maybe McLaren are where they were at in the post-JPM era (ironically).

Bung

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#2959814 26-Aug-2022 14:58

Norris says the car isn't tailored for him in that he also has to adapt to its unpredictability.
"As a driver, you expect when you turn the wheel or do certain things, you feel like you should know exactly what’s going to happen, but that isn’t always the case. Sometimes you’d brake less and the car rotates more or grips more, and other times you brake more and that also does it — it’s very confusing at times."

Perhaps he spends more time on the simulator?

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