Hi, in old houses, like yours, the demarcation is infact rthe first socket where the black leadin ends, happy to be corrected, bung may do that, but I suggest that your demarc is where you have found it.
In situations like this, rather than do what you intend why not replace the current BT phone faceplate with a normal electrical flush box, attach to the stud to the right that the power socket is fitted to the other side of. You will be able to fit a master filter in there, if you take the flush box plastic crossbar out the filter will simply fall into the wall cavity and live happily. Just replace the BT faceplate with a standard PDL or Clipsal faceplate with a 2wire phone socket and a RJ45 for the modem port, or wire it off to another socket as desired.
cyril7: Hi, in old houses, like yours, the demarcation is infact rthe first socket where the black leadin ends, happy to be corrected, bung may do that, but I suggest that your demarc is where you have found it.
But that conflicts with what PFC 103 says (which Telecom tonight told me was correct). In all fairness PFC 103 conflicts with the TCF standards that are now out which says what you have said, but can the demarcation point change with a change of standards? (Seems odd to me)
In situations like this, rather than do what you intend why not replace the current BT phone faceplate with a normal electrical flush box, attach to the stud to the right that the power socket is fitted to the other side of. You will be able to fit a master filter in there, if you take the flush box plastic crossbar out the filter will simply fall into the wall cavity and live happily. Just replace the BT faceplate with a standard PDL or Clipsal faceplate with a 2wire phone socket and a RJ45 for the modem port, or wire it off to another socket as desired.
What you have said, is exactly what we would do in the garage, but as the walls aren't GIB'ed etc, without messing up any existing walls etc. In addition as I'm highly suspicious of the existing (power & phone) cabling in the house (a great example is wall lights on a different fuse from the main room lights), I'd sooner do the job right, and (in particular wiring for ADSL) as far away as possible.
(Edit: The way you suggest also would mean that one of the two new cable runs, would pretty much completely double back on the lead in, the other would double back about half the length of the lead-in)
But see, this is getting confusing, because if I take PFC 103 for it's word, I can maintain the cable in the garage no problems, as I'm past the demarcation point in PFC 103. If I want to do new wiring, it says it should be done under the TCF guidelines, which has a different demarcation point, but says (Appendix 1) that a NID/Home Distributior should be installed when retrofitting wiring.
So if I follow the word of both standards, if the cable from the garage to the bedroom goes faulty, I can replace it (but not add to it), but as I want to add to the home wiring, I should replace the first jackpoint with a NID/Home Distributor in the odd place, of right next to a bed.
Surely the best place for a NID/Home Distributor is in the garage not a bedroom?
As I said happy to be corrected, but in older hounses without a ETP the first socket where the leadin ends is the demarc. To be honest unlike Oz the rules here are less descriptive, if Chorus turned up to do any major repairs to the leadin they would most likely put a ETP in under the eave where the drop hits the house, but as far as it currently is the etp is the leadin transition on the first socket.
nigelj: What you have said, is exactly what we would do in the garage, but as the walls aren't GIB'ed etc, without messing up any existing walls etc. In addition as I'm highly suspicious of the existing (power & phone) cabling in the house (a great example is wall lights on a different fuse from the main room lights), I'd sooner do the job right, and (in particular wiring for ADSL) as far away as possible.
Wiring lights like that is good practice, not sure why you would find that suspicious of dodgey wiring.
The thing is with a house that age, the phone wiring was done with no regard for DSL, star wiring was considered a gross waste of wire and the cable is basically cat-nothing so the fact that it doesnt work great for ADSL is also not indicitive of any dodgeyness to it, just that its the wrong stuff for what you are asking of it.
cyril7: Hi, in old houses, like yours, the demarcation is infact rthe first socket where the black leadin ends, happy to be corrected, bung may do that, but I suggest that your demarc is where you have found it.
I always thought that but I haven't kept old PTC 103s. The only copies I can find even using wayback date from 2003 and say external entry point. That being the case I'm surprised that the TCF spec reverted to the older wording. Maybe the logic was that a demarcation point that you can't test from without cutting into a cable isn't practical.
The 1996 version of TNA 102 describing the Network Interface has the following wording
"2.2 Network demarcation (1) For most residential customers connected to the PSTN via individual lines, the physical demarcation point between the Telecom network and customer wiring will be one of the following:- (a) The External Test Point (ETP) mounted on the outside of the customer's building in cases where one has been installed by Telecom. • An External Test Point (ETP) is a small weatherproof box mounted on the outside of a building where the network lead-in cable enters the building. It provides a suitable point at which to joint the grease-filled lead-in cable to the building cabling. (b) Where no ETP has been installed, the demarcation point becomes the first point within the customer's premises at which the incoming line terminates. This is usually a telecommunications outlet (TO), such as a jackpoint, socket or equivalent item of hardware (see also Section 9)."
I presume that PTC 103 mirrored that a some stage.
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