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Topic # 57224 6-Feb-2010 08:29
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Telstra launched its NZ mobile plan on the 4th - perhaps at last a choice I thought?

And an escape from my Vodafone prison...and surely from Vodafone's rip-off Australian roaming charges.

So I looked at the Telstraclear roaming charges and believe it or not, here it is:

Telstra /
Mobilenet 900 / 1800 $7.55Peak $1.90 Off peak Data roaming $30/MB

So they have simply taken the Vodafone rates and onsold them - or is it that Vodafone would not let them have the competitive advantage of roaming ON THE TELSTRA NETWORK in Australia.


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  Reply # 296569 6-Feb-2010 09:15
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Roaming prices are stupid no matter what the network, I wouldn't imagine that Telstra would be able to get a better roaming deal as they have no network in NZ to bargin with.

All these high roaming charges are doing is forcing people to buy australian sims and run voip instead of voice.

One day telcos will have to wake up and offer decent roaming charges .... hopefully

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  Reply # 296570 6-Feb-2010 09:19
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Short story: it can't.

Telstra NextG network is 850MHz. Telecom New Zealand XT network is 850MHz. Vodafone New Zealand 3G is 2100MHz (with 900MHz outside the main centres).

See the problem? Your shiny Vodafone New Zealand handset won't roam on Telstra in Australia because they are not compatible.

Long story, and weird one if you look from the outside.

TesltraClear wanted to launch its own 3G network in New Zealand, starting in Tauranga with roaming on Vodafone New Zealand for everywhere else. They bumped into each other, and TelstraClear canned the project.

To stay in the mobile business the company started reselling Telecom CDMA services.

Telecom launches their XT network, initially with no plans for MVNO or resellers. TelstraClear has a problem with that and decide they can't wait until Telecom comes with pricing, etc so it moves back to the arms of Vodafone New Zealand - even though they had that Tauranga spat before.

Telecom announces they are ready to allow MVNO and resellers on XT. By then it's too late, TelstraClear already declared unconditional love for Vodafone New Zealand - even though it means its users get a lot less 3G coverage when roaming in Australia (which is probably the main destination for New Zealanders) because the Vodafone network in Australia is not as extensive as Telstra's own and not even in the same band.

If I were a business, today, I would go with Telecom New Zealand. Their handsets are 850/2100MHz, which means roaming in Australia on Telstra 3G (the largest network over there), roaming in the U.S. on AT&T 850MHz or any other 2100MHz provider if AT&T fails, and roaming in Europe on 2100MHz.





 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 296571 6-Feb-2010 09:29
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mandarin: Telstra launched its NZ mobile plan on the 4th - perhaps at last a choice I thought?

<SNIP>



TelstraClear... not TELSTRA





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  Reply # 296579 6-Feb-2010 10:18
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Vodafone AU have a big national 3G network on 900/2100mhz built by ericsson its not as large as next G but still a good size and covers many rural areas



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  Reply # 296605 6-Feb-2010 13:20
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2degrees standard roaming charge in Australia - where it has no network - $1.39 per minute.

You can roam in Australia on Vodafone on Telstraclear for $1.50/$0.95 - if you can actually log on and believe me there's been many a time in the Sydney CBD where I have been unable to do that. Sorry guys none of your responses answers my point that Telstra does NOT have to charge its own customers $7.55 per min (peak) for a roaming call in Australia routed through Vodafone NZ.

Telstraclear's own statement: "We have the best IP network in New Zealand, offer the market's best trans-Tasman services..."

Telstraclear is 100% owned by Telstra - there's no difference!

Swapping SIM cards is fine if you're on holiday - it doesn't work if you are on business and need your incoming and outgoing calls. You can of course use two phones, or a double sim phone - as I now normally do. Doesn't alter the principle of the matter.


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  Reply # 296616 6-Feb-2010 14:47
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freitasm:
Telecom announces they are ready to allow MVNO and resellers on XT. By then it's too late, TelstraClear already declared unconditional love for Vodafone New Zealand - even though it means its users get a lot less 3G coverage when roaming in Australia (which is probably the main destination for New Zealanders) because the Vodafone network in Australia is not as extensive as Telstra's own and not even in the same band.


In the main centres, Vodafone's 2G and 3G coverage is fine, especially as they have EDGE. Telstra do have more coverage in more places, but who is going to need coverage in the far east of WA in the middle of the desert? While Telecom customers pay one rate for roaming regardless of which network they're using, for those who buy a local SIM, prepaid national calls are more expensive on Telstra; Vodafone prepaid offers far better value.

freitasm:
If I were a business, today, I would go with Telecom New Zealand. Their handsets are 850/2100MHz, which means roaming in Australia on Telstra 3G (the largest network over there), roaming in the U.S. on AT&T 850MHz or any other 2100MHz provider if AT&T fails, and roaming in Europe on 2100MHz.


There are few (if any) 2100MHz networks in the USA. You'd at least get 3G coverage with AT&T in their 850MHz areas and 2G with other GSM providers, though.




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  Reply # 296627 6-Feb-2010 15:50
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munchkin: 

There are few (if any) 2100MHz networks in the USA. You'd at least get 3G coverage with AT&T in their 850MHz areas and 2G with other GSM providers, though.



Only one I can see is CTC Telcom Wireless and Stelera Wireless.. http://gsmworld.com/roaming/gsminfo/net_usc1.shtml

CTC Telcom, Inc. (CTC Telcom Wireless)
GSM 1900
Live
 

CTC Telcom, Inc. (CTC Telcom Wireless)
3G 2100
Live
 

CTC Telcom, Inc. (CTC Telcom Wireless)
3G 1700
Live


Stelera Wireless, L.L.C.
3G 2100
Live

Stelera Wireless, L.L.C.
3G 1700
Live

 

 




Regards,

Old3eyes


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  Reply # 296642 6-Feb-2010 17:48
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mandarin:
Telstraclear is 100% owned by Telstra - there's no difference!

Swapping SIM cards is fine if you're on holiday - it doesn't work if you are on business and need your incoming and outgoing calls. You can of course use two phones, or a double sim phone - as I now normally do. Doesn't alter the principle of the matter.



When I get a prepaid SIM card when travelling I always put a mesage on my home cellphone number telling callers I am overseas and if they want to reach me to call the local number. That way I don't calls at the wrong time zone and dont't have to pick up the tab for their calls to me.




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  Reply # 296645 6-Feb-2010 18:18
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TelstraClear may be 100% owned by Telstra Australia BUT it is operates in NZ as TelstraClear, so in order to minimise confusion with international readers, if you're referring to TelstraClear in NZ, it is "TelstraClear" or use shortcase TCL.




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  Reply # 296647 6-Feb-2010 18:32
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chiefie: TelstraClear may be 100% owned by Telstra Australia BUT it is operates in NZ as TelstraClear, so in order to minimise confusion with international readers, if you're referring to TelstraClear in NZ, it is "TelstraClear" or use shortcase TCL.


*thumbs up* nothing personally annoys me more than people referring to TCL as 'Telstra'.. Two different entitys.




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  Reply # 296669 6-Feb-2010 21:21
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mandarin:
You can roam in Australia on Vodafone on Telstraclear for $1.50/$0.95 - if you can actually log on and believe me there's been many a time in the Sydney CBD where I have been unable to do that. Sorry guys none of your responses answers my point that Telstra does NOT have to charge its own customers $7.55 per min (peak) for a roaming call in Australia routed through Vodafone NZ.

Telstraclear's own statement: "We have the best IP network in New Zealand, offer the market's best trans-Tasman services..."

Telstraclear is 100% owned by Telstra - there's no difference!

Swapping SIM cards is fine if you're on holiday - it doesn't work if you are on business and need your incoming and outgoing calls. You can of course use two phones, or a double sim phone - as I now normally do. Doesn't alter the principle of the matter.



You're confusing TelstraClear with Telstra here. In the context of mobile TelstraClear are nothing but a MVNO on Vodafone's network. They share nothing at all in common with Telstra.

Vodafone have an international roaming agreement with Telstra. Telstra obviously charge a lot for roaming. You've said that "Telstra doesn't need to charge $7.55" but you haven't offered an explanation why. There are plenty of reasons why this is the case, international roaming can be horribly complex which is why many operators have moved to roaming hubs rather than their own direct interconnects.

TelstraClear could deploy their own roaming infrastructure and negotiate better rates but presumably
do not see a business case for doing this.

As for roaming in Aussie on Vodafone I'm normally in Australia 3-4 times per year and have never encountered a single issue with roaming.






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  Reply # 296699 7-Feb-2010 07:59
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i am not confused between Telstra and Telstraclear. Telstraclear is an NZ company, 100% owned by Telstra (Australia). It has four directors. All live in Australia. One is a Telstra director, 2 are Telstra managing directors (HR and business respectively), one is the Deputy CFO.

Yet you say that in mobile "they share nothing at all in common with Telstra"? If Telstraclear is just a reseller of Vodafone this does not explain why NZ mobile users should pay a ridiculous rate fixed by Telstra(Australia) for Vodafone users when Telstra (Australia) owns and controls Telstraclear. My original heading refers to Telstra, not Telstraclear.

You have been lucky with Vodafone in Sydney. Amongst my experiences as an NZ Vodafone user in Sydney in the last 12 months have been running one and half blocks in Pitt Street to try to get coverage during a highly urgent issue on a business day (I did get it then), and sitting in a high-rise office in Elizabeth Street for over 20 minutes trying to log on to mobile broadband (never achieved).

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  Reply # 296705 7-Feb-2010 08:51
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mandarin: i am not confused between Telstra and Telstraclear. Telstraclear is an NZ company, 100% owned by Telstra (Australia). It has four directors. All live in Australia. One is a Telstra director, 2 are Telstra managing directors (HR and business respectively), one is the Deputy CFO.

Yet you say that in mobile "they share nothing at all in common with Telstra"? If Telstraclear is just a reseller of Vodafone this does not explain why NZ mobile users should pay a ridiculous rate fixed by Telstra(Australia) for Vodafone users when Telstra (Australia) owns and controls Telstraclear. My original heading refers to Telstra, not Telstraclear.


You are confused. You are confused when it comes to company ownership and the mobile product. There is *NO* link at all between TelstraClear's mobile offering and Telstra.

Where do you believe the link is?

TelstraClear mobile is a MVNO on Vodafone's network, it has nothing at all to do with Telstra. TelstraClear use Vodafone's roaming interconnects and billing for all roaming. They DO NOT have their own roaming agreements or interconnects, they rely 100% on Vodafone for this. In this respect there is absoolutely nothing at all in common between the business - TelstraClear are a customer of Vodafone who are merely a commercial customer of Telstra when a customer roams there. In the context of your argument you may as well say that CallPlus and Telstra are the same thing because both are in exactly the same boat - they are both wholesale Vodafone MVNO customers.

There are solutions out there that could solve this, TelstraClear could easily deploy dual IMSI SIM's that roam on Telstra's network while in Australia enabling them to bill their own customers directly however this would mean deploying additional infrastructure which isn't cheap. The problem with doing this is that they currently suffer from the 850/900 incompatibility issue with no handsets that are compatible with VF 3G in NZ and NextG in AU and only a handful of data cards that can do both frequencies.

Roaming is a lot more complex than you seem to realise.


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  Reply # 296723 7-Feb-2010 10:15
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mandarin: Telstra launched its NZ mobile plan on the 4th - perhaps at last a choice I thought?

And an escape from my Vodafone prison...and surely from Vodafone's rip-off Australian roaming charges.

So I looked at the Telstraclear roaming charges and believe it or not, here it is:

Telstra /
Mobilenet 900 / 1800 $7.55Peak $1.90 Off peak Data roaming $30/MB

So they have simply taken the Vodafone rates and onsold them - or is it that Vodafone would not let them have the competitive advantage of roaming ON THE TELSTRA NETWORK in Australia.


Hi

TCL has an MVNO with Vodafone, which means wholesale rates are determined under the commercial agreement.

The service can roam on pretty much any network and the capability of your device - see http://www.telstraclear.co.nz/business/products/mobility/pdf/telstraclear-data-roaming.pdf for a list of countries operators and rates. If your device is capable of working on 850mhz wcdma (eg an iPhone) you can use the Telstra Next G network. Or Optus. Or VodaHutch.

I think your observation is more that you were hoping the roaming rates to Australia to be cheaper, given Telstra owns TelstraClear.

A





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