Are these unreasonable renovation costs?

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#2371871 10-Dec-2019 16:13

The tradie can charge whatever they want if you haven't got a quote.

It's irrelevant whether it's too expensive or not, you've had the work done, now pay the bill.

timmmay

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#2371883 10-Dec-2019 16:22

chevrolux:

The tradie can charge whatever they want if you haven't got a quote.

It's irrelevant whether it's too expensive or not, you've had the work done, now pay the bill.

Nah that's rubbish. I also think you're being far too aggressive in this thread, and suggest you need to tone it down before a mod tones you down.

Have a look on this page:

So long as the services are for personal or household use:

If no price is agreed, you only have to pay a reasonable price for that type of work.
If no end date is agreed, the job needs to be done within a reasonable time.

jarledb

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#2371897 10-Dec-2019 17:00

Consumer NZ has a page about quotes and estimates

According to the article, a quote can't be exceeded, an estimate can. But Consumer NZ recons anything over +20% over the estimate can be challenged.

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Tracer

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#2372363 11-Dec-2019 13:00

timmmay:

Supply and fit a power point where an existing power point existed $350
- I'd expect about $50 unless they had to something like run a lot of cable.

You'd be mad to certify work and only charge $50 including parts and labour. You've got to cover overheads like liability insurance.

sir1963

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#2372368 11-Dec-2019 13:12

chevrolux:

The tradie can charge whatever they want if you haven't got a quote.

It's irrelevant whether it's too expensive or not, you've had the work done, now pay the bill.

A while back some guy went to get another Remote/key for his car.

I think he was initially charged close to $2000, took it to court and got it reduced to $500 which was considered "generous"

There are laws covering unfair contracts, unfair charges and so on.

sir1963

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#2372426 11-Dec-2019 13:27

semigeek:

Supply and fit a power point where an existing power point existed $350

Ouch, we got our whole house rewired, new sockets and switches and everything replaced on the circuit board(including putting in RCD's) and it came to $2200 all up. $350 seems steep for one power point.

how long ago was that ?

Was it actually rewired, or just new fittings put on ?

What was rewired, the lights ?, power points ?, Stove ? , new main between switchboard and meter panel, Hot water ?

What brand of fittings, you can get "cheap".

How many breakers on the board, did they reuse anything ?

How long were the sparkie(s) there, how many were there ?

How easy access was it in the roof/floor space ?

timmmay

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#2372441 11-Dec-2019 13:43

Tracer:

timmmay:

Supply and fit a power point where an existing power point existed $350
- I'd expect about $50 unless they had to something like run a lot of cable.

You'd be mad to certify work and only charge $50 including parts and labour. You've got to cover overheads like liability insurance.

I was thinking as a part of a larger job, not a one-off. The part is about $15, it takes about 5-10 minutes, at least when I had it done.

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pavelmac

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#2372442 11-Dec-2019 13:48

I should point out that the invoiced costs are coming through the project manager and not directly from the tradie.

Power board not touched.

Led lights used, 12v AMBiUS LED ~$25

1 light was a direct replacement, the other bathroom had 1 downlight replaced with 2. Wiring access was 1. good & 1 ok -> poor.

Sockets, not moved just new standard face plates added

1 Extractor fan was a replacement for an existing one, used existing ducting (after motor) but needed to be rewired to switched power. Wiring access good.

The extractor in the other bathroom was fresh install, so needed power but doesn't seem to be externally vented. Acessess good -> poor

Extractor fans look to be standard in line fans with standard foil ducting - already seen on new install that there is a split in ducting and tape does not seal to motor! Both things I can easly address myself - but indication of not the most proffessional job.

I was present when one of the niches was done and I think it took about 1-2 hrs to build and waterproof it and about same to tile.

I've not had the mindset to have an appropriate conversation about the invoice yet, just trying to get perspective on it and getting to know my consumer rights. So thanks for you all who have shared an oppion.

sir1963

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#2372460 11-Dec-2019 13:54

timmmay:

Tracer:

timmmay:

Supply and fit a power point where an existing power point existed $350
- I'd expect about $50 unless they had to something like run a lot of cable.

You'd be mad to certify work and only charge $50 including parts and labour. You've got to cover overheads like liability insurance.

I was thinking as a part of a larger job, not a one-off. The part is about $15, it takes about 5-10 minutes, at least when I had it done.

Wholesale (ie zero profit) for a PDL 692 (Double vertical PP) is around $18, retail is about $30-$40.

Add in the time to keep a vehicle stocked with parts, driving time to and from the job.

Add in overheads (earth loop testers etc can go into the thousands of dollars to buy)

Costs of maintaining registration (hundreds of dollars + 1 days unpaid time)

Vehicle + running costs

Book work costs (job sheet + accountants fee + GST accounting, Taxes, liability insurance, etc etc etc etc)

Its not as cheap as you think.

pavelmac

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#2372469 11-Dec-2019 14:11

I can appreciate there are overheads in running a business. I've looked up auckland rates (https://grammarelectrical.co.nz/electrician-cost-per-hour-2019/) at $120-$190 for first hour & $70-$100 for subsequnet hours. Which means 3 hours to install a plug, which is hrs to install 2 plugs (according to my PM)!

Anyway my next task will be to query the PM as to what the cost breakdown is.

timmmay

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#2372471 11-Dec-2019 14:12

Ah yeah they've gone up since I last bought any. They're $20 - $30 at mitre ten depending on the model.

I wasn't saying the callout fee for just doing that should be $50. If you have an electrician there doing a bunch of jobs, such as this case, the cost of all those things goes across all the job, and should be catered for in the hourly rate.

Registration taking a day and costing hundreds of dollars is nothing really. In IT I do weeks of training per year to stay current, and certification runs to thousands of dollars per year. We charge more though, and we don't run vehicles. When I was a professional photographer I had about $30K of equipment, plus vehicle, and things broke regularly and had to be upgraded. All businesses have costs and overheads.

sir1963

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#2372472 11-Dec-2019 14:12

pavelmac:

I can appreciate there are overheads in running a business. I've looked up auckland rates (https://grammarelectrical.co.nz/electrician-cost-per-hour-2019/) at $120-$190 for first hour & $70-$100 for subsequnet hours. Which means 3 hours to install a plug, which is hrs to install 2 plugs (according to my PM)!

Anyway my next task will be to query the PM as to what the cost breakdown is.

And how much does your project manager add on top of all bills to be paid ?

ZollyMonsta

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#2372481 11-Dec-2019 14:36

Check with them.. but it could be you are also paying for an apprentice to show up and learn on the job. I've had this with builders. You end up paying for the builder and the apprentice on site.

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sir1963

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#2372482 11-Dec-2019 14:41

ZollyMonsta:

Check with them.. but it could be you are also paying for an apprentice to show up and learn on the job. I've had this with builders. You end up paying for the builder and the apprentice on site.

This is a problem why ?

You pay much less for an apprentice, but if you think paying tradesman rates for clipping wires is a good idea....

Tracer

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Ultimate Geek

#2372679 11-Dec-2019 18:59

timmmay:

Tracer:

timmmay:

Supply and fit a power point where an existing power point existed $350
- I'd expect about $50 unless they had to something like run a lot of cable.

You'd be mad to certify work and only charge $50 including parts and labour. You've got to cover overheads like liability insurance.

I was thinking as a part of a larger job, not a one-off. The part is about $15, it takes about 5-10 minutes, at least when I had it done.

I very much doubt the job was a straight replacement for that price. Probably some remedial work to make the new work compliant so it could be certified. Then add the generous PM cut on top and there you go. Of course the CoC that would have been supplied within 20 working days of completion of the work would record what was actually done (and a copy of this must be retained for 7 years by the issuer, yet another cost on top). For $50 you'd struggle to cover costs let alone have something on your table to eat even for a straightforward job that's part of a larger one.

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