Spark goodwill & loyalty credit

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104 posts

Master Geek

#2167837 26-Jan-2019 12:45

I think you are out of touch. Who has sales, Briscoes annual sales mean that they are overcharging the rest of the time? Everybody manipulates pricing, its marketing.

T

That's entirely different. The marketing at Spark 'should' know that when so many customers call to say their price is too high compared to others, they should adjust their price to be competitive. This would not even be an issue if their prices were say with 5 or 10% more than others. But when the service costs 20 or 30% more, that's a horse of a different colour. Instead, Spark takes a path where no matter how many customers call back to get a price review ; they continue to up-sell on options they may not need (as in my case, 'oh we see you're not needing unlimited broadband and can give you the lower package option) ; not comparing apples with apples. It's a poor marketing approach to keep customers (it's not marketing to assume that the vast majority of customers will "not know" about the price difference and assume by doing nothing, they will just keep paying the old price).

Briscoes often does 50% sale discounts, we get that because their non-sale retail price tags are overly inflated. But in the telco / broadband business, you just can't do that.

snnet

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Uber Geek

#2167840 26-Jan-2019 12:50

I don't think comparing Spark to every other ISP is comparing apples with apples either though. I've been a customer of many different ISPs and, yes, Spark does cost a little more, but I don't have nearly as many issues as I had with other providers in the past (overcongestion, refusing to send techs to repair things, delay tactics, billing for services not rendered for months on end, and then trying to impose 30 day cancellation policies when you haven't had service for 3 months, I could go on).

For me, I'm happy to stay with Spark because of the level of service I get from them. If there is a technical issue, they at least send someone out to look at it (I'm exempting blaming them for Chorus issues because obviously they have no control over the level of knowledge a tech has nor what process they follow)

tdgeek

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#2167842 26-Jan-2019 12:52

SBQ:

I think you are out of touch. Who has sales, Briscoes annual sales mean that they are overcharging the rest of the time? Everybody manipulates pricing, its marketing.

T

That's entirely different. The marketing at Spark 'should' know that when so many customers call to say their price is too high compared to others, they should adjust their price to be competitive. This would not even be an issue if their prices were say with 5 or 10% more than others. But when the service costs 20 or 30% more, that's a horse of a different colour. Instead, Spark takes a path where no matter how many customers call back to get a price review ; they continue to up-sell on options they may not need (as in my case, 'oh we see you're not needing unlimited broadband and can give you the lower package option) ; not comparing apples with apples. It's a poor marketing approach to keep customers (it's not marketing to assume that the vast majority of customers will "not know" about the price difference and assume by doing nothing, they will just keep paying the old price).

Briscoes often does 50% sale discounts, we get that because their non-sale retail price tags are overly inflated. But in the telco / broadband business, you just can't do that.

Wrong. Its churn management. A company, say each telco, and throw in power companies, can hear you saying you will leave, and decide its better to give you a discount than have you leave. Thats basic math. Sky does it too. So do price matching stores such as NL, Harvey Normal, etc. It's marketing.

We want your business but we will suck it up to keep you so you don't move next door.

Now, has the OP seen himself as a true, genuine loyal customer? I very much doubt that he does. He wants to use his power of churn to cut a deal, that is not loyal. We talk about companies being mean and using their power, but it works both ways, under a thinly veiled attempt to call it loyal

Jase2985

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#2167936 26-Jan-2019 13:36

better for the bottom line to give a $10 discount to one person than give it to 10,000 people.

if you dont like their price move. dont like the service, move, there are literally 50+ choices out there.

yitz

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#2168016 26-Jan-2019 15:39

Not many providers offer traditional copper landline wholesaled off the Spark PSTN network anymore... I'm sure they know there's no longer a need for discounts.

Does the special pricing for HomeLine in cable connectable areas of Christchurch/Wellington still exist?

zyo

513 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2168023 26-Jan-2019 16:06

tdgeek:

Wrong. Its churn management. A company, say each telco, and throw in power companies, can hear you saying you will leave, and decide its better to give you a discount than have you leave. Thats basic math. Sky does it too. So do price matching stores such as NL, Harvey Normal, etc. It's marketing.

We want your business but we will suck it up to keep you so you don't move next door.

Now, has the OP seen himself as a true, genuine loyal customer? I very much doubt that he does. He wants to use his power of churn to cut a deal, that is not loyal. We talk about companies being mean and using their power, but it works both ways, under a thinly veiled attempt to call it loyal

So negotiating discounts is considered being "mean and using their power" to a company now? And your definition of a genuine loyal customer is to swallow whatever a company wants to charge? Spark must love customers like you :)

I doubt that even with "goodwill" discount, Spark is cheaper than some of the ISPs (most likely not even cheaper than some of Spark's subsidiaries like Skinny/Bigpipe which use more or less the same infrastructure)

I am not going to speculate why OP stays with Spark all those years but he clearly see the value of it and is willing to pay for the extras (well, up to a degree). To me that is a genuine loyal customer as I would be switching to a different ISP the moment my contract expires.

yitz

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Uber Geek

#2168024 26-Jan-2019 16:08

What is the adjustment/discount listed on the invoice as? Can't remember but it may have included the word 'loyalty'.

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SBQ

104 posts

Master Geek

#2168026 26-Jan-2019 16:17

yitz: Not many providers offer traditional copper landline wholesaled off the Spark PSTN network anymore... I'm sure they know there's no longer a need for discounts. Does the special pricing for HomeLine in cable connectable areas of Christchurch/Wellington still exist?

I don't believe it's Spark specific as the copper lines in Chch are owned by Chorus. Actually I don't believe Spark own any lines to begin with and are simply just a middle man like everyone else. So I do argue if their service is no different to any other provider. They've done 2 major price increases in the past 3 years against those still on the copper lines and their excuse was Chorus raised the cost of the lines while fiber line costs have stayed unchanged.

I spent a lot of time calling around others that provide the same landline service we had with Spark. Vodafone, 2 Degrees, & Slingshot all have homeline (or landline) offers but only basic. I was surprised that Now! NZ offered the Faxability options for only $3/month (whereas Spark was charging me $4/month for this option; funny though about 2 years ago it was only $3/month. The thing is all these little options add up. $115 (Spark) vs $81 (Now!) ?? That is a $408 savings over a whole year.

tdgeek

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#2168240 27-Jan-2019 08:50

zyo:

tdgeek:

Wrong. Its churn management. A company, say each telco, and throw in power companies, can hear you saying you will leave, and decide its better to give you a discount than have you leave. Thats basic math. Sky does it too. So do price matching stores such as NL, Harvey Normal, etc. It's marketing.

We want your business but we will suck it up to keep you so you don't move next door.

Now, has the OP seen himself as a true, genuine loyal customer? I very much doubt that he does. He wants to use his power of churn to cut a deal, that is not loyal. We talk about companies being mean and using their power, but it works both ways, under a thinly veiled attempt to call it loyal

So negotiating discounts is considered being "mean and using their power" to a company now? And your definition of a genuine loyal customer is to swallow whatever a company wants to charge? Spark must love customers like you :)

I doubt that even with "goodwill" discount, Spark is cheaper than some of the ISPs (most likely not even cheaper than some of Spark's subsidiaries like Skinny/Bigpipe which use more or less the same infrastructure)

I am not going to speculate why OP stays with Spark all those years but he clearly see the value of it and is willing to pay for the extras (well, up to a degree). To me that is a genuine loyal customer as I would be switching to a different ISP the moment my contract expires.

ALL RSP's have their own MO. Better or worse service, better or worse pricing, better or worse service hours and access, better or worse added values, and so on.

Im not aware of any RSP that buys farms as they need somewhere to store the cash. What I bolded, is due to the OP calling it loyalty when its not loyalty. Lets take all the customers of all the RSP's wagon have not churned in 2 years but could have done. The combinations of Better or worse service, better or worse pricing, better or worse service hours and access, better or worse added values, and so on. works for them. There will be people who could get a better deal but never bother to look. Thats human nature not RSP nature.

Just admit that you are not loyal, except to yourself. That is not a fault or a problem, but don't profess to be otherwise.

zyo

513 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2168290 27-Jan-2019 10:54

tdgeek:
Im not aware of any RSP that buys farms as they need somewhere to store the cash. What I bolded, is due to the OP calling it loyalty when its not loyalty. Lets take all the customers of all the RSP's wagon have not churned in 2 years but could have done. The combinations of Better or worse service, better or worse pricing, better or worse service hours and access, better or worse added values, and so on. works for them. There will be people who could get a better deal but never bother to look. Thats human nature not RSP nature.

Thats a ridiculous argument, Spark made almost 400mil profit last year they could have easily afforded to buy hundreds of farms. Or offer customers a better deal.

But how much money RSP makes is besides the point, if a company couldnt make a profit on their products then they have no business selling them.

It comes down to this:
OP believes he should be entitled to some kind of loyalty discount by re-signing a fixed term contract with Spark. He has obviously done his research and is aware he can easily obtain the same discount switching to another ISP but decided not to. He is not asking Spark for a ridiculous amount of incentive (as Spark has previously obliged). To me this sounds like the action of a reasonable and loyal customer.

The inner workings of RSPs and how they treat customer churns are irrelevant as to whether a customer is perceived as loyal or not

tdgeek:
Just admit that you are not loyal, except to yourself. That is not a fault or a problem, but don't profess to be otherwise

Wow, I didnt know these two are mutually exclusive to each other.

tdgeek

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#2168561 27-Jan-2019 18:45

zyo:
tdgeek:

Im not aware of any RSP that buys farms as they need somewhere to store the cash. What I bolded, is due to the OP calling it loyalty when its not loyalty. Lets take all the customers of all the RSP's wagon have not churned in 2 years but could have done. The combinations of Better or worse service, better or worse pricing, better or worse service hours and access, better or worse added values, and so on. works for them. There will be people who could get a better deal but never bother to look. Thats human nature not RSP nature.

Thats a ridiculous argument, Spark made almost 400mil profit last year they could have easily afforded to buy hundreds of farms. Or offer customers a better deal.

But how much money RSP makes is besides the point, if a company couldnt make a profit on their products then they have no business selling them.

It comes down to this:
OP believes he should be entitled to some kind of loyalty discount by re-signing a fixed term contract with Spark. He has obviously done his research and is aware he can easily obtain the same discount switching to another ISP but decided not to. He is not asking Spark for a ridiculous amount of incentive (as Spark has previously obliged). To me this sounds like the action of a reasonable and loyal customer.

The inner workings of RSPs and how they treat customer churns are irrelevant as to whether a customer is perceived as loyal or not

tdgeek:
Just admit that you are not loyal, except to yourself. That is not a fault or a problem, but don't profess to be otherwise

Wow, I didnt know these two are mutually exclusive to each other.

if you choose to see my posts as outlandish, that does not make it so.

You clearly do not understand loyalty or Business 101

zyo

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Ultimate Geek

#2168566 27-Jan-2019 18:57

tdgeek:

You clearly do not understand loyalty or Business 101

And you do? Guess what news flash, at the end of the day Spark does not give a damn about loyalty (otherwise they would have offered promotional deals to long time users instead of only new users)

The only statistics they care about is their bottom line and the only language they understand is churn rate.

tdgeek

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#2168585 27-Jan-2019 19:12

zyo:

tdgeek:

You clearly do not understand loyalty or Business 101

And you do? Guess what news flash, at the end of the day Spark does not give a damn about loyalty (otherwise they would have offered promotional deals to long time users instead of only new users)

The only statistics they care about is their bottom line and the only language they understand is churn rate.

As all RSP's and businesses should do, so that they can be successful. Do you want a telco that is cheap as chips and fails? I am sure you do not. But you want a telco that is cheap as chips yet provides anything and everything you want for nix.

People say Sky is expensive, not sure why, some say it should be $20 per month. GREAT IDEA

As for your first comment, yes I do.

zyo

513 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2168603 27-Jan-2019 19:46

tdgeek:

As all RSP's and businesses should do, so that they can be successful. Do you want a telco that is cheap as chips and fails? I am sure you do not. But you want a telco that is cheap as chips yet provides anything and everything you want for nix.

People say Sky is expensive, not sure why, some say it should be $20 per month. GREAT IDEA

As for your first comment, yes I do.

You and me have very different definitions of "matching price to the competition" vs "want for nix"

As I don't have Sky and see no value in them so even @ 20 dollars it is expensive for my usage.

You can throw jargon like churn management around all day and think you know business but at the end of the day, OP has broadband/mobile/landline with Spark and if I ran a business like Spark I'd make sure my whole package (not necessarily individual parts) is as competitive as possible for customers like that.

An extra 10 - 20 dollar p/m discount goes a long way because it is so easy for customers to shop around nowadays.

Jase2985

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#2168604 27-Jan-2019 19:50

but your not comparing apples with apples.

spark own all their infrastructure, other smaller ISP's dont they buy off others or they dont have hand overs everywhere.

there is so much more to it than just matching price of the competition.

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