New Zealand housing market (particularly Auckland)

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#2082520 1-Sep-2018 18:10

tdgeek:

I fully are anti racism. BUT, this demographic can cause imbalances, just as too many kids, too may older people, and so on, can. Don't fall into the trap of labelling everything as discrimination if that demographic (race, could be age, could be anything) is a prime cause.

My wife is Pinoy (Filipino / Philippines). Her and her fellow countrymen have pretty much the same agenda in the housing market as the average NZ family and the same or worse affordability issues.

I have received totally-unprovoked abuse in Christchurch FB B&S forums after some people see my profile photo with my wife. Here in the Manawatu where housing is a lot more affordable - no such issues.

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clevedon

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#2082521 1-Sep-2018 18:15

Geektastic:

clevedon:

kobiak:

what's up with the racial comments blaming immigrants and chinese ppl in particular? I though we are more educated group of ppl and not stuff/nzherald facebook page.

this is called globalisation. everyone is free to move where and when they like. the more popular place is - the higher cost of living and housing. NZ is one of the popular destinations for people not because of house affordability, but because it's more or less stable countries to live in, nature and remoteness from the rest of the world.

try to get property in LA, SF, Vancuver, London, Paris, Melbourne, Sydney, etc, etc you'd be shocked. NZ house prices are at the bottom from major cities. Mansion for few million $ here would cost few times more elsewhere.

There're houses in AKL under ~650k relatively new like build 8-10 yrs ago. But TOWNHOUSES, which is not kiwi way of living :( we'd seen stand alone houses in this price bracket 6 months ago, okeish houses.

IMO, I believe lack of adaptation and willingness to change habits are costing kiwis a fortune.

I'd say CHANGE to the world we're all living in.

Maybe we all don't want to be like the rest of the world.

Maybe money is not everything and lifestyle is. Once it's gone, you can't get it back.

That just sounds like King Cnut trying to stop the tide coming in I am afraid.

Yeah, you're probably right - unfortunately.

quickymart

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#2082524 1-Sep-2018 18:27

MichaelNZ:

quickymart: Heck, I would be happy with even just a townhouse (or an apartment). However, even that is out of my reach.

Move to the provinces.

Sorry, I know this is not necessarily a good or easy answer but it's the only one at this point in time.

I have a son with special needs who wouldn't get the care he needs in the provinces, unfortunately. Dunedin might be an option though.

Sam91

620 posts

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#2082525 1-Sep-2018 18:28

I know a university student living in a 5 bedroom Auckland house by himself while he studies. His family also owns a very expensive apartment which is rented and provides him with his income. His parents aren't living in NZ. From my conversations at uni, many international students will be bought a property to live in while they study, so this example is not unique. It's not a problem limited to Chinese students either, I had a classmate from Kuwait living in a property bought by his parents. While they might not be the main driver of house prices, international students must've contributed to the problem in some way.

I think there was a figure a few months back showing that 20% of Auckland Central properties for the quarter had been sold to foreign buyers. I think that's far higher than it should be allowed to be.

MichaelNZ

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#2082527 1-Sep-2018 18:30

quickymart:

I have a son with special needs who wouldn't get the care he needs in the provinces, unfortunately. Dunedin might be an option though.

My wife is a university qualified school teacher with 8 years experience in the Philippines... But here we are wondering if it's all worth it. She won't have any issue getting a job once we complete her work visa but it's looking unlikely to be teaching.

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driller2000

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#2082530 1-Sep-2018 18:47

Many reasons got us here - this article from the BNZ's Tony Alexander dated November 2012 covers most of them:

http://tonyalexander.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/WONovember-1.pdf

And many of them remain in play today.

So will homes ever become affordable?

Only if their is a massive price correction and home owners are prepared to sell en masse at 25% of current value - unlikely.
Or if incomes increase massively - they won't.
Or if most of the factors in the linked article are addressed - and in 7 years most haven't been - so i see little chance of that changing.

So NOPE.

And while I have benefited from this crazy house growth in terms of paper value - it hasn't done NZ Inc any good, nor society in terms of growing inequality, nor my kids who i would love to buy and live in AKL one day too - but yeah I cant see it happening : /

MichaelNZ

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#2082531 1-Sep-2018 18:50

What's going to happen then? Something has to crack. Probably already has.

When you get people competing for rentals in Dannevirke and Waipukarau, you know something is wrong.

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gzt

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#2082539 1-Sep-2018 19:13

Sam91: I know a university student living in a 5 bedroom Auckland house by himself while he studies. His family also owns a very expensive apartment which is rented and provides him with his income. His parents aren't living in NZ. From my conversations at uni, many international students will be bought a property to live in while they study, so this example is not unique. It's not a problem limited to Chinese students either, I had a classmate from Kuwait living in a property bought by his parents. While they might not be the main driver of house prices, international students must've contributed to the problem in some way.

That ended August 15th I believe:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/106297829/labours-bill-to-curb-foreigners-buying-new-zealand-houses-becomes-law

Purchase of apartments and investment in new construction is allowed. Existing house and land type purchases are no longer an option.

tdgeek

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#2082545 1-Sep-2018 19:34

Sam91:

I know a university student living in a 5 bedroom Auckland house by himself while he studies. His family also owns a very expensive apartment which is rented and provides him with his income. His parents aren't living in NZ. From my conversations at uni, many international students will be bought a property to live in while they study, so this example is not unique. It's not a problem limited to Chinese students either, I had a classmate from Kuwait living in a property bought by his parents. While they might not be the main driver of house prices, international students must've contributed to the problem in some way.

I think there was a figure a few months back showing that 20% of Auckland Central properties for the quarter had been sold to foreign buyers. I think that's far higher than it should be allowed to be.

Exactly. Ive seen this, big house, almost hardly any furniture, but the best gaming PC you can have. Parents living here in the future...

Kids study here, then head home, not use a study visa as a pathway to PR then import family. Buy a house you need to have PR and be a "permanent resident"

kobiak

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#2082546 1-Sep-2018 19:37

tdgeek:

kobiak:

what's up with the racial comments blaming immigrants and chinese ppl in particular? I though we are more educated group of ppl and not stuff/nzherald facebook page.

this is called globalisation. everyone is free to move where and when they like. the more popular place is - the higher cost of living and housing. NZ is one of the popular destinations for people not because of house affordability, but because it's more or less stable countries to live in, nature and remoteness from the rest of the world.

try to get property in LA, SF, Vancuver, London, Paris, Melbourne, Sydney, etc, etc you'd be shocked. NZ house prices are at the bottom from major cities. Mansion for few million $ here would cost few times more elsewhere.

There're houses in AKL under ~650k relatively new like build 8-10 yrs ago. But TOWNHOUSES, which is not kiwi way of living :( we'd seen stand alone houses in this price bracket 6 months ago, okeish houses.

IMO, I believe lack of adaptation and willingness to change habits are costing kiwis a fortune.

I'd say CHANGE to the world we're all living in.

Wrong. Ive been to all those cities. NZ being small is more affected by many and rich people buying based on Shanghai or Texas prices. Then those prices become the norm. I agree with him, I used the word foreigner. Houses should be valued with NZ factors, not US, Asian, or Brunei factors. Then only US or Asian or Brunei can afford them.

Wrong? People roaming is just another factor out of 100s. Rich or poor we want to live where we want and can afford. If people chose AKL, this means it's suitable for living at the current given time, it can be yrs or decades.

And because we're living in the global world, NZ prices and affordability depends on US, Asian, etc factors, if they become rich and we are poor, well we are f'ed. Same vs versa.

helping others at evgenyk.nz

tdgeek

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#2082547 1-Sep-2018 19:38

gzt:
Sam91: I know a university student living in a 5 bedroom Auckland house by himself while he studies. His family also owns a very expensive apartment which is rented and provides him with his income. His parents aren't living in NZ. From my conversations at uni, many international students will be bought a property to live in while they study, so this example is not unique. It's not a problem limited to Chinese students either, I had a classmate from Kuwait living in a property bought by his parents. While they might not be the main driver of house prices, international students must've contributed to the problem in some way.

That ended August 15th I believe:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/106297829/labours-bill-to-curb-foreigners-buying-new-zealand-houses-becomes-law

Purchase of apartments and investment in new construction is allowed. Existing house and land type purchases are no longer an option.

As it should be. Removes demand for existing homes, and the new builds are based on land a house build price, not auction

Batman

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#2082548 1-Sep-2018 19:40

gzt:
Sam91: I know a university student living in a 5 bedroom Auckland house by himself while he studies. His family also owns a very expensive apartment which is rented and provides him with his income. His parents aren't living in NZ. From my conversations at uni, many international students will be bought a property to live in while they study, so this example is not unique. It's not a problem limited to Chinese students either, I had a classmate from Kuwait living in a property bought by his parents. While they might not be the main driver of house prices, international students must've contributed to the problem in some way.

That ended August 15th I believe:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/106297829/labours-bill-to-curb-foreigners-buying-new-zealand-houses-becomes-law

Purchase of apartments and investment in new construction is allowed. Existing house and land type purchases are no longer an option.

Do you know if it's effective immediately or is there a date that this law starts to apply?

Batman

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#2082550 1-Sep-2018 19:43

surfisup1000:
I attribute Aucklands increased house prices to chinese immigrants and printed money (ie, low interest rates) flooding the global economy.

People don't like pointing at the chinese, but clearly the chinese population in Auckland has dramatically increased. I remember the time when the queen st arcade parlours were filled with maoris and european kids ...at some point around 1993'ish the asians started outnumbering the locals and the demographic changes have accelerated if anything.

I've lived in a few western cities around the world , and Auckland is not the best by far. There are some nice things, the eastern suburb beaches, north shore coast, pleasant harbour, but, really Auckland is quite a shabby little city with poor quality housing and awful traffic. Aucklands awkward geography ensures it's small population clogs up the roads.

I don't know for sure but i bet you're wrong. I have met so many immigrants everyday.

Guess where they're from. Hint: they may have white skin

1. Britain
2. Britain
3. Britain
4. Etc

Note: whether they buy houses or not, they will need housing.

I suggest you open your eyes and stop blaming the Chinese.

No I'm not a Chinese immigrant. But I'm an immigrant. Just like your forefathers most likely. If global citizens bought houses it's because the government allowed them. Don't blame global citizens but government policies.

DaveB

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#2082551 1-Sep-2018 19:44

I get the same question from my daughter and her partner, and I do feel for them.

The only advice I can give them is to give up the brand new iPhone or Galaxy every year, stop eating takeaways or going out for a meal every other night, stop buying branded clothing, stop buying convenience lunches, stop spending money on so many PlayStation or Xbox games. That's the things they can change immediately to save a lot of money in one year. I expect at least $8,000 each year, possibly more.

Next they could budget their shopping bill, possibly saving $1 - 200 a month. After all, they don't need that cat and dog that they have. Let's not consider the vet bills or food bills for those animals. They don't drink much nor smoke, so that's good. Neither does my daughter and her partner!

Oh yeah. Get rid of Netflix, Sky, Amazon and all the other crud companies chasing our dollars. They don't need Spotify, unlimited Spark Data or some such other techie must have. Nor do they need to continually upload some boring narrative pictorial about what they are eating each day to facebook or some such other stupid social media for those of us who do not give a rats arse. They might just find it a little cheaper and substantially more fun to enjoy each others company 24/7.

Don't get me wrong. I know it is tough, but I have them and my young son covered with a couple of rental properties that I was fortunate to acquire outside of the main centers. It wont make them rich, but it may give them a start a little later. They do not know about these, because if they did, I am concerned that they may just have an expectation that things will fall their way.

We are in the 2000's. It is indeed harder than ever to get ahead. The only way to do it is really consider what is REALLY important each month with your limited disposable $$$'s, sacrifice a LOT for 4 to 5 years then lay down your nest.

kobiak

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#2082553 1-Sep-2018 19:48

and just to add fuel to the discussion, I believe NZ can not survive without foreign investment (development, technology, education, economic, farming, production). But government should heavily regulate the rules, and allow more and more foreign investment into NZ. It should be very limited in housing market, only allow the development but no foreign residential property ownership, possible restrict commercial properties too. Development should be regulated, but encouraged in different economic benefit forms. Also labour and material markets should be regulated. Otherwise, meh, nothing would considerably change without massive market shake where we all lose (kiwis).

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