Global mode over ? Lets see.....

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6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1330599 24-Jun-2015 12:20

Lias: We allow legal parallel importing of physical goods, legal circumvention of DVD zoning, or at least we will until the government sells out by signing TPPA. If Global Mode isn't legal, we need legislation to explicitly make it legal.

I don't see why we don't pass laws forbidding monopoly agreements, they NEVER benefit consumers, only ever some greedy company. No more "carrier exclusive" phones. No more Geoblocking. No more XYZ sport only on Sky. Oh what a beautiful pipe dream that will never happen because both the main political parties in NZ are willing to sign TPPA and sell us out.

/rant

because it would be virtually impossible to enforce, and even harder to administer.

How would NZ lawmakers stop, say, BBC (based in the UK and totally outside NZ jurisdiction) from using Geoblocking measures?

How would NZ lawmakers force HBO (also based outside NZ jurisdiction) to sell it's content to multiple companies in NZ? Who would set the price? etc etc

garvani

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#1330608 24-Jun-2015 12:28

ronw: You did not read your own url as it says that bill will pass. It actually passed on June 22 which was mentioned in my original message If you are going to Aussie you will not be able to watch your overseas stuff once it becomes law.

Ummm what? Reading comprehension fail. You should re read it yourself. It explicitly states that vpn's although are in the bill won't be affected for things like netflix. Let me bold the parts to make it easier

“This Australian could then — and this is widely done — purchase the content in the normal way with a credit card. The owner of the Australian rights to the content so acquired might well be quite unhappy about that, but they could take a remedy against the American site or the underlying owner of the rights. This bill does not apply to a site like this. It is not intended to apply to VPNs,” Turnbull confirmed.

There are key reasons why the Copyright Amendment (Online Infringement) Bill 2015 does not apply to VPN use, but for clarity’s sake, Turnbull spelled them out. “Where someone is using a VPN to access, for example, Netflix from the United States to get content in respect of which Netflix does not have an Australian licence, this bill would not deal with that, because you could not say that Netflix in the United States has as its primary purpose the infringement, or facilitation of the infringement, of copyright,” the Minister said.

Turnbull went on to make it clear that if local entertainment companies have a problem with Australians utilizing VPNs to obtain a better content offering, then they should direct their grievances overseas and leave the man in the street alone.

Jaxar

383 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1330624 24-Jun-2015 12:39

NonprayingMantis:

there is one other alternative I hadn't considered though:
Maybe the media companies offered a big chunk of cash to Callplus/BNSL as part of the settlement. Kind of a carrot/stick approach. "Remove Global mode and never talk about it again, we'll give you $20m (or some number, probably not that much). If you don't, we'll see you in court"

I considered the above as well. Not as explicit as simple cash but some other factor which would result in competitive gain or loss. I couldn't come up with a way to not sound like I was wearing a tinfoil hat though and thus dropped it from my original post. It could even been the other way around to an extent force it to the negotiation table to see what if any concession could be gained by dropping an expensive legal case.
Your argument about the timing invalidating my point has merit although I don't have any knowledge as to what would be a realistic time frame for a company to come up with that kind of decision. Add in the change of ownership and I could imagine it taking them this long to come to this conclusion.

Please note: I have a professional bias towards Vodafone.

Geektastic

17943 posts

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#1330631 24-Jun-2015 12:41

Lias: We allow legal parallel importing of physical goods, legal circumvention of DVD zoning, or at least we will until the government sells out by signing TPPA. If Global Mode isn't legal, we need legislation to explicitly make it legal.

I don't see why we don't pass laws forbidding monopoly agreements, they NEVER benefit consumers, only ever some greedy company. No more "carrier exclusive" phones. No more Geoblocking. No more XYZ sport only on Sky. Oh what a beautiful pipe dream that will never happen because both the main political parties in NZ are willing to sign TPPA and sell us out.

/rant

As far as content like music, films etc is concerned, the companies who make them need to work out that releasing them on the same day worldwide at the same cost is the only solution to their problem.

The geeks will beat them every time because the geekosphere can and will react instantly in comparison to the behemoth media companies that take months if not years to react.

I'm fairly 'amateur geek' in such matters but even I can (and do) provide myself with the equivalent of 'global mode' and at very modest annual cost.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1330632 24-Jun-2015 12:41

Jaxar:
NonprayingMantis:

there is one other alternative I hadn't considered though:
Maybe the media companies offered a big chunk of cash to Callplus/BNSL as part of the settlement. Kind of a carrot/stick approach. "Remove Global mode and never talk about it again, we'll give you $20m (or some number, probably not that much). If you don't, we'll see you in court"

I considered the above as well. Not as explicit as simple cash but some other factor which would result in competitive gain or loss. I couldn't come up with a way to not sound like I was wearing a tinfoil hat though and thus dropped it from my original post. It could even been the other way around to an extent force it to the negotiation table to see what if any concession could be gained by dropping an expensive legal case.
Your argument about the timing invalidating my point has merit although I don't have any knowledge as to what would be a realistic time frame for a company to come up with that kind of decision. Add in the change of ownership and I could imagine it taking them this long to come to this conclusion.

yeah that's a good point. The wheels of a large corporate like M2 take while to turn.

I wonder if the details will ever leak? (wikileaks?) would be fascinating to see what happened behind the scenes

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1330636 24-Jun-2015 12:45

Geektastic:
Lias: We allow legal parallel importing of physical goods, legal circumvention of DVD zoning, or at least we will until the government sells out by signing TPPA. If Global Mode isn't legal, we need legislation to explicitly make it legal.

I don't see why we don't pass laws forbidding monopoly agreements, they NEVER benefit consumers, only ever some greedy company. No more "carrier exclusive" phones. No more Geoblocking. No more XYZ sport only on Sky. Oh what a beautiful pipe dream that will never happen because both the main political parties in NZ are willing to sign TPPA and sell us out.

/rant

As far as content like music, films etc is concerned, the companies who make them need to work out that releasing them on the same day worldwide at the same cost is the only solution to their problem.

The geeks will beat them every time because the geekosphere can and will react instantly in comparison to the behemoth media companies that take months if not years to react.

I'm fairly 'amateur geek' in such matters but even I can (and do) provide myself with the equivalent of 'global mode' and at very modest annual cost.

They beleive (rightly or wrongly) that simulataneous release like that will probably do more harm than good.

Current situation: release windows that vary by geography. With that, they get to time their releases to best suit the local market e.g. kids movies during school holidays, summer movies in the summer and not in the winter etc etc It means they can put their promotional efforts into one market at a time, send the stars around to do promo activity, go on local talk shows etc.

If they do simultaneous release worldwide, they get the benefit of a relatively small number of internet people who actually want to pay (as opposed to the people who say they will pay, but then don't) but they lose all the rest of the above benefits.

It is their assessment that, currently, the benefits of windowing outweigh the costs. Whilst they dislike piracy, they believe they still make more money by continuing with the current business model.

ronw

1222 posts

Uber Geek

#1330661 24-Jun-2015 13:06

Wait till TPPA arrives and Parallel Importing will disappear very fast. If any legal channel complains of unfair competition under TPPA then it such practices as Parallel Importing will be illegal.
So will purchasing items like books or music from Amazon and the likes. All it will take is for a legal NZ distribution channel to complain and its gone.
Taht is why he big firms want it. The majority of book publishers in NZ are part of Rupert Murdoch's empire and he knows what to do to outlaw competition.

Lias: We allow legal parallel importing of physical goods, legal circumvention of DVD zoning, or at least we will until the government sells out by signing TPPA. If Global Mode isn't legal, we need legislation to explicitly make it legal.
/rant

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ronw

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#1330666 24-Jun-2015 13:12

I am aware of what is in bill but there are still plenty of people feel that Turnbull is being duplicitous. If it is not intended to block them why include VPN's in the bill. I guess we wait and see but if you trust the word of anyone in Abbott's government then you will really enjoy life in Australia.

Ummm what? Reading comprehension fail. You should re read it yourself. It explicitly states that vpn's although are in the bill won't be affected for things like netflix. Let me bold the parts to make it easier

Nokia 7 Plus
Nexus 6P 32Gb
Nexus 6 Phone
Nexus 5 Phone
Nexus 7 2013 Tablet
Samsung TAB A 8"
Samsung TAB A 10"

& many Windows laptops, Desktops etc

mattwnz

20144 posts

Uber Geek

#1330670 24-Jun-2015 13:15

I would have liked this to have gone to court, then we can find out if such a service is illegal or not. Sounds like no one wants that either way though.

Bee

732 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1330673 24-Jun-2015 13:23

So Sky and Lightbox have wont the fight to stop a large amount of people watching Netflix US. For now.
Funny thing is we spend most of our Netflix time in Mexico, Canada or Ireland.

Doing your best is much more important than being the best.

lchiu7

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#1330674 24-Jun-2015 13:24

I'ts not hard to see why Callplus knuckled under. I don't know the commercial aspects of it, but for Orcon and others, the goal I presume of Global Mode was to entice new customers. That would be the only revenue it would provide and presumably Orcon et all would have had to pay CallPlus something.

So rather spend lots of money lawyers for no additional revenue, they just caved in. The interesting part will be how many current customers ditch Orcon and those who offered Global Mode (just where would they go to?) because of this? Those who still want overseas content would just sign up for Unotelly etc.

Staying in Wellington. Check out my AirBnB in the Wellington CBD. https://www.airbnb.co.nz/h/wellycbd PM me and mention GZ to get a 15% discount and no AirBnB charges.

wsnz

649 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1330676 24-Jun-2015 13:26

mattwnz: I would have liked this to have gone to court, then we can find out if such a service is illegal or not. Sounds like no one wants that either way though.

Unfortunatley, the ultimate winners in such a court case would be the lawyers.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1330681 24-Jun-2015 13:30

lchiu7: I'ts not hard to see why Callplus knuckled under. I don't know the commercial aspects of it, but for Orcon and others, the goal I presume of Global Mode was to entice new customers. That would be the only revenue it would provide and presumably Orcon et all would have had to pay CallPlus something.

So rather spend lots of money lawyers for no additional revenue, they just caved in. The interesting part will be how many current customers ditch Orcon and those who offered Global Mode (just where would they go to?) because of this? Those who still want overseas content would just sign up for Unotelly etc.

it would also be about retention - keeping existing customers.

If customers use global mode, but want to leave Orcon, they would need to either find a new ISP that also gives it away, or sign up for and pay for unblock-us. For many people, that's a hassle

(somebody in this thread already stated they just signed a 12 month contract with Orcon purely for Global mode, even though they hated the customer service. Seems crazy to me, but for some people that sort of thing is important.)
so by removing global mode it removes a barrier to people leaving. It also pisses off some existing customers who may now choose to leave just to spite them.
They definitely would have wanted to keep offering it if they could.

Yabanize

2350 posts

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#1330693 24-Jun-2015 13:37

Orcon have said they will allow people to break their contracts if global mode was the main reason they signed up

mattwnz

20144 posts

Uber Geek

#1330700 24-Jun-2015 13:43

Yabanize: Orcon have said they will allow people to break their contracts if global mode was the main reason they signed up

That would probably be a given. Here is a recent story about the sorry saga http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/69656543/callplus-to-axe-global-mode-to-settle-legal-action-say-tv-companies

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