National Radio (FM) sounds badly tuned on car stereo

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stiffwin

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#230681 8-Mar-2018 12:20

Hi - I couldn't find a more appropriate forum for this topic. National Radio seems to have lots of distortion on sibilance - 's', 'f' etc. It sounds as though it's tuned slightly off station. This is on my 2yr old Pioneer mid-range tuner/cd player. I'm Waikato-based, but it's the same in Auckland. Any suggestions?

Cheers

Steve

RunningMan

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#1971280 8-Mar-2018 15:10

Similar thread a few months ago by @xpd

https://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=162&topicid=226269

Different station though.

stiffwin

46 posts

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#1971293 8-Mar-2018 16:13

Thanks for that

deesser

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#2341670 22-Oct-2019 09:52

Hi,

I was happy to see this message posted. I feel like I'm no longer the only person suffering from the absolutely awful sound quality coming from RNZ National.

Sometime around mid 2017, I noticed distortion on the radio in my car. The distortion was caused by the 's' or the sibilant sounds from the announcers voice. My initial thought was that I had a problem with the radio, as the car was almost new, and it had just come out from having a service. The service company had told me that they had done a firmware update on the cars various systems. Only a few days later though, I noticed a problem with the internet radio in my living room. The sibilant sounds were incredibly strong and distracting. It was very easy to notice that something had changed in the broadcast, and to me, it was obvious there was something happening that was not normal. I have since had many opportunities to drive different kinds of rental cars for my job, and have been able to confirm the problem is present in different parts of the country and on different radios.

I decided to wait for a while to hear what would happen. I just assumed the broadcaster was having a temporary technical issue, and that they would probably get it sorted. During the following few months, the problem appeared to get worse. I also started to notice other things happening. I couldn't believe it at first, but I was hearing things like doors shutting, paper shuffling, chairs squeaking, keyboards and mouses clicking etc. I also noticed a big increase in the occurrence of mouth sounds (that squishy sound that people make with a dry mouth).

I'm not an audio engineer or anything like that, but it doesn't take a sound expert to notice that something is wrong when you start hearing all kinds of extraneous sounds, distortion etc.

I wrote an email to transmission@rnz.co.nz telling them about the distortion and excessive sibilance, and could they please adjust their equipment. The reply I received, though not really helpful, was telling. Firstly they told me I was the only person that had complained about this situation. Secondly, they told me they had recently upgraded some 15 year old sound processing equipment. I also received technical information about microphones.

The following year or so was a roller coaster ride of changes in the sound quality from really really bad, to barely acceptable, but never good. It was clear to me that they were going through a technology upgrade and were struggling to maintain a consistent quality. As things are now, the sound is a lot better, but in my opinion is still below what I would consider an acceptable standard for a professional broadcaster.

To be fair to RNZ National, I think they are trying to be all things to everyone. They are trying to broadcast on multiple different platforms now, including different digital platforms and free to air. They are probably working with limited or reduced funding. They do need to realize though that because we are listening to digital platforms such as phones etc, we are likely listening with ear buds or headphones. When you have ear buds in or headphones, you hear every single little noise, right there, in your ear, up close and personal.

Here is a summary of the sound quality issues I have heard, and am still hearing now to a lesser extent:

1. Excessive sibilance (emphasis on the 's' sound). The excessive sibilance causes distortion on the radio. It is intrusive and distracting. In my opinion it should be monitored at the receiver and controlled at the source.

2. Echo. I first noticed this when listening to the Panel. It was always really bad during the Pre-Panel show. The problem has been reduced somewhat, but I think that the situation that causes it in the first place is still present. It appears that some of the studios have more than one microphone so that people can sit around a desk and talk to each other. I would have thought that from a radio broadcasting perspective, that would be just asking for trouble. If you listen now, when an announcer brings in a guest, or they bring in the announcer that is going to do the next show, you can hear when they fade in their microphone, it suddenly goes all echoey. Interviews with guests in the studio are difficult to listen to because of the echoey hollow sound.

3. Extraneous sounds from the studio. This is still a big issue. Mouse clicking, paper shuffling, doors opening and closing, chairs squeaking etc. Hearing these sorts of sounds can be distracting. Aren't radio broadcasting studios supposed to be quiet places? It is obvious to me that the microphones are just way to sensitive.

4. Excessive mouth sounds. Again - the microphones are to sensitive. From what I can tell this problem has been minimized. Imagine someone you don't know whispering into you ear. It's creepy.

5. The puff. For a while there was an issue with the 'p' sound. It was playing havoc with my speakers, rocking the cones back and forth. I'm pretty sure this cant be good for the speakers or amp. It seems to have been eliminated now though as I have not heard it for a while.

As a result of these problems, I have stopped listening to certain programs.

I can no longer listen to Kathryn Ryan. Despite me complaining several times, I can no longer tolerate her insistence on loudly shuffling papers around while talking. She also has a habit of typing on the keyboard and clicking the mouse among other things while a guest is speaking. It indicates to me that she is not engaged with the guest, and is doing other things like administrative tasks. She normally does it when the guest is a regular feature. It sounds unprofessional.

I have completely cut Jesse Mulligan out of my listening. His excessive sibilance is too distracting.

Listening to the news at 5pm is interesting, you can often hear the announcer for the Five O'clock report mucking around in the studio with the microphone on while the news is being read. You can hear them come into the studio and shift the chair around and do other things. Not good, unprofessional. Back when John Campbell was doing his stint, he really did sound like a bull in a china shop. I sent him a text telling him to stop mucking around with the microphone on.

I cant listen to the Panel anymore, especially since Wallace Chapman took over. They just cant seem to get any consistency in the sound quality.

Jim Mora on Sunday is probably the only program I can listen to. He seems to be able to get his levels right, he seems to be able to get consistent sound quality from all his interviewees and guests.

Doing some searching online I've learnt that excessive sibilance (and possibly distortion) can be caused by lossy compression. I have learnt that a lot of what we hear on RNZ National has been digitized more than once. Recordings from field reporters have presumably been recorded digitally and then re digitized for broadcast.

I would be very interested in anyone who is or has had a similar experience.

Cheers

cyril7

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#2341688 22-Oct-2019 10:45

Hi, I dont notice this on my old Pioneer in my car and I listen to Nat radio for an hour each way to and from work five days a week, i also do not hear it on various streams nor on Freeview, so I dont think its eminating from the studio with excessive sibilance.

However if your FM tuner has the incorrect (ie lower than spec) IF bandwidth you will get distinct siblilance, is it possible that your recievers are selecting a narrow IF when tuned to mono FM channels (Nat Radio is in mono) and this is causing the issue?

Cyril

bfginger

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#2341982 22-Oct-2019 18:14

Doing some searching online I've learnt that excessive sibilance (and possibly distortion) can be caused by lossy compression. I have learnt that a lot of what we hear on RNZ National has been digitized more than once. Recordings from field reporters have presumably been recorded digitally and then re digitized for broadcast.

They're likely leaving software to defaults which means poor quality 128kbit/s compression. Doubling up on that should be noticeable.

ilovemusic

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#2342535 23-Oct-2019 17:31

deesser:

I have completely cut Jesse Mulligan out of my listening. His excessive sibilance is too distracting.

ironic as mulligan is always berating his guests for incorrect microphone usage 😄

are your problems heard only in your car ?

have you had your car stereo checked for faults ?

radio performance in new car stereos is no longer important, i've noticed most new car radios have inferior radio performance to older units.

have you had your hearing tested ?

i listen to natradio in the car a lot and have not heard any problems.

my home listening is occasionally interrupted by various twittering noises etc. that appear to be atmospheric.

Fred99

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#2342574 23-Oct-2019 18:42

I listen to Radio NZ AM in my car. I kind of like the folksy lowfi sound.

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Fred99

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#2342581 23-Oct-2019 18:49

ilovemusic:

have you had your hearing tested ?

Actually as sibilance tends to be around 8k, if your hearing was truly buggered then you'd probably not hear it so much.

My hearing is a little buggered (age) but can still hear up to about 14k, which is somewhat of a miracle given the beating I've given the old lugholes over the decades.

I pity all the folks I see wearing headphones and in-ear devices all day long. They should read up on what that does to you - even if not turned up loud, it's constant. They'll find out in a few decades what they should have looked at now.

PolicyGuy

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#2342585 23-Oct-2019 19:06

Fred99:

I listen to Radio NZ AM in my car. I kind of like the folksy lowfi sound.

Lowfi is quite good enough to listen to Morning Report, or Kathryn Ryan, or Checkpoint [or even Jesse Mulligan :)]

And 567kHz works all the way from Wellington to Hawera, and round the west side of Mt Taranaki, too.
Probably in the north-eastern part of the South Island, too, though I've never tried.

Turn on the radio, it just works
:D

RUKI

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#2343624 25-Oct-2019 20:34

can anyone provide:

a. reason why they listen to the radio?

b. cool example of how listening to the radio had improved one's life and/or made it easier or less stressful?

I had one and only reason 15 years ago to listen to the Talk Radio for a few months - just to tune my ears to various accents. That's it. Do not listen to the radio for a long time.

lxsw20

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#2343634 25-Oct-2019 20:54

Some times it's just nice to listen to a bit of banter/talk rather than music. Depends what mood I'm in really. If I'm traveling with people I tend to have music on, and tend to have radio on if by myself. I tend to avoid boomer radio (talkback) and listen to something like Hauraki/The Rock, but to each their own.

richms

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#2343651 25-Oct-2019 21:18

RUKI:

can anyone provide:

a. reason why they listen to the radio?

b. cool example of how listening to the radio had improved one's life and/or made it easier or less stressful?

I had one and only reason 15 years ago to listen to the Talk Radio for a few months - just to tune my ears to various accents. That's it. Do not listen to the radio for a long time.

I have been advised what appliances adrian and john have on sale. I have been told that there is some important information coming up soon, I have been told what happened on some crap TV show that is on the affiliated TV network last night and invited to call in and share what I think of that trash. Occasionally I have heard a low-fidellity compressed to hell and back version of a song I know.

Richard rich.ms

rogercruse

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#2343681 26-Oct-2019 08:24

Fred99: I listen to Radio NZ AM in my car. I kind of like the folksy lowfi sound.

Also tried listening to internet radio via my mobile phone and bluetooth to the car speakers. A greater choice of stations and with a cleaner sound. The phone network offering slightly better than FM radio, however this option isn't too good for driving too far away from Auckland.

alasta

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#2343683 26-Oct-2019 08:42

RUKI:
can anyone provide:

a. reason why they listen to the radio?

b. cool example of how listening to the radio had improved one's life and/or made it easier or less stressful?

I had one and only reason 15 years ago to listen to the Talk Radio for a few months - just to tune my ears to various accents. That's it. Do not listen to the radio for a long time.

Morning Report and Checkpoint are an important part of my day because they keep me up to date while I’m traveling to and from work. Each to their own.

shk292

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#2343754 26-Oct-2019 10:20

alasta:
RUKI:

can anyone provide:

a. reason why they listen to the radio?

b. cool example of how listening to the radio had improved one's life and/or made it easier or less stressful?

I had one and only reason 15 years ago to listen to the Talk Radio for a few months - just to tune my ears to various accents. That's it. Do not listen to the radio for a long time.

Morning Report and Checkpoint are an important part of my day because they keep me up to date while I’m traveling to and from work. Each to their own.

Same for me - I spend 8-9 hours per week commuting in my car and it's good to have some mental stimulation instead of listening to the music equivalent of chewing gum. I also listen to audio books via the library and podcasts via Spotify.