Just give me the Rav4 Prime, Toyota. Hybrid, ev and charging all in one. Would so buy.

https://www.toyota.com/rav4prime/

Quinny:

 

Just give me the Rav4 Prime, Toyota. Hybrid, ev and charging all in one. Would so buy.

 

https://www.toyota.com/rav4prime/

 

I liked the prime until I realised that it's electric then, petrol there is no hybrid function. It's effectively electric for short trips, then internal combustion for longer trips, carrying around extra weight.

fearandloathing:

 

I liked the prime until I realised that it's electric then, petrol there is no hybrid function. It's effectively electric for short trips, then internal combustion for longer trips, carrying around extra weight.

 

u wot m8... 😛

From the recent MotorTrend review:

 

The new RAV4 Prime is the plug-in hybrid version of the RAV4. Like the RAV4 Hybrid, the RAV4 Prime sports a 177-hp and 165-lb-ft 2.5-liter I-4 engine mated to electric motors and an e-CVT up front, another electric motor at the rear axle, and a battery pack underneath the rear seats. 

 

Quinny:

 

Just give me the Rav4 Prime, Toyota. Hybrid, ev and charging all in one. Would so buy.

 

https://www.toyota.com/rav4prime/

 

302hp = 225kW

0-60mph (97km/h) in 5.4 seconds. One of the fastest cars in Toyota stable, apparently quicker than the 2.0 Supra

But unlikley we will see it in NZ. Even in markets where it is sold it is available in very low volumes and quite tricky to get your hands on. Toyota will be focusing on supplying markets with steep penalties for having a fleet that is too high emmiting.

fearandloathing:

 

 

 

I liked the prime until I realised that it's electric then, petrol there is no hybrid function. It's effectively electric for short trips, then internal combustion for longer trips, carrying around extra weight.

 

It's a plug in hybrid, same basic tech as the prius prime, and many vehicles from other brands.

Simple explication of the tech is that the first 68km of the day is done all electric, then it fires up the petrol engine to run in a hybrid mode for another 750km odd assuming you start with a full tank of fuel. While running in hybrid mode it gets about 6L/100km. Not quite as good as the 4.8L/100km that the non plug in rav4 hybrid is rated, but still very respectable.

Slightly more detailed explanation is that if you floor the rav4 hybrid, in order to get the 225kW mentioned above, it will fire up the petrol engine and have that and the electric side of the system work in tandem. This is unlike some plug in hybrids like the BMW i3 REX & Holden volt, but I think a reasonable compromise for rare harsh acceleration. Also plug in hybrids generally have a mode like "Hold, Save or Charge", forcing it to run in hybrid mode while there is still charge in the battery pack. This can either provide a larger buffer to running the battery flat if you plan to do something like driving up a mountain with a big trailer, or can allow for zero emissions running at points of there journey where the environment is more sensitive (urban area's)

Plug in hybrids are ideal for people that have a decent commute / daily travel of say 30km each way, or 60km each way if they have a charge port at work, but need the safety net of a 800km+ total range for say occasional intercity trips. Means most of there running can be electric, but they don't have to deal with the shorter range and dependence on chargers that comes with a pure electric car.

Best of both worlds in that you effectively get an electric car that seamlessly turns into a petrol car when you hit its range limitation, and you can pick either fuel (electricity or petrol) to put into it based on availability. Also means that you don't have to lug around and pay for a $30,000+ very large battery pack which you will only be occasionally fairly utilized. With the safety net of a petrol engine the pack can be sized to accommodate typical daily usage only.

Worst of both worlds in that you have two fuel systems & drive-trains to lug around and maintain both a drive-trains.

I have owned Pure petrol car, a normal hybrid, a plug in hybrid, and a pure electric car. All are fine, basically it is about picking the right car for the application....

Should note that a decade ago, when the best (non $120k+ tesla electric car was a Nissan leaf with a 130km range, and fast chargers were rare to non existent, the case for plug in hybrids was a lot more compelling than it was today. Today the best Nissan leaf has a 364km rated range (other sub $85k EV's like the Kona get a 450km range), and the charge.net network covers most of the country. As such there are more use cases that can be accommodated by pure electric than a decade ago.

Still some market segments (like larger, sub $90k SUV's, utes etc) don't have pure electric offerings, but do have plug in hybrid offerings (PHEV Outlander is available now. PHEV Ranger / Everest is expected late next year).

fearandloathing:

 

Quinny:

 

Just give me the Rav4 Prime, Toyota. Hybrid, ev and charging all in one. Would so buy.

 

https://www.toyota.com/rav4prime/

 

 

I liked the prime until I realised that it's electric then, petrol there is no hybrid function. It's effectively electric for short trips, then internal combustion for longer trips, carrying around extra weight.

 

Are you sure about that? I thought it used both engine and motors together if you want to get very quick acceleration. Then you ca either use it as a pure EV, as a hybrid, or as a petrol. At least that is how I thought it worked. I don't expect to see it in NZ though. Toyota did previously release a Rav4 EV, but I think it mainly only reached the US market.

But I do think the combustion engine is a bit of a waste of space in the prime, as 95% of trips can probably be done without even engaging the petrol engine. So why not just put a huge battery in it... put some slightly more powerful motors, and get rid of the engine and tank. But I guess the problem at the moment is the price of batteries, as 40% of the cost of an EV is apparently the battery price.

Scott3:

 

Quinny:

 

Just give me the Rav4 Prime, Toyota. Hybrid, ev and charging all in one. Would so buy.

 

https://www.toyota.com/rav4prime/

 

 

302hp = 225kW

 

0-60mph (97km/h) in 5.4 seconds. One of the fastest cars in Toyota stable, apparently quicker than the 2.0 Supra

 

 

 

And the Supra is essentially just a BMW anyway.

There are some great EVs coming out of Europe at the moment. So things are getting a lot better in the EV space, to bring prices down. TheTesla 2, or whatever they call it will hopefully be a game-changer in terms of affordability.

mattwnz:

 

Are you sure about that? I thought it used both engine and motors together if you want to get very quick acceleration. Then you ca either use it as a pure EV, as a hybrid, or as a petrol. At least that is how I thought it worked. I don't expect to see it in NZ though. Toyota did previously release a Rav4 EV, but I think it mainly only reached the US market.

 

 

 

I was, what I was reading was obviously wrong.

Toyota Launches New Model RAV4 PHEV | Toyota | Global Newsroom | Toyota Motor Corporation Official Global Website

Clearly states the RAV4 has BEV and HEV.

I guess the RAV4 PHEV is back on top of my list as my next car. 

mattwnz:

 

Are you sure about that? I thought it used both engine and motors together if you want to get very quick acceleration. Then you ca either use it as a pure EV, as a hybrid, or as a petrol. At least that is how I thought it worked. I don't expect to see it in NZ though. Toyota did previously release a Rav4 EV, but I think it mainly only reached the US market.

 

 

 

But I do think the combustion engine is a bit of a waste of space in the prime, as 95% of trips can probably be done without even engaging the petrol engine. So why not just put a huge battery in it... put some slightly more powerful motors, and get rid of the engine and tank. But I guess the problem at the moment is the price of batteries, as 40% of the cost of an EV is apparently the battery price.

 

Why not put in a massive battery instead?

You correctly identified cost as the main issue. A kona electric (64kWh battery) is priced at something like $40k more than the petrol version. A decent chunk of that in the battery.

An engine, fuel tank etc are actually pretty cheap to produce. Swapping out say $5k of engine & fuel tank for say $40k of more batteries will make the car very expensive.

Other factors:

- Weight - a say 80kWh battery is heavy.

- Space in the platform - Rav4 may not have been designed to fit a massive battery under it.

- Global battery supply - its pretty tight atm. Going the PHEV route allows 3 - 5 times as many cars to be build with the same kWh of batteries as going pure electric.

- BEV's still have less range than petrol hybrids. The 450km range of the kona is really good, but still dwarfed by the 800km range or the Rav4 prime, and PHEV's can be topped off with petrol in 5 mins and go again if needed. Some buyers will be reluctant to jump to pure electric, so the safety net of a PHEV will appeal to them.