Helicopter with no navigation lights

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MikeB4
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#2912554 11-May-2022 09:35

We sometimes get the RNZAF NH90s overhead in the evening and they too sometimes will have their nav lights off. I believe they run a training operation out of Trentham NZDF Base from time to time.

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elpenguino

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#2912555 11-May-2022 09:37

johno1234:

Well, that's rather hard to fathom when the Police themselves are quite clear that the aircraft are flown by civilian pilots. I think Advanced Flight would also be quite surprised to hear that someone else is operating their aircraft that they are contracted to operate...

I'll pull my head in now as you clearly are more authoritative on this than Advanced Flight and the Police. Nothing more to add, really.

It's possible you are both right - the pilot may not go through boot camp and all the training at the police college but may be sworn as a police office to meet a particular legal function.

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#2912561 11-May-2022 09:43

@johno1234 maybe it changed when they obtained the new helicopters

Bung

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#2912563 11-May-2022 09:48

The Eagle helicopter have had a problem in the past with dickheads shining lasers. If they have to hover maybe air traffic control can allow them to go dark if nothing else is in the area.

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#2912567 11-May-2022 09:59

johno1234:

I'm interested to hear how it is that you are going for jollies aboard the Eagle?

Years ago I had a business relationship with a company in Auckland that had the wet lease contract for the Eagle helicopter. I was invited to go out on a daytime operational flight with their civilian pilot and two Police officers. One part of the flight we flew extensively over the Waitakere Ranges looking for cannabis plots hidden in the bush. The plots show up like dogs’ proverbials due to their colour.

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Oblivian

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#2912600 11-May-2022 11:03

It was reddit'd some years ago too it would seem.

Looks due to the way they operate (below approach paths, at night when most visual/VFR is in the hangar) as long is tower/control is aware other stuff can be sent around and live monitored via radar and TCAS etc while needing to go dark for periods.

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#2912637 11-May-2022 13:34

MikeB4:

We sometimes get the RNZAF NH90s overhead in the evening and they too sometimes will have their nav lights off. I believe they run a training operation out of Trentham NZDF Base from time to time.

The SAS do helicopter based training around Auckland from time to time.

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frankv

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#2912679 11-May-2022 15:11

Rust:

I'm not familiar with the rules so just guessing here, but logic says aircraft lights should be visible to other aircraft, not necessarily the ground (except perhaps when landing). So perhaps the in-flight lights are somewhat directional and difficult to spot from the ground.

Good thought, but wrong.

Aircraft need to be visible to other aircraft, including those below. There's some CAA rule somewhere which specifies the visibility of nav lights.

Rust

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#2912692 11-May-2022 15:43

frankv:

Rust:

I'm not familiar with the rules so just guessing here, but logic says aircraft lights should be visible to other aircraft, not necessarily the ground (except perhaps when landing). So perhaps the in-flight lights are somewhat directional and difficult to spot from the ground.

Good thought, but wrong.

Aircraft need to be visible to other aircraft, including those below. There's some CAA rule somewhere which specifies the visibility of nav lights.

Yeah, fair point. I clearly didn't think it through too well :)

Linux

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#2912698 11-May-2022 16:06

Aircraft are not allowed to fly under AHB but eagle is permitted

Mehrts

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#2912700 11-May-2022 16:22

RNZAF aircraft routinely operate at night without visible lighting, but with infrared instead. Night vision goggles are sensitive to the IR part of the electromagnetic spectrum, and therefore the aircrews can see each other just fine.

There would be limitations around using IR lighting in busy areas I imagine, but that's not my proficiency.

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skyplonk

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#2912721 11-May-2022 17:49

Linux:

@johno1234 maybe it changed when they obtained the new helicopters

They have been civilian pilots for a long time. Airwork held the contract for the old machines - Twin Squirrels (some of the highest flight time examples in the world!) and more recently Advanced Flight with the Bell 429s, have been civilian pilots since at least 2009 - I know 2 of the pilots who flew for Airwork and transferred over to Advanced Flight when the 429s came. Have a police flight uniform etc, but are not sworn officers and do not have power off arrest etc.

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#2912734 11-May-2022 19:05

skyplonk:
Linux:

@johno1234 maybe it changed when they obtained the new helicopters

They have been civilian pilots for a long time. Airwork held the contract for the old machines - Twin Squirrels (some of the highest flight time examples in the world!) and more recently Advanced Flight with the Bell 429s, have been civilian pilots since at least 2009 - I know 2 of the pilots who flew for Airwork and transferred over to Advanced Flight when the 429s came. Have a police flight uniform etc, but are not sworn officers and do not have power off arrest etc.

Ok maybe I could be incorrect about the pilots sworn officers

skyplonk

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#2912744 11-May-2022 20:28

Linux:
Ok maybe I could be incorrect about the pilots sworn officers

Its not outside of the realms of possibility that there was a pilot(s) who was also a Police officer (or the other way around!). Just like Airforce engineers who never flew for the Airforce but got a PPL/CPL/ATPL privately and then leave to fly in the civil world.

Senecio

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#2912753 11-May-2022 21:14

Makes a nice change that it has been out east for a few nights. Living in West Auckland I swear that Eagle helicopter is landing in my back yard most nights.

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