Do we have an excess of road policing in New Zealand?

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487 posts

Ultimate Geek

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#1385144 10-Sep-2015 18:31

I'm talking about people who don't indicate, or indicate incorrectly at roundabouts, or don't give way, or drive at 85 in a 100 zone but speed up to 100 when they get to the overtaking lane, or dive at 70 in a 50 zone then stay at 70 when they get to a 80 or 100 zone, or drive well under the limit but don't pull over to let others pass, or any one of a dozen other things. I see people doing these things while police are around all the time but they never seem to get stopped for them. Do the police just not notice, do they not care, or are they told not to bother? My personal opinion (no science to back this up) is that if police focused more on some of these "minor" driver behaviours it would help improve the standard of driving overall, and have a roll-on effect to better habits with "big ticket" items, e.g. speeding, running red lights, etc. - a bit like the old saying: Look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves.

I agree with you that NZ police aren't properly policing minor offences and put far too much focus on speed.
But this is coming from a European who has driven 10 years on the continent and 6 years in the UK

Having lived here for a few months now there are the following things I've picked up about driving in NZ that REALLY do my head in:

* people driving with their head lights off when it's proper dark (+ people with lighting issues in general)
* people using flush lanes to get ahead (q jumping)
* q jumping in general, using turning lanes to go straight etc.
* people using T2/T3 lanes with only one person in the car
* driving well below the speed limit in the inner lanes
* cars alongside each other that make no attempt to overtake on motorways, thereby taking away the opportunity for drivers to pass
* driving well below the speed limit on country roads and then speeding up at passing lanes, again blocking opportunities to overtake safely

I really feel the NZ police force should enforce the "keep left unless passing" rule more strict, fine people with bad lighting and act upon q jumping hotspots (this could even be automated)

Haere taka mua, taka muri; kaua e wha.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1385719 11-Sep-2015 15:02

ScuL:
But this is coming from a European who has driven 10 years on the continent and 6 years in the UK
Having lived here for a few months now there are the following things I've picked up about driving in NZ that REALLY do my head in:
...
* q jumping in general, using turning lanes to go straight etc.
....

When I came here 12 years ago I called Kerry Wodham on News Talk ZB Radio (topic was about traffic something) and told her that I would use an opportunity to thank every driver in Auckland for being so polite and that seeing numerous cyclists on the road for me is an indication of two things: clean environment and general public tolerance.

12 years later and I did not change my mind - majority are very polite drivers and I will give public tolerance on the road - 9 out of 10 and thank every driver for being polite again.

There is some stupidity happening now and then on the roads and pedestrian crossings - but that is no different from observing weird behaviour in a corporate environment, at meetings, at how people disregard set up rules, instructions or common sense. Do not expect them behave differently when behind the steering wheel. Human nature...

Some drivers do not think ahead of what could happen next or what would be the best and safest and most efficient way for them to pass that intersection without impacting the rest etc.
As for lanes and road lights - some were built without putting many thoughts in how traffic would flow.

Friendly sparky once told me that he observed another fellow electrician fixing the road lights in my area and was wondering sarcastically how did I feel about it. I knew what he was talking about = 1minute and 45 seconds waiting when there is no traffic. Well, I am tolerant and patient Auckland driver :-) I can wait...

P.S. Discovered last Friday (never new that is possible).
I was going to pick up something from West Auckland (thanks Geekzone mates) and have chosen the wrong lane - waiting to turn right. Jeep on the right with the big guy and few passengers - signalled me that I can stand in from of them to allow traffic behind me to go straight on. I did that and lights changed but there were no green. Guy from that Jeep behind was waiving hand to show that I can back up closer to them. As I was standing on the white lane and not interfering with those turning - I was wondering why the red is not turning into green (The guy from behind patiently was observing my ignorance). When the lights did not change to green again for the third time he got out of his car, approached me and told me in a very friendly voice that there is some sort of sensors and I need to back a bit more - otherwise lights will not turn green for all our lane at all. No honking, no raised voices from the queue which I have just created. People who perhaps were rushing back home after work were waiting politely for me standing there. I backed a bit, the light turned green, everyone was happy. For me (little bit embarrassed) it was a perfect example of peole's kindness and I'll give to all those in that queue 10 out of 10 for their patience and tolerance...

TonyR1973

199 posts

Master Geek

#1387310 14-Sep-2015 16:51

MikeB4:

My opinion is there is four contributing factors in NZ.....
A, poor roading infrastructure
B, age and condition of the vehicle stock
C, low general driver skill
D, very low compliance with road rules

A, B and D are mitigated by addressing C.

The problem is that focus is on compliance rather than competence is the target the government sets.

If you've got a WoF, valid vehicle and driver's licences and driving at or below the speed limit the chances are you'll never know you're a crap driver until you plow into a parked car or fail to give way and cause a crash and even then as a NZer you'll class it as a "fender bender" and call it inevitable and inconsequential to avoid some healthy self examination.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1388815 17-Sep-2015 08:40

.....

The problem is that focus is on compliance rather than competence is the target the government sets.

If you've got a WoF, valid vehicle and driver's licences and driving at or below the speed limit the chances are you'll never know you're a crap driver until you plow into a parked car or fail to give way and cause a crash and even then as a NZer you'll class it as a "fender bender" and call it inevitable and inconsequential to avoid some healthy self examination.

Japanese Racers once called roads in the Russian Far East "The Best Worst Roads on a Planet" - for them to practice in the harsh environment.
Roads over there degrade every winter because of ice and frozen soil and subzero temperatures.
One had to be awesome driver just to survive in those conditions.

Road conditions and mad driving behaviour where compliance is unheard of - builds up special driving skills of constant vigilance - i.e. anticipation of non-stop hazards and threats which could come unexpectedly from anywhere anytime.

Think about awesome New Zealand swimmers - swimming with sharks and staying alive - you can't learn those skills in the swimming pool :-)

But it is hard for many to learn to be vigilant on New Zealand roads where amount of hazards is low compared to the other parts of the world.

P.S. yesterday morning in 2 minutes two drivers created collision situation – one on the intersection and one few meters later in front of me. Thanks to my fast reaction nothing has happened. Reviewed dash cam video later - if police were there - $150 out of their pocket straight away for “dangerous driving”. I think it was not intentional, just lack of their driving skills. If they've crashed their cars and thousands of $$ went out of their pockets - perhaps that could contribute towards learning how to drive...

As a reminder to all - third party insurance is a "must have" thing.

TonyR1973

199 posts

Master Geek

#1399153 2-Oct-2015 22:30

RUKI: Japanese Racers once called roads in the Russian Far East "The Best Worst Roads on a Planet" - for them to practice in the harsh environment.
Roads over there degrade every winter because of ice and frozen soil and subzero temperatures.

You forgot communist grade construction.

RUKI: As a reminder to all - third party insurance is a "must have" thing.

I'm afraid we'll certainly have to agree to disagree on that one. I have no time and certainly no respect for insurance companies.

RUKI

1402 posts

Uber Geek

#1399505 3-Oct-2015 23:16

TonyR1973:

RUKI: As a reminder to all - third party insurance is a "must have" thing.

I'm afraid we'll certainly have to agree to disagree on that one. I have no time and certainly no respect for insurance companies.

Insurance is a personal choice.

Real life situation:
Lady in her golden late 80-s, deaf and too short to see what is behind her through the rear window was backing from the car park at the supermarket and smashed the door of another car. Her car was insured, including 3-rd party insurance. Lady apologized and her insurance company had fixed the door of the damaged car in 3 days. Respect to the old lady and respect to her insurance company (it was AA if one would ask).

When you'll reach twice your age - you will have plenty of time and perhaps will not be in a hurry, but reaction may not be as good as it is now. You would need insurance by then. There could be situations when you could be very tired after long hours and fatigue may affect you even in your 40-s (I am aware of examples of middle age boys working in NOC on the 12 hour shifts had nearly missed road accidents because of being very tired)

FYI: There are insurers who's "3-rd party insurance" has provision for fixing damage to your car up to $3K if you have identified the person who caused the accident. That is handy considering that that insurance cost peanuts.
You might be good driver, but there might be tired person in the other car...
Think about it.

Kyanar

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#1399514 4-Oct-2015 00:05

TonyR1973:

I'm afraid we'll certainly have to agree to disagree on that one. I have no time and certainly no respect for insurance companies.

And if you ever cause an accident, I certainly hope you'll do the right thing and pay up the entire cost of fixing the other car, at once (not in instalments!)

And if you can't afford that, then well, insurance is a must have. Simple really.

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Batman

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#1399516 4-Oct-2015 00:29

Will I ever be able afford to fix a Mercedes S class?

TonyR1973

199 posts

Master Geek

#1399520 4-Oct-2015 01:56

Kyanar: And if you ever cause an accident, I certainly hope you'll do the right thing and pay up the entire cost of fixing the other car, at once (not in instalments!)

And if you can't afford that, then well, insurance is a must have. Simple really.

If they also chose to not have insurance, which is the only time where that scenario may happen, they would be assuming the risk I might not be able to immediately pay in full, just as I have. Otherwise, it wouldn't affect them as their insurer would be the ones being paid in instalment which doesn't affect them in the slightest.

TonyR1973

199 posts

Master Geek

#1399521 4-Oct-2015 01:58

joker97: Will I ever be able afford to fix a Mercedes S class?

Let's not jump straight to the worst case band of scenarios without first evaluating the likelihood of them even occurring.

TonyR1973

199 posts

Master Geek

#1399522 4-Oct-2015 02:04

RUKI: When you'll reach twice your age - you will have plenty of time and perhaps will not be in a hurry, but reaction may not be as good as it is now. You would need insurance by then. There could be situations when you could be very tired after long hours and fatigue may affect you even in your 40-s (I am aware of examples of middle age boys working in NOC on the 12 hour shifts had nearly missed road accidents because of being very tired)

Being risk aware is always part of the equation.

RUKI: FYI: There are insurers who's "3-rd party insurance" has provision for fixing damage to your car up to $3K if you have identified the person who caused the accident. That is handy considering that that insurance cost peanuts.

I'm not aware of any that don't. Some even cover up to $4k for UTP claims.

RUKI: You might be good driver, but there might be tired person in the other car...
Think about it.

I have, hence my position.

MikeB4

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#1399553 4-Oct-2015 07:41

TonyR1973:
RUKI: Japanese Racers once called roads in the Russian Far East "The Best Worst Roads on a Planet" - for them to practice in the harsh environment.
Roads over there degrade every winter because of ice and frozen soil and subzero temperatures.

You forgot communist grade construction.

RUKI: As a reminder to all - third party insurance is a "must have" thing.

I'm afraid we'll certainly have to agree to disagree on that one. I have no time and certainly no respect for insurance companies.

Anyone driving without insurance is a bad driver and a bad citizen. Full insurance should be compulsory and penalties for driving without it should include confiscation of the vehicle.

Dratsab

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#1399600 4-Oct-2015 10:14

MikeB4:
TonyR1973:
RUKI: Japanese Racers once called roads in the Russian Far East "The Best Worst Roads on a Planet" - for them to practice in the harsh environment.
Roads over there degrade every winter because of ice and frozen soil and subzero temperatures.

You forgot communist grade construction.

RUKI: As a reminder to all - third party insurance is a "must have" thing.

I'm afraid we'll certainly have to agree to disagree on that one. I have no time and certainly no respect for insurance companies.

Anyone driving without insurance is a bad driver and a bad citizen. Full insurance should be compulsory and penalties for driving without it should include confiscation of the vehicle.

While I agree insurance should be compulsory I don't see the need in going way over the top. Your disagreement with someone else's decision certainly doesn't warrant name calling.

freitasm

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Geekzone

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#1399601 4-Oct-2015 10:19

TonyR1973:
Kyanar: And if you ever cause an accident, I certainly hope you'll do the right thing and pay up the entire cost of fixing the other car, at once (not in instalments!)

And if you can't afford that, then well, insurance is a must have. Simple really.

If they also chose to not have insurance, which is the only time where that scenario may happen, they would be assuming the risk I might not be able to immediately pay in full, just as I have. Otherwise, it wouldn't affect them as their insurer would be the ones being paid in instalment which doesn't affect them in the slightest.

So you think it's fair for a third party to have to pay an excess and lose insurance discount because of your disregard for the social contract?

surfisup1000

5288 posts

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#1399608 4-Oct-2015 11:08

This red light runner was not even marginal . Although, i've seen worse at this intersection, such as the old fellah who ran the red light from the right and proceeded up the road on the wrong side.

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