New bike buffer zone law.

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118 posts

Master Geek

#1380233 5-Sep-2015 13:33

ajobbins: There is a difference between lane splitting (with traffic at speed) and lane filtering (traffic very slow or stopped).

Lane filtering is legal in NZ. In Wellington it is actively encouraged, with green "advanced stop boxes" at many intersections.

ajobbins

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#1380243 5-Sep-2015 14:09

Ouranos:
ajobbins: There is a difference between lane splitting (with traffic at speed) and lane filtering (traffic very slow or stopped).

Lane filtering is legal in NZ. In Wellington it is actively encouraged, with green "advanced stop boxes" at many intersections.

For cyclists, but not motorcyclists yes?

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tdgeek

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#1380246 5-Sep-2015 14:21

Lias:
tdgeek: Motorbikeers (I am one) that lane split in moving traffic

Really? It's safer for the riders, and reduce congestions.

http://www.cycleworld.com/2015/06/02/ama-study-finds-lane-splitting-increases-rider-saftey/

Skimmed the article, thanks for that. I don't buy it. Lanes are not wide, factor in car wing mirrors. Riding to work the other day a guy lane split in stopped traffic, not much gap taking mirrors into account. I don't bother, in ess I go the inner lane, and I will meet the red light. Gridlock suits me!

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#1380248 5-Sep-2015 14:25

Ouranos:
Lias:
tdgeek: Motorbikeers (I am one) that lane split in moving traffic

Really? It's safer for the riders, and reduce congestions.

http://www.cycleworld.com/2015/06/02/ama-study-finds-lane-splitting-increases-rider-saftey/

Lane splitting (if it includes overtaking on the left of moving traffic) is illegal, for both bicycles and motorbikes. Having said that, lane splitting is so common that I am surprised when a bicycle or motorbike stays in the middle of a lane in the general flow of traffic.

That's what I do mostly. I get to work 18 seconds later, but I get there

tdgeek

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#1380249 5-Sep-2015 14:27

ajobbins:
Ouranos:
Lias:
tdgeek: Motorbikeers (I am one) that lane split in moving traffic

Really? It's safer for the riders, and reduce congestions.

http://www.cycleworld.com/2015/06/02/ama-study-finds-lane-splitting-increases-rider-saftey/

Lane splitting (if it includes overtaking on the left of moving traffic) is illegal, for both bicycles and motorbikes. Having said that, lane splitting is so common that I am surprised when a bicycle or motorbike stays in the middle of a lane in the general flow of traffic.

There is a difference between lane splitting (with traffic at speed) and lane filtering (traffic very slow or stopped). The former is highly dangerous for the motorcyclist and other road users, the latter is an effective traffic management technique that benefits all road users when executed safely. Here is Victoria AU, it's technically not legal to 'filter', but a blind eye is turned unless you do something dumb (I've filtered past many a cop car and they don't bat an eyelid). In NSW, they recently made it legal providing traffic is stationary or under 25km/h

Agree 100% . I'm not even sure of the rules in nz

Ouranos

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Master Geek

#1380251 5-Sep-2015 14:31

ajobbins:
Ouranos:
ajobbins: There is a difference between lane splitting (with traffic at speed) and lane filtering (traffic very slow or stopped).

Lane filtering is legal in NZ. In Wellington it is actively encouraged, with green "advanced stop boxes" at many intersections.

For cyclists, but not motorcyclists yes?

Correct, though motorcyclists often illegally use the stop boxes if the traffic lights interrupt their illegal lane splitting.

Ouranos

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Master Geek

#1380262 5-Sep-2015 14:34

tdgeek: I'm not even sure of the rules in nz

This is a good summary of the rules: http://www.rideforever.co.nz/assets/Uploads/PDFs/ACC7009-RIDEFOREVER-Infosheet-FA.pdf

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tdgeek

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#1380263 5-Sep-2015 14:38

Ouranos:
tdgeek: I'm not even sure of the rules in nz

This is a good summary of the rules: http://www.rideforever.co.nz/assets/Uploads/PDFs/ACC7009-RIDEFOREVER-Infosheet-FA.pdf

Cheers for that, so it's legal, and based on the passing rules, as long as safe.

groynk

234 posts

Master Geek

#1380391 5-Sep-2015 20:19

Jase2985:
groynk:

Yes it doesn't matter if the cyclist (or scooter, or skateboarder, quad bike or tractor) is right in the middle of the road I don't think its a good idea to pass dangerously close.

The reason they are travelling far from the kurb may not be apparent to you, but it probably exists (at least in their view).
Try a friendly toot if you are really crawling behind them? they can't really ride around looking backwards.

Now those weekend riders sound really annoying.
Run them down! (sarcasm. don't, just to be clear)
They are probably even worse in their cars.

I ride the same roads, and there is not a single reason to ride out from the curb, they choose to because they think that are going to get a puncher, the roads here get swept at least every 2 months and there is little in the way of debris on the side of the road. Ive never had any issues.

the sad thing is im waiting for the day i will hit one and not have a near miss, its bound to happen as the odds catch up, and im 99% sure what if/when i do it wont be my fault.

if they are riding in the middle of the road, you cant call the police to complain as there is no way to identify them. they can complain about cars but cars cant complain about them.

I feel for you if they are really being dicks as much as you say they are, but please don't think that justifies hitting them and calling it their fault.
Attitudes like this are exactly why the buffer law is proposed, I think it will convince more people to give more space than they otherwise would. Reduce the odds of hitting them.

Those of you saying that the roads can't support this law, what do you do on those roads right now??? I can only assume you are waiting for a sensible passing gap or turning a blind eye and gunning past within centimetres? What would change under the proposed law?

Jase2985

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#1380400 5-Sep-2015 20:32

i wouldnt even consider hitting them on purpose. but when someone fails to give way at a roundabout sooner or later they are going to get hit by the person they should have gave way too.

groynk

234 posts

Master Geek

#1380526 6-Sep-2015 11:08

Jase2985: i wouldnt even consider hitting them on purpose. but when someone fails to give way at a roundabout sooner or later they are going to get hit by the person they should have gave way too.

I'm talking about passing them closely (risking hitting them) and calling it their fault for not being far enough left.

04fuxake

64 posts

Master Geek

#1380946 7-Sep-2015 10:11

k1w1k1d: I ride a bike and drive cars and trucks, so looking at it from both sides of the fence.

Not sure that setting a clearance distance is the way to go.

I would prefer that cyclists and drivers use their common sense to allow both to safely travel on our roads.
Both need to be prepared to give way at times to get the best outcome for a particular situation.

A disturbing number of NZ drivers don't have the ability to negotiate their way out of a driveway without killing someone.

04fuxake

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Master Geek

#1380949 7-Sep-2015 10:14

Talkiet: Here's my contribution... If cyclists want this, how about an exchange where they become identifiable and accountable for their actions?

That means
- Cycling license
- Registration for bikes so owners can be made responsible if riders can't be identified
- Number plates
- WOF

Etc.

What? That's unfair because of [reasons]? I thought that's what you'd say :-)

Cheers - N

Motorists have all of those and they still drive like retards.

mdooher

Hmm, what to write...
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#1380972 7-Sep-2015 10:29

plod:
mdooher:
qyiet:
MikeAqua: Not wanting to start a car vs bike war, but a few thoughts.

The proposed new law is that cars give cyclist 1m of breathing room in areas with speed limit of less than 60km and 1.5m on faster roads.

Wording on this would be very important. For instance if I was stopped at a red light, and a bike sneaks up the side of the traffic queue to the front of the queue within 1m of me am I now breaking the law?

or better yet, I'm slowing down or in crawling traffic, does the bike that passes me on the left get a ticket for clearly breaking the law? No, because the road rules only apply to cars

do I get a ticket for hitting him when I turn left? I shouldn't because legally he shouldn't have been passing me
if a cyclist can pass you on the left then you haven't obeyed the keep left rule. I make sure once I pass a cyclist that I then travel as far left as possible. You can by law only pass on the left if the traffic is stationary, if not pass on the right. As a motocylist I have looked in to the rules for under taking, can't see it being different to a cyclist

Incorrect, the law says you need to keep as far to the left as practicable, not as far to the left as possible. If I drove so close to the footpath that a cyclist physically couldn't pass on the left I would smack my mirror etc on bus stop signs, pedestrian handbags and parking meters.

Cyclists may not like it but the law says they may not pass a moving motor vehicle on the left unless they are in a separate lane. As for councils that put straight through cycle lanes on the left of a left turn lane... they should be locked up for shear stupidity.

Matthew

04fuxake

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Master Geek

#1380978 7-Sep-2015 10:37

To be honest..... unless you've actually spent time RIDING a bike (and I include scooters/motorbikes in this) on NZ roads, you are NOT in a position to comment on what should or should not happen, IMO.

Ask yourself this, would you let your kids ride a bike to school or their friends house? If not, ask yourself why. It won't be because they don't have registration or insurance or any of the other excuses that get thrown around. No, it will be because deep down you know the roads aren't safe and *we* let that happen.

The Dutch got their safe roads because they were sick of kids being killed by cars. Kiwis just buy bigger and bigger cars and then run them over in our driveways.

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