Christchurch Mosque Shooting

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BDFL - Memuneh
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#2203095 21-Mar-2019 21:52

Here is the NewsHub version of the story about the hijab.

The NZ Herald story had the account of a meeting that is not reported in the Newshub version.

freitasm

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#2203097 21-Mar-2019 21:54

And the MSN/RNZ version:

Diocesan School for Girls is a private Anglican school in Epsom.

A teacher, who wanted to remain anonymous, said two Muslim sisters raised the issue of wearing a hijab to another teacher a number of weeks ago, who then asked Principal Heather McRae for guidance.

This week, Ms McRae told staff that visible religious items, including the hijab, were against school policy, the teacher said.

Staff were stunned when Ms McRae announced that it had always been that way, he said.

"It's essentially a discriminatory practise," he said.

"It's an Anglican school but it's made very clear to us that members of all faiths or no faith are welcome there."

He said not allowing people to express their faith was exclusionary.

The teacher said he understood that a uniform helped to maintain standards but he an exception should be made for hijab.

She said parents signed up to the uniform policies when they joined the school.

But the teacher said it was "non-sensical" to allow non-Muslim students to wear the hijab on Friday but not allow Muslims wear it every day.

"It's about freedom of religion and being sincerely inclusive."

He said the school had missed a very good opportunity to show leadership in this area.

dejadeadnz

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#2203122 21-Mar-2019 22:24

Someone should make a complaint to the Human Rights Commission. This POS school and the principal should be taken to the Human Rights Review Tribunal. The principal is also unfit to be registered as a teacher.

networkn

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#2203149 21-Mar-2019 22:55

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12215110

Brian Tamaki - That's all you pretty much need to say.

I'd sign a petition to remove his citizenship.

Handle9

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#2203150 21-Mar-2019 22:56

networkn:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12215110

Brian Tamaki - That's all you pretty much need to say.

I'd sign a petition to remove his citizenship.

Don't you have to be human to be a citizen?

networkn

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#2203152 21-Mar-2019 23:00

Handle9:
networkn:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12215110

Brian Tamaki - That's all you pretty much need to say.

I'd sign a petition to remove his citizenship.

Don't you have to be human to be a citizen?

I don't think he is a very good example of a good Christian, but when I see what he wrote today and I compare it to the guy who forgave his wifes killer 2 days after he shot her, I know who I would aspire to be more like.

dejadeadnz

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#2203155 21-Mar-2019 23:06

Amidst the aftermath of the horrors of Friday, one of the more offensive things beyond seeing imbeciles cheering on the shooter or mocking the victims are those small-minded wannabe intellectuals posting garbage drawing false equivalence or just generally raving. A friend shared parts of one of these posts by a friend of his on Facebook:

How we Perpetuate Hate

In the wake of the Christchurch shootings there have been attempts to vilify and demonise [he whose name need not be mentioned], the alleged shooter. This is consistent with much social commentary in the aftermath of other acts of terrorism, notably the 9/11 killings and the slayings by Anders Brevik in 2011.

In so doing, we actually perpetuate the ignorant and hate-filled condition of humanity. By dehumanizing the murderers as “animals”, as “terrorists”, as “fundamentalists”, as “jihadists”, as “white supremacists”, or whatever the current whipword is; we attempt to reclaim our innocence.

“We are not them: they are not us” we tell ourselves and each other, choosing not to realise that in the process we render ourselves guilty of the same sin committed by the murderer.

In rationalising the murderer as an exception to our culture, we are then able to murder them inside our heart. This is the precise mental and emotional process undergone by Khalid al-Mihdhar, Dylan Roof, Nawaf al-Hazmi, Anders Brevik, Muhammad Jassim Abdulkarim Olayan al-Dhafiri, and Robert Gregory Bowers.

Yep, Jacinda Ardern and others refusing to give the shooter his much-desired fame is committing the same sin as the murderer. Really. The pseudo-intellectualism of this idiot becomes bloody apparent when you see him say on the one hand that He Who Shouldn't be Named is the alleged shooter; in another breath, he calls him a murderer, which is a legal construct. And how do you murder someone inside your heart? One of the things that's been genuinely impressive compared to the usual NZ response of somebody, somewhere calling for a criminal to be executed after every news story of a shocking crime is the general absence of any kind of clamour for extra-judicial punishment for the shooter.

I agree that it's unhelpful to pretend that the shooter is just some aberration of our culture but this notion that people wanting not to have his name sully their memories is some kind of an equivalent of his hatred towards a group of innocent people is just obnoxious.

dejadeadnz

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#2203156 21-Mar-2019 23:08

Handle9: Don't you have to be human to be a citizen?

That's a burn!

Handle9

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#2203162 21-Mar-2019 23:25

networkn:

Handle9:
networkn:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12215110

Brian Tamaki - That's all you pretty much need to say.

I'd sign a petition to remove his citizenship.

Don't you have to be human to be a citizen?

I don't think he is a very good example of a good Christian, but when I see what he wrote today and I compare it to the guy who forgave his wifes killer 2 days after he shot her, I know who I would aspire to be more like.

networkn:

Brian Tamaki - That's all you pretty much need to say.

He's a strange person who uses religion to line his pockets. He's smart enough to understand the meaning of the message but chooses to twist it to suit his own ends.

I'm not a fan.

chatterbox

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#2203167 22-Mar-2019 00:51

networkn:
chatterbox:

I see a couple from Auckland Ray White have just lost their jobs for hateful info on their facebook pages. Whilst I don't believe it will change their views I really hope it prevents themselves or someone else reading from converting thought into hateful action. These actions aren't dreamed up in a day.

I am not sure what the answer is, or whether there even is a good answer, but I just see this going further underground rather than preventing it from happening at all. The people it actually stops are the ones who were in my opinion being "thoughtless" and are still redeemable, the ones it will have no impact on, will simply dig a deeper hole, find those like minded and retreat into echo chambers, egging each other on until they snap and this happens again.

I am not privy to the couples sins that got them fired, firing them was perhaps the right course of action, but if it prevents them from working going forward, do you think that's really the way you get people to change? Unlikely. They become isolated, unable to provide for their families, a burden on the system, with the social stigmas that go with it for them and their kids, and it all spirals downhill from there. It doesn't encourage enlightenment, it encourages resentment, hate and other things that entrench and magnifies their feelings.

I have in my life time held some uncharitable entrenched views due to my upbringing, experience etc. In being surrounded by others who had differing views and to some degree being exposed to positive peer pressure, other viewpoints have helped me understand the other perspectives that were missing. I no longer hold those views and regret holding them in the past.

Yes some will change, and others not. I’ll leave it to the cyber security people for the tough ones.

I think people with these extremist or supremacy views don’t express them at work. Interesting they can modify their behavior at work then they should be capable of modifying it elsewhere. When people get wind of consequences they may change. Might just need a few people to make examples of.

It’s possible it will affect future employment, probably if your picture is spread around. But they may well find employment in other areas. Don’t be a prick online then you won’t suffer consequences. It really is time to call it out. I can’t go with the “she’ll be right mate” attitude in this case. Not this. It’s just too important. Look at the harm it’s doing.

Never say never

chatterbox

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#2203169 22-Mar-2019 00:59

networkn:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12215110

Brian Tamaki - That's all you pretty much need to say.

I'd sign a petition to remove his citizenship.

Yeah name says it all. Talking for everyone else but not thinking about everyone else.

Never say never

GV27

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#2203210 22-Mar-2019 07:14

Takes a special kind of dickhead to make a moment's silence for terror attack victims about yourself.

I mean...you have to at some level be impressed by it.

kingdragonfly

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#2203212 22-Mar-2019 07:42

From this morning's STuff

Bookstore chain Whitcoulls appears to have stopped selling controversial right-wing author and speaker Jordan Peterson's book 12 Rules for Life amid concerns about 'disturbing material' circulating around the Christchurch attacks.

A staff member at Whitcoulls in Albany said it was not available in any stores around the country. She did not know whether that was a permanent move. A search for the book on the chain's website does not return any hits.

Jordan Peterson was pictured with a fan wearing an 'I'm a proud Islamophobe' t-shirt during his recent trip to New Zealand. The photo circulated on Twitter in the wake of the Christchurch mosque attacks.

The book contains little reference to Islam but Peterson has previously been criticised for his description of Muhammad as a 'warlord'.

https://www.vox.com/world/2018/3/26/17144166/jordan-peterson-12-rules-for-life

Jordan Peterson, the obscure Canadian psychologist turned right-wing celebrity, explained

Who Peterson is, and the important truths he reveals about our current political moment.

Jordan Peterson is a psychology professor at the University of Toronto, a widely cited scholar of personality, and the author of what’s currently the No. 1 best-selling nonfiction book on Amazon in the United States. The New York Times’s David Brooks, echoing George Mason University economist Tyler Cowen, calls him “the most influential public intellectual in the Western world right now.”

Jordan Peterson is also a right-wing internet celebrity who has claimed that feminists have “an unconscious wish for brutal male domination,” referred to developing nations as “pits of catastrophe” in a speech to a Dutch far-right group, and recently told a Times reporter that he supported “enforced monogamy.”

When Cathy Newman, a journalist for the UK’s Channel 4, challenged Peterson’s arguments in a televised interview, she received so many death threats that she had to get help from the police. “There were literally thousands of abusive tweets — it was a semi-organized campaign,” she recalled in an interview. “ It ranged from the usual ‘c*nt, b*tch, dumb blonde’ to ‘I’m going to find out where you live and execute you.’”
...
Peterson “introduces people [to] many many other things they just don’t really get elsewhere,” Cowen says. “He is still influential, massively so, reaches a large general public audience of millions, most of all young males. How many other intellectuals do?”

So how did an obscure Canadian psychologist become an international phenomenon?

The answer is that Jordan Peterson is tailor-made to our political moment. His reactionary politics and talents as a public speaker combine to be a perfect fit for YouTube and the right-wing media, where videos of conservatives “destroying” weak-minded liberals routinely go viral. Peterson’s denunciations of identity politics and political correctness are standard-issue conservative, but his academic credentials make his pronouncements feel much more authoritative than your replacement-level Fox News commentator. (I reached out to Peterson; a spokesperson turned down my interview request.)

Peterson is also particularly appealing to disaffected young men. He’s become a lifestyle guru for men and boys who feel displaced by a world where white male privilege is under attack; his new best-selling book, 12 Rules for Life, is explicitly pitched as a self-help manual, and he speaks emotionally of the impact his work has had on anxious, lost young men.
...
This painful contrast is on display later in that very interview, in which he explicitly argues that concern for sexism is to blame for the plight of the West’s young men.

“We’re so stupid. We’re alienating young men. We’re telling them that they’re patriarchal oppressors and denizens of rape culture,” he says. “It’s awful. It’s so destructive. It’s so unnecessary. And it’s so sad.”

The empathy that he displays for men and boys in his BBC interview and 12 Rules for Life is touching. The problem is that he can’t seem to extend it to anyone else.

GV27

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#2203215 22-Mar-2019 08:19

Honestly I suspect that Jordan Peterson's successes as 'appealing to disaffected young men' is probably simply the result of there being very little support or guidance available for young men, some of whom won't fully mature until their late 20s, but who can still do enormous damage to their own lives and the lives of others between the structured environment of school and whenever that maturity actually happens.

I'd say it's a society that's perhaps more prepared to hold young men to account for their actions without figuring out what support they need first, rather than the fault of radical feminists, but that's just me.

MikeB4

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#2203222 22-Mar-2019 08:50

Maybe one of our legal friends on Geekzone could comment about the legal status of Tamaki's rant with regards to hate speech and inciting racial unrest.

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