Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.
Please note this sub-forum does not provide professional finance advice. You should seek advice from a licensed financial advisor.

To post in this sub-forum you must have made 100 posts or have Trust status or have completed our ID Verification.

If investing please consider our affiliate link for new accounts: Sharesies.



Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 
Kyanar
4089 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified
Trusted

  #2206940 29-Mar-2019 12:01
Send private message

landcruiserguy:

 

Screw Visa and their 3% tax so I use good old Eftpos whenever possible.  Apple pay is even worse - 5%.

 

 

Everything you just said is total hogswash. Apple Pay, Android Pay, Samsung Pay and Garmin Pay have no higher interchange fee than any other credit card transaction, and as they are contactless are actually cheaper than a swipe or insert.

 

The talk in the media that contactless is an "extra 2% tax" is crap. Contactless transactions are actually cheaper to the merchant provided they're on Interchange Plus pricing, at 0.50% for Contactless Credit Mastercard (vs 1.40% to 2.05% for swiped or inserted Consumer Credit Mastercards); $0.004 (yes, 0.4 cents) for Contactless Debit Mastercard under $15, and between $0.06 and 0.40% for higher Contactless Debit Mastercard transactions; from 0.85% to 1.57% for Contactless Visa Credit (vs 1.25% to 1.97% for swiped or inserted - basically Contactless is a 0.40% discount); and 0.30% for all Visa Debit transactions including Contactless (makes sense now why all the banks switched to Mastercard debit huh...).

 

What the merchant pays their bank will usually include either a % increase over these rates (interchange plus) or will be the same for all types of transactions (blended).

 

Banks used to push blended because the idea for the merchant is they'd pay 1.5% for all transactions even though the highest rate is 2.20% (Commercial Credit Mastercard - I've deliberately excluded the international cards as they are charged differently). Of course, most people didn't have platinum cards back then so for your average dairy they lost out big time on that, and when debit cards started replacing EFTPOS they got screwed on it if people selected credit or - I dunno - tapped it.

 

The problem is that people want contactless - it's convenient and it's fast (same can't be said for inserted EFTPOS...) - but there is no contactless EFTPOS application, so when a card is tapped the only networks that can switch the transaction is either VisaNet, Mastercard, Diners Club (The Warehouse, also switch Discover), American Express (also switch JCB) or UnionPay. To solve this, two things need to happen. First, EFTPOS needs to develop a contactless application that can be installed on cards. Second, banks and acquirers need to enable Least Cost Routing to enable merchant terminals to switch the transaction on the network with the lowest cost of acceptance. Basically that means the terminal will authorise the transaction with the card, see that it has the EFTPOS application installed and send the transaction automatically over the cheaper EFTPOS network.

 

The reason that won't work is that unlike in Australia where every eftpos transaction switched by EPAL (eftpos Payments Australia Limited) incurs a $0.15 fee, transactions switched by Paymark incur no fees (which is why merchants like EFTPOS). As a result, Paymark operates off much lower budgets than EPAL, and cannot afford to invest in technologies like contactless (I've asked them - they've basically said "yeah nah not happening, but look how great online EFTPOS is?!?")

 

surfisup1000:

 

Banks are disgusting....they take a 2% cut from merchants who work hard and risk so much. Banks assume no risk. 

 

 

False. Liability shift occurs on more transactions than you think. Online for example, if the merchant attempts 3DSecure (Verified By Visa or Mastercard Securecode) then if the cardholder disputes the transaction because they claim it wasn't them the issuer eats the cost (not the merchant). For transactions in store or at an ATM, the liability falls on the issuer (not merchant) as well, unless the issuer supports EMV and the merchant does not (impossible now, as non-EMV terminals were decertified by Paymark and disconnected from the network about a decade ago).




Handsomedan
7281 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified
Trusted
Subscriber

  #2207102 29-Mar-2019 14:31
Send private message

I just can't believe the amount of misinformation and anti-bank bias in this thread. 

 

 

 

There's been two and a half people so far that have provided the absolute truth on this and to be honest, its frustrating to see so many just willing to have a go at the banks with no basis for their argument other than "Banks are Bad". 

 

 

 

Please read up on these things and make an informed comment or don't bother at all. 

 

 

 

For full disclosure - I am a banker and have been involved in the payments industry for over 20 years. 





Handsome Dan Has Spoken.
Handsome Dan needs to stop adding three dots to every sentence...

 

Handsome Dan does not currently have a side hustle as the mascot for Yale 

 

 

 

*Gladly accepting donations...


Lias
5589 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2207186 29-Mar-2019 17:23
Send private message

Handsomedan:

 

I just can't believe the amount of misinformation and anti-bank bias in this thread. 

 

 

I'm not anti bank as such, I just think that it's wrong that foreign banks dominate the banking sector in NZ, and the amount of money they make is kind of obscene. I have nothing but love for the The Cooperative Bank for instance, but I'd be happy to see the government reform the sector and either force the Aussie big 4 out of the market or at least cripple their ability to dominate it.





I'm a geek, a gamer, a dad, a Quic user, and an IT Professional. I have a full rack home lab, size 15 feet, an epic beard and Asperger's. I'm a bit of a Cypherpunk, who believes information wants to be free and the Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it. If you use my Quic signup you can also use the code R570394EKGIZ8 for free setup.




SheriffNZ
671 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2207221 29-Mar-2019 18:19
Send private message

Lias:

Handsomedan:


I just can't believe the amount of misinformation and anti-bank bias in this thread. 



I'm not anti bank as such, I just think that it's wrong that foreign banks dominate the banking sector in NZ, and the amount of money they make is kind of obscene. I have nothing but love for the The Cooperative Bank for instance, but I'd be happy to see the government reform the sector and either force the Aussie big 4 out of the market or at least cripple their ability to dominate it.



Why do you think the ROI for the big 4 banks is too high? Or do you think the amount of profit they make is too high, regardless of the size of their businesses?

landcruiserguy
765 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2207249 29-Mar-2019 18:38
Send private message

3% cc fee seems a lot for changing a number in my account and in a corresponding retailers account.

The EU is trying to avoid the parasitic drain on their economy of having Visa and master card behind the payment network that glues everything together. Their master plan is to have direct bank to bank connectivity (via APIs) to cut out the middle man. This is basically eftpos.

I work for the worlds largest fintech company for the record. Currently doing a payments project.

Lias
5589 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified
Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2207288 29-Mar-2019 19:55
Send private message

SheriffNZ:

 

Why do you think the ROI for the big 4 banks is too high? Or do you think the amount of profit they make is too high, regardless of the size of their businesses?

 

In general, I don't think foreign multinationals, particularly in essential services or monopolies (banking is kind of essential, and at 90% of the market between them damn near a monopoly), should be allowed to make more than a very modest ROI.  The royal commission hasn't exactly filled me with confidence in the big 4 either, in fact I'd go so far as to say I'm a bit miffed the Aussie government hasn't arrested most of their senior management, thrown them in jail to never see the light of day, and fined all 4 banks a few decades of profit.

 

 





I'm a geek, a gamer, a dad, a Quic user, and an IT Professional. I have a full rack home lab, size 15 feet, an epic beard and Asperger's. I'm a bit of a Cypherpunk, who believes information wants to be free and the Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it. If you use my Quic signup you can also use the code R570394EKGIZ8 for free setup.


richms
28168 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2207357 29-Mar-2019 20:30
Send private message

Lias:

 

Handsomedan:

 

I just can't believe the amount of misinformation and anti-bank bias in this thread. 

 

 

I'm not anti bank as such, I just think that it's wrong that foreign banks dominate the banking sector in NZ, and the amount of money they make is kind of obscene. I have nothing but love for the The Cooperative Bank for instance, but I'd be happy to see the government reform the sector and either force the Aussie big 4 out of the market or at least cripple their ability to dominate it.

 

 

Well there are locally owned banks, but they are amateur hour comedy shows lacking things that people actually want. Sure you may be able to do some banking with TSB or kiwibank but be ready for them to drop the ball and not know what the hell they are doing. That's if they even offer the products you want. Hint, try opening a foreign currency account at either of them and see if they even understand what you want.





Richard rich.ms

 
 
 

Cloud spending continues to surge globally, but most organisations haven’t made the changes necessary to maximise the value and cost-efficiency benefits of their cloud investments. Download the whitepaper From Overspend to Advantage now.
Geektastic
17942 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  #2207390 29-Mar-2019 22:29
Send private message

Lias:

 

Handsomedan:

 

I just can't believe the amount of misinformation and anti-bank bias in this thread. 

 

 

I'm not anti bank as such, I just think that it's wrong that foreign banks dominate the banking sector in NZ, and the amount of money they make is kind of obscene. I have nothing but love for the The Cooperative Bank for instance, but I'd be happy to see the government reform the sector and either force the Aussie big 4 out of the market or at least cripple their ability to dominate it.

 

 

 

 

Foreign banks pretty much dominate the market regardless of where you live. Finance is an international business and retail banking is just a pimple on its butt.






allstarnz
1719 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

  #2207411 30-Mar-2019 05:41
Send private message

I guess with the proliferation of Visa/Mastercard debit cards, it's not such an issue.  But still, I wonder why EFTPOS have never bothered to go contactless.  Here in Canada, INTERAC (bascially EFTPOS) cards from your bank have a chip and contactless built in them and they don't have any connection to Visa/Mastercard.  The only downside to that is you need a credit card or (sometimes) Paypal to buy stuff online.  Of the many backwards things about Canadian banking, that isn't one of them.  In saying that, a number of payment terminals in shops etc will have 'no tap' on them. 

 

For reference, the interchange fee for Paywave/Flash is around 2-3c per transaction, depending on whether you're a high/low volume merchant.  This has also led to a proliferation of things like Square (a little thing that attaches to your tablet/phone and allows card payment).  Now if you go to a craft market or something, smalltime businesses often let you pay by card.  It's great.

 

I really like the convenience of tap, when you just want to walk in, get something and walk out, it's great. Here the limit per transaction is really high too.  ($100).  This can be a little disconcerting. It seems silly slowing down progress all because of ideals and fees, the technology is there, and it works right?


1 | 2 | 3 | 4 
Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic





News and reviews »

Air New Zealand Starts AI adoption with OpenAI
Posted 24-Jul-2025 16:00


eero Pro 7 Review
Posted 23-Jul-2025 12:07


BeeStation Plus Review
Posted 21-Jul-2025 14:21


eero Unveils New Wi-Fi 7 Products in New Zealand
Posted 21-Jul-2025 00:01


WiZ Introduces HDMI Sync Box and other Light Devices
Posted 20-Jul-2025 17:32


RedShield Enhances DDoS and Bot Attack Protection
Posted 20-Jul-2025 17:26


Seagate Ships 30TB Drives
Posted 17-Jul-2025 11:24


Oclean AirPump A10 Water Flosser Review
Posted 13-Jul-2025 11:05


Samsung Galaxy Z Fold7: Raising the Bar for Smartphones
Posted 10-Jul-2025 02:01


Samsung Galaxy Z Flip7 Brings New Edge-To-Edge FlexWindow
Posted 10-Jul-2025 02:01


Epson Launches New AM-C550Z WorkForce Enterprise printer
Posted 9-Jul-2025 18:22


Samsung Releases Smart Monitor M9
Posted 9-Jul-2025 17:46


Nearly Half of Older Kiwis Still Write their Passwords on Paper
Posted 9-Jul-2025 08:42


D-Link 4G+ Cat6 Wi-Fi 6 DWR-933M Mobile Hotspot Review
Posted 1-Jul-2025 11:34


Oppo A5 Series Launches With New Levels of Durability
Posted 30-Jun-2025 10:15









Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.