Any recent (or even not so recent) Ham radio operators have suggestions for studying for the test?

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Taubin

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#245019 14-Jan-2019 15:00

I'd really like to up my geek cred, as well as get to know others. Not to mention it simply seems like fun and a good idea to get my Ham radio license. I've just started reading the tests and other information listed on the NZART website, but I don't have a background in electronics at all. I've got the parts about the regulations and whatnot down pat, but I'm really struggling with the electronics parts, as well as some of the spectrum questions. Is there a proven way to learn these items without needing to take a full EE course? I have looked at ohm's law, and understand the triangle and how to use it properly however I do still struggle a bit with things like this question:

The voltage drop across a germanium signal diode when conducting is about:

0.3V
0.6V
0.7V
1.3V

Is there a good way to learn this stuff without just memorizing the entire 600(!) questions that could come up? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I'm a bit stupid when it comes to these kinds of things, I could absolutely just google the answers and try to guess the best I can when I take the test, but that doesn't seem like the proper way to learn. I've come from an age of computers instead of electronics unfortunately, so I don't have the background to just know this stuff through having done it before.

Thanks for any help or suggestions.

ZL2TOY/ZL1DMP

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#2161002 14-Jan-2019 15:10

I'm curious: in what way would knowing that make you a 'safer' user of a ham radio?!

Taubin

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#2161006 14-Jan-2019 15:16

Geektastic:

I'm curious: in what way would knowing that make you a 'safer' user of a ham radio?!

I'm not sure I'm fully understanding what you're asking. If it's of why I would want to become a ham in reference to safety, it's when things like earthquakes occur and landlines and mobiles go down.

If it's in reference to that question, it's one of the actual questions from the test I happened to pull. I understand needing to know basic electronics and not electrocuting yourself when attempting to build a radio, or wire an antenna. I honestly coulnd't tell you what a "germanium signal diode" is without having to google it, and I certainly wouldn't be attempting to build my own antenna or radio on my own without a lot of help from others the first time I did it.

Most of my frustration honestly comes from having asked for help on what and how to learn on the NZART & Friends facebook page, and just being given the quiz with the answers and being told "My thirteen year old did it, anyone can".

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axxaa

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#2161012 14-Jan-2019 15:26

Guess studying a basic electronics book would help, like this :-

http://engineering.nyu.edu/gk12/amps-cbri/pdf/Basic%20Electronics.pdf

73's

Simon ZL2BRG

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#2161015 14-Jan-2019 15:28

Taubin:

Geektastic:

I'm curious: in what way would knowing that make you a 'safer' user of a ham radio?!

I'm not sure I'm fully understanding what you're asking. If it's of why I would want to become a ham in reference to safety, it's when things like earthquakes occur and landlines and mobiles go down.

If it's in reference to that question, it's one of the actual questions from the test I happened to pull. I understand needing to know basic electronics and not electrocuting yourself when attempting to build a radio, or wire an antenna. I honestly coulnd't tell you what a "germanium signal diode" is without having to google it, and I certainly wouldn't be attempting to build my own antenna or radio on my own without a lot of help from others the first time I did it.

Most of my frustration honestly comes from having asked for help on what and how to learn on the NZART & Friends facebook page, and just being given the quiz with the answers and being told "My thirteen year old did it, anyone can".

What I am asking is why on earth would knowing the answer to that question make the person using the radio in any way more responsible? I thought the exam was meant to qualify users, not radio building electronics engineers. In terms of deciding whether a user knows correct procedures and basic law etc that question appears pointless.

Taubin

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#2161016 14-Jan-2019 15:30

axxaa:

Guess studying a basic electronics book would help, like this :-

http://engineering.nyu.edu/gk12/amps-cbri/pdf/Basic%20Electronics.pdf

73's

Simon ZL2BRG

Thank you! I'll check it out.

ZL2TOY/ZL1DMP

Taubin

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#2161017 14-Jan-2019 15:35

Geektastic:

What I am asking is why on earth would knowing the answer to that question make the person using the radio in any way more responsible? I thought the exam was meant to qualify users, not radio building electronics engineers. In terms of deciding whether a user knows correct procedures and basic law etc that question appears pointless.

Oh, gotcha, there's actually a (very heated) discussion going on at the NZART facebook page, about "dumbing down" the license too much. The general consensus from people that have had their license for years, is that it's absolutely needed seemingly more because they had to do it. A few of my favorite phrases have been "We'll just get with Kellogg's and have them throw in a license with every box of cereal" etc... There is also seemingly a huge reluctance to change anything in the test. There are even questions about using tube radios, when no one has used them since the 60's.

I don't mind learning what needs to be learned, but it is getting a touch frustrating when the people who should be helping teach, are more interested in keeping the status quo of doing things, and then complaining when no one new is coming into the hobby. I'm probably someplace firmly in the middle. I don't think it needs to be dumbed down per se, but it really needs to be updated to keep up with more modern things and have some of the very outdated items removed. Luckily they got rid of morse code in the 80's from what I understand.

Looking at youtube for assistance hasn't gotten me very far, the US tests (there are three vs the one in NZ), all have very well laid out videos and books about them, it's something very lacking in the NZ side of things unfortunately, and no one seems interested in changing that.

ZL2TOY/ZL1DMP

ResponseMediaNZ

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#2161038 14-Jan-2019 16:32

Taubin:

Geektastic:

What I am asking is why on earth would knowing the answer to that question make the person using the radio in any way more responsible? I thought the exam was meant to qualify users, not radio building electronics engineers. In terms of deciding whether a user knows correct procedures and basic law etc that question appears pointless.

Oh, gotcha, there's actually a (very heated) discussion going on at the NZART facebook page, about "dumbing down" the license too much. The general consensus from people that have had their license for years, is that it's absolutely needed seemingly more because they had to do it. A few of my favorite phrases have been "We'll just get with Kellogg's and have them throw in a license with every box of cereal" etc... There is also seemingly a huge reluctance to change anything in the test. There are even questions about using tube radios, when no one has used them since the 60's.

I don't mind learning what needs to be learned, but it is getting a touch frustrating when the people who should be helping teach, are more interested in keeping the status quo of doing things, and then complaining when no one new is coming into the hobby. I'm probably someplace firmly in the middle. I don't think it needs to be dumbed down per se, but it really needs to be updated to keep up with more modern things and have some of the very outdated items removed. Luckily they got rid of morse code in the 80's from what I understand.

Looking at youtube for assistance hasn't gotten me very far, the US tests (there are three vs the one in NZ), all have very well laid out videos and books about them, it's something very lacking in the NZ side of things unfortunately, and no one seems interested in changing that.

yes don't get me started on that discussion.... There are some parts of the exam that need updating but all in all its a solid exam for what you are allowed to do and transmit.

Anyway, are you looking at doing a ham-cram or just going and sitting the exam when you feel like it?

If you "just want to transmit and talk to people" just stay with PRS / CB - if you want to understand how radio works then keep going with this.

The teacher's exam study guide is good but you can get from NZART a radio manual which has been updated I believe. What area are you in?

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Taubin

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#2161043 14-Jan-2019 16:43

The nearest ham-cram for me is in March, if I haven't given up by that point, I'll most likely join it. I'm absolutely interested in learning the ins and outs but that will take time and learning from others, not just learning to memorize a quiz.

I'm in the North Shore of Auckland, there is an event at one of the two clubs that are close to me this weekend, so I'm going to attempt to at least stop in for a few and introduce myself. The goings on in the NZART group, it's a bit uh, interesting, to watch as an outsider. They don't seem to be the most welcoming of groups at times. I've searched the NZART website but that too is quite out of date and frustrating. I even emailed the webmaster, who just sent me (again) to the quiz and answers.

I've made a couple of comments on that group on FB, I'm not too hard to find, I'm the newest newbie commenting on there I believe. Just look for the two people with the red panda. In all, my 'worst case' scenario is a 'ham cram' in March, but from what I've read that's not really meant to teach, but more to run through the quiz, and is meant more for people with an electrical background.

The regulations come quite easily to me after looking into them, and the spectrum stuff I can memorize enough to pass, but the electronics is a bit beyond me at this point. It seems most people say "pass the test then learn" as well. So I guess my best bet is to just memorize as much of the quiz as I can, then take the test. Even without studying, I've been about 30/60 on the practice tests, I can certainly memorize enough to get to the 40/60 needed I guess.

ZL2TOY/ZL1DMP

Scotdownunder

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#2161049 14-Jan-2019 16:51

While the answer is 0.3 v for germanium vis 0.6 for silicon, its doubtful germanium diodes have been used in general electronics designs for over 40 years now, excepting some special cases (scientific instruments?) where the lower voltage drop is critical. High power valves / tubes might be encountered in old hf transmitters so of some possible relevance but understanding the dangers of the high voltage power supplies they run on is the real safety issue.

Today I would imaging understanding rf interference issues both from ham transmitters and on ham receivers from the electronic everythings we are surrounded by would be the high priority issue.

Retired EE and ex-UK ham.

ResponseMediaNZ

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#2161054 14-Jan-2019 17:02

Ham-Crams are designed to teach you enough on the weekend to pass so that should not be too hard.

The more you get on the tools and learning with experienced people then you will pick it up. The background to most of the eletronics is so you can build things (which ALOT of them do)

I have mine for work (RF Industry) so building stuff it not a priority for me

Rikkitic

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#2161056 14-Jan-2019 17:10

I had a ham license in the late 1950s and early 60s. After that I moved onto other things and lost touch so don't really know what it is like today but I think your interest is admirable.

I dabbled with electronics when young but never studied it and only picked up bits and pieces here and there, just enough to pass the exams. This of course was before the age of the almighty transistor. I remember I had to learn how to design a simple valve oscillator circuit. The principles are the same, except transistors don't need power supplies for the filaments and high voltage anodes.

It is unfortunate that some of those who are in this club want to feel special by keeping it exclusive. That is stupid and short-sighted, as well as completely unnecessary. It is a hobby, after all, not a medieval guild.

My technical knowledge doesn't extend much beyond Ohm's Law but fortunately that is the most useful bit you can know. It is much more than just the triangle and it has served me exceptionally well over the years. It describes the fundamental unchanging relationship between voltage ('e'), current ('i') and resistance ('r'). Once you grasp that, the keys to the kingdom are yours.

The only good way to learn about the basic stuff is to play. Books are useful for reference but you can't get a sense of things until you have experienced the joy of designing a working device. There are software tools for learning simple circuits and understanding the difference between series and parallel and voltage drops, and there are also teaching tools that let you build simple experimental circuit boards. These days there are also wonderful things like Arduino which I wish had existed when I was young. You can also buy a whole range of cheap project kits from Jaycar to build simple and less simple devices that demonstrate a lot of the basic principles. That is where you should start, even if you only want to do it for 'fun'. I would be willing to bet that every single person here on Geekzone who does have any technical knowledge started out that way: they did it for fun. A very important aspect of this, by the way, is taking things apart to see how they go together. I can't tell you many clocks I destroyed when I was little. But I now know how clocks work and could make one if I had the right tools. Buy some cheap used bits and build your own pc. That is good practice and you will learn much from your mistakes along the way.

Modern integrated circuits like logic gates and other chips are cheap and easy to experiment with. Learn by doing. You don't have to understand all the theory to start connecting things together. Make a timer, or a little amp, or a regulated power supply. Fun and useful. Especially fun. Dive in.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Taubin

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#2161058 14-Jan-2019 17:13

Rikkitic:

Modern integrated circuits like logic gates and other chips are cheap and easy to experiment with. Learn by doing. You don't have to understand all the theory to start connecting things together. Make a timer, or a little amp, or a regulated power supply. Fun and useful. Especially fun. Dive in.

I actually just recently learned how to solder! I was super excited to learn how to do it. I've built a few small kits from Ebay, nothing more than just setting up some blinking LED's. I really should pick up a few more advanced ones to learn a bit more about it. I really wish I would have gotten into electronics years ago, but computers were my calling. It's never too late to learn though.

ZL2TOY/ZL1DMP

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#2161246 15-Jan-2019 00:01

I had a friend who did it in the UK when we were at school aged about 16 or 17 and for some reason I can still recall his callsign - G1KKM. No idea why that particular information has remained secure...!