Best set-up to get fibre from one property to another

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Ge0rge

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#281024 25-Jan-2021 22:35

I'm outside the boundaries of getting fibre by about 600m, however I have now got a solar powered repeater set up and running to my old man's place, who should be getting fibre in March/April.

The plan we've got is to beam the net from his, up the hill and then down to mine, at around 200x faster than my current adsl access. I have a couple of ideas on how to achieve this, but am hoping that someone can steer me definitively in the right direction. There is mostly unifi gear at both our properties including a usg 3 at my end and a usg4 at his.

Option 1: Plug the nanobeam at his end into either one of his switches or the lan2 output of his usg, let it be the modem and I'm simply sharing his connection.

Pros - one bill
- reasonably easy to set up initially.

Cons - not exactly inside the T&Cs for most ISPs
- I'm taxing his bandwidth. (He'll be getting full speed, and at max I can use about 20% of that, but still)
- network configuration becomes a hassle - I don't know if I can still run my controller at the same time as his, or if I put my usg in as well, between my end nanobeam and my network so I can still control my wifi / vlans. Double NAT too this way? Seems ugly.

While I'm reasonably confident doing it this way would get me basic internet at my place, I'm not sure it would work given we both have slightly more than simple networks.

Option 2: Have the second port livened on his ONT once it's installed. He gets his full speed on port 1, I get reduced on port 2 (which, from what I can find on GZ is around 200/20 - pretty much the max speed of my wireless link, so perfect)

Pros - separate accounts, separate bills, separate networks

Cons - nothing I can think of - extra cost perhaps?

However I have a couple of questions about getting the second port livened:
- I can't seem to find any details about it on any ISPs page. Does anyone know of, or have a list of, ISPs who offer access to the second port?
- does it have to be the same ISP on both ports? If not, are there any combinations that won't work?
- can I plug the nanobeam at his end into the ONT, and at my end into my USG? Or does the first thing connected to the ONT need to be the usg? I'd like to have the usg at my end if possible.

Is there anything else that I haven’t necessarily thought of, or perhaps an option 3 to consider?

Cheers.

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#2642018 25-Jan-2021 22:59

Option 2 would be my pick, at least you'll have the freedom to change ISPs without inconveniencing your father!

NanoBeams are just long-range wireless access points so you'll be getting a layer 2 bridge between the houses - meaning you can plug a NanoBeam straight into the ONT and have the layer 3 device (your USG router) in your house

Who's your local fibre company/where are you based? The different LFCs have different regulations around secondary port speeds etc. so the answer will depend on this

Also is there anything stopping you placing your father's fibre service on the second port so you can order a Gigabit service on the first port? Does he need a Gigabit service?

Ge0rge

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#2642031 26-Jan-2021 06:15

I'm in the South Wairarapa - Chorus I'm pretty sure?

The old man is definitely keen on having the gigabit service himself, I certainly wouldn't be winning that discussion! Also, the PtP link is averaging around 200Mbit, so a faster plan would be wasted at that bottleneck.

cyril7

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#2642035 26-Jan-2021 07:14

Hi, for Option2 check with @Hio77 re getting the 2nd Offer (2nd port) I am sure he will let you know what and who knows what, but it can be done, alternatively a 2nd ONT can be installed, but to me that seems a complete waste. Assuming the links are transparent L2 bridges (which they are by default unless you have done something funky) then yes you could just plug the ONT port in and transport it to yours.

I personally would just go Option1, as for your USG, put it at your end remove the NAT at your end and just put a p2p L3 link between the two USG's that spans the wireless link with a static route each end, that way you keep broadcast traffic off the wireless link and avoid double NAT. Let me know if you need more assistance with doing that.

As for the links themselves, you can use the Unifi series of links as you propose or if each leg is true clear line of sight and <1.5km then you could try a pair of 60ad links, these will do GigE have lower latency than the Airmax devices, I have a modest number of these in service at work to link buildings where its not economic to have fibre run, they work very well, even in bad weather which you have plenty in the wrapa

Cyril

nztim

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#2642055 26-Jan-2021 08:46

Secondary Offer is limited to 200/50 and not all RSPs support it

Any views expressed on these forums are my own and don't necessarily reflect those of my employer.

nztim

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#2642057 26-Jan-2021 08:49

@cyil7 what is the difference between nRAY and the wireless wire dish?

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cyril7

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#2642059 26-Jan-2021 08:54

Hi its the same chipset/hardware, just different/better physcial package I understand, the original was built on their common open frame dish assembly, this nRAY is an enclosed affair, best I can tell.

Cyril

timmmay

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#2642060 26-Jan-2021 08:55

I would try option 1 first. If your Dad has gigabit internet an unlimited data I doubt the 200Mbps you could put through it would make any significant difference to his performance.

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deadlyllama

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#2642084 26-Jan-2021 09:46

I used to share 100/50 with a friend who bought the house over the road from us. This was OK because we were both techies -- he wasn't about to call them up and ask for tech support.

Speed wise we never noticed each other. Our wireless link could easily push 100Mbps both ways (Mikrotik Lite5s). We put a Mikrotik router in to replace the ISP router, so we could each have our own RFC1918 subnet and avoid double NAT.

Like timmmay says, I'd go for option one, just share a gigabit connection, your Dad will never notice your usage. Unless -- and this is the big but -- he's the sort who would do a speed test, see it's not full gigabit, and blame you, and not listen when you explain that e.g. wifi can't go that fast / he's using the wrong speedtest server / etc. If it's going to produce family conflict, try a second port install instead.

Scott3

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#2642104 26-Jan-2021 10:00

In terms of option 3, The obvious way to get fiber from one property to another is by actually running fiber. Obviously a lot more effort required to do the install (trenching, running along fences etc), and challenging if the properties arn't adjacent

Could also be worth having a custom install priced. With be a few thousand at least, but having it's own fiber connection will add value to the property when you come to sell it.

[edit] - Sharing a single gig connection with a wireless link will be the most cost effective solution over 600m, both in terms of capital cost and ongoing costs. I know of people who do this just to save money each month, even with both houses in UFB zone.

cyril7

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#2642106 26-Jan-2021 10:04

Scott3:

In terms of option 3, The obvious way to get fiber from one property to another is by actually running fiber. Obviously a lot more effort required to do the install (trenching, running along fences etc), and challenging if the properties arn't adjacent

Could also be worth having a custom install priced. With be a few thousand at least, but having it's own fiber connection will add value to the property when you come to sell it.

[edit] - Sharing a single gig connection with a wireless link will be the most cost effective solution, both in terms of capital cost and ongoing costs.

Really, when $1k for two 60ad links will give GigE fibre performance, you got a lot of $ to make up.

Cyril

Scott3

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#2642123 26-Jan-2021 10:19

cyril7:

Really, when $1k for two 60ad links will give GigE fibre performance, you got a lot of $ to make up.

Cyril

Clearly a wireless link is a good alternative, but it doesn't achieve the desire stated in the title of getting fiber between properties.

Azzura

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#2642126 26-Jan-2021 10:21

Sure you can do it.

Originally, I had a one link setup from town with airfiber link to my house - but house in town got sold.

Found another way to get fiber to house. Found another mate with fiber in town --- it did not have direct line of sight to my house. But it did have direct line of sight to this house 5.11km (in picture) and from this one to my house - 10.88km.

Should mention...using second ont port and account is in my name.

Airfiber 5XHD's and dishes = About 3k to 4k costs

You could always try the airMax Powerbeam 5AC units. Think they are about 250 or 300 bucks a side.

Ge0rge

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#2642200 26-Jan-2021 11:21

Thanks for the input so far.

The link between the two properties is already up and running, using four nanobeams. Perhaps one day in the future I'll upgrade those to a faster link, but for the price (and energy consumption of the two of them powered by solar) they can stay for the time being.

I was perhaps a little loose with the subject title - getting faster broadband to a property outside the fibre area is probably a better description. We have a main fibre trunk / backhaul running outside out property. When it was being upgraded I jokingly asked one of the supervisors about splitting a line off to our place on the way past - he had done some quote work around that sort of thing previously and guessed $upper 5 figures. I won't waste anyones time getting a proper quote as that'll never get past the accountant - the value spent to get it will never be re-couped in a sale, that's for sure.

It would seem as if tapping into the old man's connection on port 1 would be the way to go - he's quite techie himself so there'll be no questions about speed test rates etc - although a good point for anyone else considering sharing.

@cyril7 I may be in touch in a couple of months once he's got his fibre installed if we can't work out the L3 link between the two USGs - in the mean time, have you any suggestions on reading that may help me get it running myself please?

cyril7

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#2642295 26-Jan-2021 12:47

Hi, I will put forward a few notes when i get a moment.

Cheers Cyril

Ge0rge

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#2645821 2-Feb-2021 14:19

@cyril7

As requested

We had the link up and running over the weekend, and all my Shelly devices were popping up on the old man's home automation - amusing as he turned lights on and off around my house from his, but obviously some routing rules that need to be implemented!

On the plus side, by changing my gateway on my usg3 to 192.158.192.55 (which is what he has his usg4 lan2 set to) I am able to access the internet through his connection - my wan address changed to his automatically and doing a speed test from my place netted much faster results than I normally get, and was just fractionally slower than what he could get.

His plan is to remove the Huawei router from his connection once fibre is available, and plug the ont directly into the usg4. Neither of us current have any vlans set up, nor any rules other than the default on our unifi controllers.

Hopefully that's a start, if you need anything else, please ask away.

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