VDSL Performance & Tuning

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371 posts

Ultimate Geek

#885947 28-Aug-2013 15:53

I did reboot after the config change after I replugged backed in the line, well time to give up... maybe some day in the future ill be able to do some tweaking on it.

Phexx

415 posts

Ultimate Geek

#886064 28-Aug-2013 18:42

I've been reading through and I'm trying to work out if my connection is optimal or I need to adjust something. I got VDSL installed about 3 weeks ago and the modem seems to syncing 2-5 times a day. Interestingly, the chorus tech did not look at anything at the property. He came into the home (Fritz!Box already installed) and just took a quick speedtest. Here are some tests/info:

Cheers

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#886071 28-Aug-2013 18:47

Phexx: I've been reading through and I'm trying to work out if my connection is optimal or I need to adjust something. I got VDSL installed about 3 weeks ago and the modem seems to syncing 2-5 times a day. Interestingly, the chorus tech did not look at anything at the property. He came into the home (Fritz!Box already installed) and just took a quick speedtest. Here are some tests/info:

Cheers

your errors and SNR bouncing doesnt seem right? you said the tech didnt do anything, does that mean a splitter was not installed?

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

Phexx

415 posts

Ultimate Geek

#886072 28-Aug-2013 18:50

hio77:
Phexx: I've been reading through and I'm trying to work out if my connection is optimal or I need to adjust something. I got VDSL installed about 3 weeks ago and the modem seems to syncing 2-5 times a day. Interestingly, the chorus tech did not look at anything at the property. He came into the home (Fritz!Box already installed) and just took a quick speedtest. Here are some tests/info:

Cheers

your errors and SNR bouncing doesnt seem right? you said the tech didnt do anything, does that mean a splitter was not installed?

Yes, he didn't look at any hardware. We had a master filter installed about a year ago when we had adsl and I didn't think anything of it.

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#886089 28-Aug-2013 19:01

Phexx:
hio77:
Phexx: I've been reading through and I'm trying to work out if my connection is optimal or I need to adjust something. I got VDSL installed about 3 weeks ago and the modem seems to syncing 2-5 times a day. Interestingly, the chorus tech did not look at anything at the property. He came into the home (Fritz!Box already installed) and just took a quick speedtest. Here are some tests/info:

Cheers

your errors and SNR bouncing doesnt seem right? you said the tech didnt do anything, does that mean a splitter was not installed?

Yes, he didn't look at any hardware. We had a master filter installed about a year ago when we had adsl and I didn't think anything of it.

ah, so a spitter is currently installed then. ild say this would have been on record and thus it wasnt looked at then.

which fritzbox? which firmware? how long has it been since a hard reboot? SNR bouncing seems to happen alot on the .51 firmware after its been solid for a few weeks.. but your are dipping alot lower than ild expect even considering that..

your past your period, might be worth getting snap to have a detailed look at it..

that many resyncs a day, not normal at all. (outside of the training period and such ofcourse.)

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

Phexx

415 posts

Ultimate Geek

#886105 28-Aug-2013 19:12

I should have mentioned, the splitter was not installed by a Chorus technician, it was done by a contracter. I wouldn't know if he had contacted Chorus but I doubt it.

FRITZ!OS 05.51
Firmware version: 84.05.51

Last hard reset was done 16 days ago.

Hmm, may have to quick Snap a call tomorrow and see what they say.

I did notice the frequency of the resyncs, especially since they seem to happens at the least convenient time. FWIW, when the syncs occur it says "DSL synchronization starting (training)"

The speeds have also been bouncing around from 32-36 mbit.

Thanks

sidefx

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#886115 28-Aug-2013 19:30

Yup, that many resyncs seems well off. I've currently got a decent SNR tweak resulting in an error rate of 4 CRCPM, and have it tweaked further for weeks at 9 CRCPM, and generally the only resyncs I've ever noticed are DLM (4:11am) or if I reboot when adjusting the tweak.

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Phexx

415 posts

Ultimate Geek

#886189 28-Aug-2013 21:17

sidefx: Yup, that many resyncs seems well off. I've currently got a decent SNR tweak resulting in an error rate of 4 CRCPM, and have it tweaked further for weeks at 9 CRCPM, and generally the only resyncs I've ever noticed are DLM (4:11am) or if I reboot when adjusting the tweak.

I'm thinking: Give Snap a call and let them know, see if they can send a technician out to have a look at the wiring.

Should I expect to have to pay for the visit if one is arranged (considering the tech never installed anything during the initial visit)?

smac

333 posts

Ultimate Geek

#886764 29-Aug-2013 21:10

smac:
smac:
smac: Interesting situation going on here. Yesterday just after 12pm VDSL got switched on here. Synced with 7dB attenuation and no added latency, so I take this to mean DLM1.

Because it's kinda mesmerizing I watched the stats off and on during the afternoon, and noted that the CRC rate climbed gradually throughout the afternoon, until by dinner time it was up to 10 per minute.

Around dinner time I did what I'd been meaning to do for a while: rewired the cable from the master filter from connecting to a socket in the wallplate, to an RJ45 plug and whacked it straight into the back of the modem.

From that point on it synced at more or less the same numbers but the errors started climbing even faster. Just got home now from a day away, and CRC count is at 42 per minute. No resync though.

So, questions: is it worth me doing a reset and bumping the SNRM across a notch to stable, or should I wait and see if I get bumped down to DLM2 first?

Second question: if I messed up the polarity of the cable when I crimped on the plug, could that contribute to the error situation? I tried looking online for info, and just found conflicting info and a bunch of flame wars.

For me latency and jitter is way more important than throughput, as the most 'connection dependant' thing I do is video conference. I'd take half the throughput if it meant retaining zero added latency.

Cheers

Looks to me like they have more control than just DLM.

After the post quoted above I got got a resync and bumped to DLM2. Errors were better, but still high enough that I think I would get bumped again (800+ an hour).

At 9am this morning there was a resync, but no DLM change, and errors have flat lined (single figures).

So they can shape the connection in other ways?

Any thoughts on what I could do to try and claw myself back to DLM1?

OK after a few days of weird stuff (errors suddenly increasing, maybe jumping 2 DLM levels) I decided I'd have a crack at tweaking the stability settings to see if I can get it to settle down before I get bumped further down.

The Line Settings screen lets me move the Intended SNR to the left, but this seems to have zero effect on sync speed, and SNR still reports at 12. Does that sound right? I tried all the way to the left, and just one step; no real change.

Also, the box will not save a change to INP. I change it, reboot, and it's back the right again. Anyone else seen this?

All this is done using the instructions on the first page - changes made while disconnected, reboot, then power off for a while (15 mins as per someone's comment that this will not be seen as a spontaneous resync by DLM)

Anybody able to help?

stevehodge

393 posts

Ultimate Geek

#886793 30-Aug-2013 00:14

smac:
smac:
The Line Settings screen lets me move the Intended SNR to the left, but this seems to have zero effect on sync speed, and SNR still reports at 12. Does that sound right? I tried all the way to the left, and just one step; no real change.

Also, the box will not save a change to INP. I change it, reboot, and it's back the right again. Anyone else seen this?

All this is done using the instructions on the first page - changes made while disconnected, reboot, then power off for a while (15 mins as per someone's comment that this will not be seen as a spontaneous resync by DLM)

Anybody able to help?

Sounds like the issue people have seen with the latest firmware. You could try the instructions here: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=90&topicid=105744&page_no=132#869388

You'd want to use a positive value rather than a negative one (e.g. setting it to 50 should give you a SNRM target of 17db).

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#887546 31-Aug-2013 20:31

stevehodge:
smac:
smac:
The Line Settings screen lets me move the Intended SNR to the left, but this seems to have zero effect on sync speed, and SNR still reports at 12. Does that sound right? I tried all the way to the left, and just one step; no real change.

Also, the box will not save a change to INP. I change it, reboot, and it's back the right again. Anyone else seen this?

All this is done using the instructions on the first page - changes made while disconnected, reboot, then power off for a while (15 mins as per someone's comment that this will not be seen as a spontaneous resync by DLM)

Anybody able to help?

Sounds like the issue people have seen with the latest firmware. You could try the instructions here: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=90&topicid=105744&page_no=132#869388

You'd want to use a positive value rather than a negative one (e.g. setting it to 50 should give you a SNRM target of 17db).

take extra note of the steps unpluging the line and then doing it.. flatmates knocked out the fritz today, and i mistakenly forgot to do it.. sounds like my linecard needs a tech to physically go and give it a prod, so no internet for the night for me.. on a saturday at that! :/

going over the fault itself with the snap CSR, on their side your connection is active, even though in your hand is the power plug, clearly not connected (i did do the leave it unpluged and all for an hour or so trick before calling in hoping that would resolve it as it did for others - although flatmates often dont listen to, the internet needs to be unpluged for an hour so it will reconnected.. glad i unplugged the phoneline from it..)

so save the hassle, and play it safe.. i know im regretting knocking out my line for the night..

on a somewhat related note, @sam, any chance of putting the tweaking notes in the first page for the .51 firmware since the other method only works for the old firmware?

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Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

SamF

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#887568 31-Aug-2013 21:09

hio77:on a somewhat related note, @sam, any chance of putting the tweaking notes in the first page for the .51 firmware since the other method only works for the old firmware?

Yeah, just gathering info about this version and it's quirks at the moment. Once I've got all the info I'll put it in the first post.

There seems to be a number of issues with the latest firmware:
- SNR adjustment doesn't work via the GUI or the normal config hacking method
- Increased instability in some cases
- Auto-updates without prompting?

Can anyone confirm these issues?

hio77

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#887570 31-Aug-2013 21:15

SamF:
hio77:on a somewhat related note, @sam, any chance of putting the tweaking notes in the first page for the .51 firmware since the other method only works for the old firmware?

Yeah, just gathering info about this version and it's quirks at the moment. Once I've got all the info I'll put it in the first post.

There seems to be a number of issues with the latest firmware:
- SNR adjustment doesn't work via the GUI or the normal config hacking method
- Increased instability in some cases
- Auto-updates without prompting?

Can anyone confirm these issues?

in my own trawling and testing..

- no, SNR tweaking doesnt seem to work from the interface, you need to use the telnet "ctlmgr_ctl w sar settings/DownstreamMarginOffset 0" command. this command does not save unless you reboot your device and force it to save.
- on shorter lines, it has seemed to be more instable. i have also noticed it has quite a habit of miss-reporting rates when its been on for a long time without a hard reboot..
- no autoupdate has occurred for me, i may have disabled it though, i did go through and toy with the fritz to my own liking..

there are a few features the new firmware lacks, eg, hover over the bargraphs to see the exact values too..

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

SamF

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#887577 31-Aug-2013 21:28

Thanks hio77.

I'm also interested if anyone has actually found any advantages to the new version (other than the max/min lines of the spectrum graph)

I'm this close (><) to putting a recommendation in the first post for people to stick with the previous firmware version due to all the issues I've read about people having. If there are any advantages, they appear to be well outweighed by the disadvantages!

hio77

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#887582 31-Aug-2013 21:33

SamF: Thanks hio77.

I'm also interested if anyone has actually found any advantages to the new version (other than the max/min lines of the spectrum graph)

I'm this close (><) to putting a recommendation in the first post for people to stick with the previous firmware version due to all the issues I've read about people having. If there are any advantages, they appear to be well outweighed by the disadvantages!

advantages, telnet.

after that, dito. ild even go as far to say, DLM has been a heck of alot less aggressive ever since installing it, rolled back for a little and it seemed to start acting again - could just be DLM being DLM though, i didnt test too much there.

reading the change logs, i suspect thoses with longer lines may see an improvement? trial and error i suppose right?

indeed this firmware has been very iffy with issues croping up..

#include <std_disclaimer>

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

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