Ethernet and Phone over existing cat5 wiring

Forums › LAN (ethernet/Wifi/routers/Bluetooth) › Ethernet and Phone over existing cat5 wiring

1 | 2 | 3

308 posts

Ultimate Geek

#738977 31-Dec-2012 20:15

RunningMan: On each chain you could run one point to point connection - i.e. a switch to a computer, or AP.

You could theoretically run a switch at each point along the daisy chain, by breaking the chain, and having each section of cable connected to an outlet at each end of the segment. It would be a pretty messy setup, and should be an absolute last resort though...

Going back to square one, what are you trying to actually achieve?

Right, basically I want to get my master splitter sorted (missing link driving me bonkers), then use the existing cat 5 wiring around the house to run an access point down stairs from the router upstairs.

Picture of a jackpoint, upstairs lounge:

DSL

coffeebaron

6231 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#738983 31-Dec-2012 20:37

I have another idea on sorting out your master splitter, but it will need two splitters. I'm away until mid January so would be after that. As for an Ethernet run between upstairs / downstairs, alas no unless we find that missing link. Perhaps Ethernet over power would be an other option.
Will get back to you.

Fraser

Rural IT and Broadband support.

Broadband troubleshooting and master filter installs.
Starlink installer - one month free: https://www.starlink.com/?referral=RC-32845-88860-71
Wi-Fi and networking
Cel-Fi supply and installer - boost your mobile phone coverage legally

Need help in Auckland, Waikato or BoP? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com

joutei

308 posts

Ultimate Geek

#738985 31-Dec-2012 20:42

coffeebaron: I have another idea on sorting out your master splitter, but it will need two splitters. I'm away until mid January so would be after that. As for an Ethernet run between upstairs / downstairs, alas no unless we find that missing link. Perhaps Ethernet over power would be an other option.
Will get back to you.

Fraser

Thanks Fraser, I will try get an electrician to have a look at that missing link ( family friend, so hopefully not to much on the pocket! )

RunningMan

8954 posts

Uber Geek

#738987 31-Dec-2012 20:49

Go with whatever Fraser recommends - he knows his stuff, and also knows your exact setup!

coffeebaron

6231 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#738992 31-Dec-2012 20:54

The more I think about it, I'm tending towards moving your modem downstairs and Ethernet over power to get it upstairs. This can be done without finding the missing link as I can isolate a pair for DSL to any of the downstairs jackpoints.

Rural IT and Broadband support.

Need help in Auckland, Waikato or BoP? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com

joutei

308 posts

Ultimate Geek

#738997 31-Dec-2012 21:14

coffeebaron: The more I think about it, I'm tending towards moving your modem downstairs and Ethernet over power to get it upstairs. This can be done without finding the missing link as I can isolate a pair for DSL to any of the downstairs jackpoints.

sounds good , but the price I would be paying for Ethernet over power solution, wouldnt it be better to try resolve the missing link issue once and for all :)

geocom

594 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

#739004 31-Dec-2012 21:58

I guess you may have already tried this to find your phantom link.

Have you tried using a cable tracer on the spare pairs in the patch. That way it should tell you what jack point links to another jack point and trace what jack point leads downstairs.

As for the original post if the cable is daisy chained then the only way to have computers on it would be to have a switch in every jack point otherwise the amount of conflicts on the network would make it unbearable.

Geoff E

GoodSync

GoodSync. Easily back up and sync your files with GoodSync. Simple and secure file backup and synchronisation software will ensure that your files are never lost (affiliate link).

chevrolux

4962 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#739377 2-Jan-2013 13:34

So at the ETP there is just one cat5? But through the house there two loops?
I would guess the alarm box? Sparky's love doing joints inside them. Is there no ceiling access in the area where the ETP's cable is? Going for a crawl is always the best option. A tone source, which I assume Coffeebaron has already used, will be no use to anyone as they are only good on the end of the copper.

The only sure fire way will be to use a proper cable locater but they aren't something jaycar has on the shelf. You need to find someone in the area who does service locating. Put the locator on one of the spare pairs (green maybe) at the ETP and then trace it through the house until you lose the signal.

As for getting ethernet links around the house just forget about phones and go to a DECT solution for them. Then you can use rated joiners in those jack points (which would be made redundant) and then you have a proper link that isn't hacked about. Also means GigE would be made possible rather than the running 100Mb over an abortion of two pairs with bad joints - I really really dislike that idea. I know it works but it's just rubbish.

I wouldn't be opposed to the idea of putting small switches at each jack. It's a much better idea than hacking the cable up. At each jack you would have dual RJ45's with one being the feed and the other being the link to the next jack. Means you can plug devices in at each point too. Would be fairly costly though once you add up all the gear needed.

webwat

2036 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#740316 4-Jan-2013 22:50

chevrolux: So at the ETP there is just one cat5? But through the house there two loops?
I would guess the alarm box? Sparky's love doing joints inside them. Is there no ceiling access in the area where the ETP's cable is? Going for a crawl is always the best option. A tone source, which I assume Coffeebaron has already used, will be no use to anyone as they are only good on the end of the copper.

The only sure fire way will be to use a proper cable locater but they aren't something jaycar has on the shelf. You need to find someone in the area who does service locating. Put the locator on one of the spare pairs (green maybe) at the ETP and then trace it through the house until you lose the signal.

As for getting ethernet links around the house just forget about phones and go to a DECT solution for them. Then you can use rated joiners in those jack points (which would be made redundant) and then you have a proper link that isn't hacked about. Also means GigE would be made possible rather than the running 100Mb over an abortion of two pairs with bad joints - I really really dislike that idea. I know it works but it's just rubbish.

I wouldn't be opposed to the idea of putting small switches at each jack. It's a much better idea than hacking the cable up. At each jack you would have dual RJ45's with one being the feed and the other being the link to the next jack. Means you can plug devices in at each point too. Would be fairly costly though once you add up all the gear needed.

Changing the jacks from one of those BT sockets to twin RJ45 would be really annoying if you don't need to put computers at each outlet. You can join the orange and green pairs at each one with a proper Cat5e coupler like this

and then put the green and orange pairs to an RJ45 outlet where you need it.

What a pain if the missing fossil is in the alarm cabinet! good luck finding it, but getting a good join from your toner to a single wire — instead of the pair — will get the tone (being a balanced signal) out of the twisted pair so you can trace through a wall. Not a very accurate trace though if its a strong tone signal.

joutei:Im somewhat puzzled, if there is 1 daisy chain upstairs and 1 daisy chain downstairs, then wouldn't they both meet at the demarcation point. Sorry for all the questions :)

You would expect them to join up at the demarc, but alarms often have a line grabber that needs to cut all daisychains if the alarm is set off so they would tend to be joined at the first jackpoint after the alarm box, hence the search for a missing link where all that has to happen. It may have been plastered over and forgotten about.

You might be able to get lucky with a fancy stud finder that tests for metal wiring once you know the rough area you need to narrow down before making a jackpoint sized hole. Some sparkies still put in BT jacks with daisychained wiring, because apparently data wires are simple and dirty jobs are ok... Some nice sparkies give us data guys a call

Time to find a new industry!

chevrolux

4962 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#740330 4-Jan-2013 23:43

Changing the jacks from one of those BT sockets to twin RJ45 would be really annoying if you don't need to put computers at each outlet. You can join the orange and green pairs at each one with a proper Cat5e coupler like this and then put the green and orange pairs to an RJ45 outlet where you need it.

It's just such a hack though. And like I said first off just forget plugged in phones and get a DECT solution.

Then either join ALL the wires through with a rated joiner up until the point they need the connection or terminate each cat5e on to an RJ45 then you can either just plug a patch cord between them or put a switch there if you would like a device. You then get Gigabit speeds on 'standard' wiring - not just 100Mb on hacked up wiring.

coffeebaron

6231 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#740381 5-Jan-2013 10:03

Alarm panel does not have the missing link. Yes only one chain at the demarc.

Rural IT and Broadband support.

Need help in Auckland, Waikato or BoP? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com

joutei

308 posts

Ultimate Geek

#743819 12-Jan-2013 17:37

Alright guys, Im looking for an experienced electrician / cabler who thinks there up for the job to try finding my missing link.

Please PM me and we can discuss the details.
Cheers

joutei

308 posts

Ultimate Geek

#748321 21-Jan-2013 17:36

coffeebaron: Alarm panel does not have the missing link. Yes only one chain at the demarc.

Heres what I found in my room , tucked away to the side after digging my hand around.

Another cable, (red,blue,black,white) .

Any ideas ?

richms

28172 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#748356 21-Jan-2013 18:37

Alarm wire. No idea what is is doing in there, but alarm installers are usually cowboys so probably couldnt be bothered going to the van to get the right stuff.

Richard rich.ms

joutei

308 posts

Ultimate Geek

#748360 21-Jan-2013 18:44

richms: Alarm wire. No idea what is is doing in there, but alarm installers are usually cowboys so probably couldnt be bothered going to the van to get the right stuff.

Could it somehow affect my phone wiring ?

1 | 2 | 3