Conduit for underground fibre in Auckland

Forums › New Zealand Broadband › Conduit for underground fibre in Auckland

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21 posts

Geek

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#2999039 21-Nov-2022 08:13

It sounds like from the notes from Vodafone that the 20mm duct is possibly kinked somewhere and they cant pull the microduct out, that size/brand of continuous ducting seems to prone to kinking.

If they can't remove it the simplest solution is to just do as they suggested and put a gator at the boundary and blow fiber to the ETP.

Hopefully the duct kink hasn't also kinked the microduct.

cyril7

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#2999044 21-Nov-2022 09:03

sscribenz:

It sounds like from the notes from Vodafone that the 20mm duct is possibly kinked somewhere and they cant pull the microduct out, that size/brand of continuous ducting seems to prone to kinking.

If they can't remove it the simplest solution is to just do as they suggested and put a gator at the boundary and blow fiber to the ETP.

Hopefully the duct kink hasn't also kinked the microduct.

Hi I dont read any kink at all, if you look at the pictures the green 20mm conduit is infact long run Marley Calibre (note the black inner), this has a smaller inner diameter than normal rigid conduit, so fitting two cables (1x microduct 8-9mm dia, and 1x tight buffer 6mm dia) will not fit. You can either use a plastic tape as a draw wire, this is very thin so will not increase the dia very much, or make suitable half side cuts in the microduct and insert a 3mm nylon draw wire into the micro duct and at the side cuts pull the draw rope out and un gather it and tape it down the side of the micro duct and ensure its secure to the pull weight and remove the micro duct leaving the nylon rope.

Cyril

Axeman480

91 posts

Master Geek

#2999050 21-Nov-2022 09:25

I wish Contactors/Electricians would stop using 20mm pe Chorus continuous ducting from Marley, the inside diameter is just too small/tight for copper 2pair and underground micro duct. Needs to be 20mm inside diameter min.

Took me 2 days solid, to get copper 2 pair through a 50mtr run of that 20mm pe Marley green continuous ducting with draw wire and rodding.

raytaylor

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#2999054 21-Nov-2022 09:39

Axeman480:

Took me 2 days solid, to get copper 2 pair through a 50mtr run of that 20mm pe Marley green continuous ducting with draw wire and rodding.

We do it regularly without an issue.

I dont bother with rods because they dont go round bends easily and usually there is two or three because electricians.

Household vacuum cleaner. Use some electrical tape to attach it to one end for an airtight seal.

At the other end attach some nylon fishing line or some string to a 10cm x 10cm square of plastic shopping bag.
Scrunch it longways, tie the nylon/string around it and use a little bit of electrical tape so the string doesnt come loose and flare the end. Lots of loose flare so it picks up the wind.
Sucks through in about 20 seconds if your bends are wide.

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#2999055 21-Nov-2022 09:42

raytaylor:

Axeman480:

Took me 2 days solid, to get copper 2 pair through a 50mtr run of that 20mm pe Marley green continuous ducting with draw wire and rodding.

We do it regularly without an issue.

I dont bother with rods because they dont go round bends easily and usually there is two or three because electricians.

Household vacuum cleaner. Use some electrical tape to attach it to one end for an airtight seal.

At the other end attach some nylon fishing line or some string to a 10cm x 10cm square of plastic shopping bag.
Scrunch it longways, tie the nylon/string around it and use a little bit of electrical tape so the string doesnt come loose and flare the end. Lots of loose flare so it picks up the wind.
Sucks through in about 20 seconds if your bends are wide.

Diagram

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#2999136 21-Nov-2022 12:05

Jase2985:

S:

@Ray Taylor: I don't understand the sealing to avoid dirt, or about "not to loose the other end into the marley conduit" etc, you mention; I hope guys installing will know.

What he means is someone, anyone tape up the ends of the micro duct/conduit to prevent dirt and water getting in them. i normally use electrical tape.

Yes, Jase2985, thanks. Also got what Ray meant by losing the other end.... was a bit slow!

S

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Wannabe Geek

#2999170 21-Nov-2022 13:46

HI Thanks again. (1) As I understand now, Chorus guys can blow the optic fibre through the black microduct inside the green conduit as is. Do they need a gator at the Drop off box/pit then?

(2) If they can't blow as above then they need to use a draw wire to replace the black microduct with their fibre cable.

Have I got that correctly? If yes, I will pass these suggestions to Vodafone for Chorus. Actually, I am not sure I should be advising them and only wanted to understand that my builder's electrician has not installed the conduit etc incorrectly. (3) It seems he has and Chorus is shuffling between different install systems?

Please let me know if above 1, 2, 3 makes sense. In any case I will tape the ends of the black microduct for protection from dirt, water, etc. Many thanks.

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cyril7

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#2999176 21-Nov-2022 13:59

Hi, yes so to clarify, because the drop is fed from a pole and in this case one of the black Tyco fibre units it uses a pre connectorised cable that is a tight buffer, ie the fibre cores are in a wrapper that is then wrapped in Kevlar yarn that is then in a polyethelene sheath. This cable cannot be blown.

So you either need to have the mico duct (that accepts blown fibre) removed from the conduit, and the tight buffer installed from down the pole and directly into the conduit to the side of the house, or you have to have a GATOR which is just a small under ground rated splice containment placed in a small hand hole pit at the bottom of the pole and have an extra undesriable (from reliabiltiy point of view) splice in the ground.

So honestly the easiest is simply get some suitable nylon draw string 2.5-3mm dia, attach it to the microduct that has been installed, pull the micro duct out leaving the draw string, that draw string wants to be of such a diameter that allows easy taping to the tight buffer and room in the conduit to pull it through.

Cyril

S

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Wannabe Geek

#2999351 21-Nov-2022 18:01

Thanks Cyril.

Chorus has installed a box up the pole and brought cables down the pole through a white pipe to the underground Drop-off point/pit where, I believe, the OHUG of existing aerial connection and two new connections from the property will go.

In the simplest solution in your last paragraph: I understand that the optic fibre will then be attached to the nylon draw string as the micro duct is pulled off the other end?

cyril7

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#2999453 21-Nov-2022 18:27

Hi correct, as they are coming from overhead it will be with mentioned tight buffer that will need a clear conduit through to the ETPnon the side of the house.

The alternative is to use a gator at the bottom of the pole and transition from tight buffer fibre to blown fibre, that transition splice will introduce an unnecessary reliability point best avoided.

Cyril

cyril7

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#2999454 21-Nov-2022 18:28

cyril7: Hi correct, as they are coming from overhead it will be with mentioned tight buffer that will need a clear conduit through to the ETP on the side of the house.

The alternative is to use a gator at the bottom of the pole and transition from tight buffer fibre to blown fibre, that transition splice will introduce an unnecessary reliability point best avoided.

Cyril

Chorusnz

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#3000808 24-Nov-2022 12:36

S:

Thanks Cyril.

Chorus has installed a box up the pole and brought cables down the pole through a white pipe to the underground Drop-off point/pit where, I believe, the OHUG of existing aerial connection and two new connections from the property will go.

In the simplest solution in your last paragraph: I understand that the optic fibre will then be attached to the nylon draw string as the micro duct is pulled off the other end?

Hi there,

It looks like your query has been mostly answered but if you have any further queries specific to your order we can follow up. Please send through a message with your address details if you'd like us to check on anything.

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S

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Wannabe Geek

#3000819 24-Nov-2022 13:14

Thanks everyone for your inputs.

Hi Chorus NZ, if you are from Chorus that's great. I have written to Vodafone to tell Chorus the following. Please take up accordingly. Many thanks. If you are not from Chorus then, if you'd like to talk, I'll be happy send you my number.

QUOTE

Thanks for your email again. I am a little tired of the email exchange and with replying to your separate emails without a discussion trail so I keep repeating myself. Please see attached emails with photos re-attached. If you want to email please reply on this email to keep context. I am copying to: Fibre.Comms@vodafone.nz as advised.

1) As you can see in the photos attached the conduit is a green Chorus 20mm one.

2) My builder's electrician has said he has installed the correct conduit (as mentioned in my earlier email)..

3) I have meanwhile discussed this with experts who install these for fibre. They have said as follows:

- Firstly the optic fibre should be blown and not pulled.

- If that is not possible then get some suitable nylon draw string 2.5-3mm dia, attach it to the microduct that has been installed, pull the micro duct out leaving the draw string, that draw string should be of such a diameter that allows easy taping to the tight buffer and room in the conduit to pull it through. Taping ruggedised micro duct to the tight buffer will probably be too much to pull, but surely they (CHorus) have been on the job long enough to know how to get around that. An alternative is to use a gator at the bottom of the pole and transition from tight buffer fibre to blown fibre, that transition splice will introduce an unnecessary reliability point and is best avoided.This is not a difficult issue.

I am sure you would know the solutions suggested above and the persons I have got advice from are surprised you are not working it out without the gator. I am also advised that the microduct end does need to be kept sealed so water, dirt or moist air doesnt get in there.

I am not in this business so I am passing this on as suggestions from people who are in the business. Please work this out and do the OHUG as soon as possible. You do not need anything from me. However, if you need to discuss then please let me know.

Many thanks

UNQUOTE

S

10 posts

Wannabe Geek

#3025467 22-Jan-2023 12:41

Hello again

The Chorus / subcontractor UCG team came again and said the conduit installed by my builder's electrician is not standard Chorus and not 20mm although it says 20mm on it, that this is a cheap one that sells for a fourth of the Chorus conduit (which UCG/Chorus always buy from Corrys (sems they buy everything from Corrys). They left a piece of their conduit - see photo - which is wider and the right one they say.

The two white & green at the bottom, joined, they left as the correct size. In the installed ones, two upper ones, they can't pull the black ones inside to leave a draw string.

Further, I have two new houses under construction at the rear of my property behind the existing house. This OHUG is ordered for the old front house. Chorus has already made one Drop-off point for all three house connections and my builder has laid the same conduit underground for connecting fibre to all three houses (one of which is the OHUG under consideration while the other two await connection when the new houses are ready to connect in 4-6 weeks).

Now, the Chorus/UCG technicians said that, they can install a gator as the next best solution but the Drop-off point will not take 3 gators and, so, the conduit has to change

I have asked the builder/electrician to see me so I can explain all this.

Apologies for the long post. My queries are:

- Has anyone come across this fake conduit with "20mm Chorus" printed on it?

- Even if this is less than 20mm dia, the black cable inside looks quite loose to me. Can the difficulty in pulling the black cable be only due to a sharp bend in its path (to the houses) and be solved by making the bend more gradual? Or do all three sets of conduits have to change?

Many thanks

Sanjay

Ps: Cyril, what is OP and RSP you mentioned earlier? Thanks.

RunningMan

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#3025468 22-Jan-2023 13:01

I think that was @quickymart that mentioned OP & RSP.

OP = Original Poster i.e. @S in this thread.

RSP = Retail Service Provider - the compnay that supplies your internet connection

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