Real estate, post level 4

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5896 posts

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#3260911 18-Jul-2024 06:20

tweake:

actually there always has been. roughly speaking its having windows that open or mechanical ventilation. its a requirement in the building code.

people just do not run houses very well. however mechanical systems do work better than windows or natural ventilation. (when there is no wind you get no ventilation. when its windy and raining you get to much damp ventilation).

It gets down to below zero where I live, so having windows open isn't exactly a great option in winter. It's not really an adaquete substitute for something like a well-specced positive pressure system.

It's a common theme with houses in our area, as well as stonkingly unlivable temperatures in upstairs areas. Even though they were built by <Major building Co name here> and the houses themselves are great, the standards to which they are in compliance don't promote 'Healthy' homes. And they're quite new (2017 or newer).

Senecio

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#3260929 18-Jul-2024 09:20

In exciting news, I'm travelling down to Nelson today for a pre-settlement inspection for a new to us house that we settle on tomorrow. I for one am glad that it was built only 3 yrs ago and is fully insulated and double glazed under the current standards. Whilst we were completing our diligence on the property the agent sent us the full archive of the council records regarding the build. Being a relatively new build it was very comprehensive (over 1,000 pages). Everything is in there including the records of all of the inspections completed. Some of them had failed initial inspection so there are follow up records including photos of the rectification work.

I know it adds overhead, and that leads to added cost but the assurance that our new home is going to be comfortable and livable for years to come in worth it in my mind. Our current Auckland home is actually pretty well built for its time (1980's) but it still drafty, damp and difficult to keep warm and dry all year round.

quickymart

13925 posts

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#3260938 18-Jul-2024 10:01

Apparently - or so Penk says - some houses are too warm in winter: https://archive.ph/NanO1

tweake

2391 posts

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#3260955 18-Jul-2024 10:11

Senecio:

I for one am glad that it was built only 3 yrs ago and is fully insulated and double glazed under the current standards.

?? i would go check that.

the new rules only came in last year or so. its more than likely it was consented under the old rules, and built to the old standard not the new standard.

tweake

2391 posts

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#3260958 18-Jul-2024 10:21

GV27:

It gets down to below zero where I live, so having windows open isn't exactly a great option in winter. It's not really an adaquete substitute for something like a well-specced positive pressure system.

i agree that the pps system is better than windows. i certainly noticed that myself.

however you also show one of the human perception problems. people see windows open and shut them to keep the heat in. to a lesser extent the same with ventilation systems. but a normal house has the equivalent of windows open in winter via holes/gaps in the house. its really all about perceiving something because you can see it or not. because you see window open, you think your going to get cold. if you can't see it open you think your warm.

people don't think and understand, they tend to see and react.

tweake

2391 posts

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#3260961 18-Jul-2024 10:28

mattwnz:

There is a new eco house down the road that was built with SIP panels and I noticed that the windows were streaming in condensation tonight. I think it relies on a mechanical ventilation and heat exchange system as I think it is one of those houses that are totally sealed.

yes it will be nice and air tight and should have mechanical ventilation.

however i would check if that condensation is on the inside or the outside. if it is on the inside, unless its really cold) then something is wrong with their set up.

as i've seen on this forum, people are being sold erv systems as a fix all, when its actually only part of a system. in a sips house you would want an erv but you also need a whole home dehumidifier. it very important on sips houses as the building is moisture tight. they do not let moisture go outside like a normal house.

edit: for those that don't know, erv's also keep the moisture inside of a home. so a sips house with only erv has almost zero moisture removal.

tweake

2391 posts

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#3261070 18-Jul-2024 16:10

'He hasn't been talking to the industry' - Builders slam insulation rollback

dismay-at-plan-to-revert-to-less-strict-insulation-standards

starting to sound like some minority is pushing it, ie probably a certain company.

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mattwnz

20141 posts

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#3261074 18-Jul-2024 16:19

tweake:

mattwnz:

There is a new eco house down the road that was built with SIP panels and I noticed that the windows were streaming in condensation tonight. I think it relies on a mechanical ventilation and heat exchange system as I think it is one of those houses that are totally sealed.

yes it will be nice and air tight and should have mechanical ventilation.

however i would check if that condensation is on the inside or the outside. if it is on the inside, unless its really cold) then something is wrong with their set up.

as i've seen on this forum, people are being sold erv systems as a fix all, when its actually only part of a system. in a sips house you would want an erv but you also need a whole home dehumidifier. it very important on sips houses as the building is moisture tight. they do not let moisture go outside like a normal house.

edit: for those that don't know, erv's also keep the moisture inside of a home. so a sips house with only erv has almost zero moisture removal.

That is a good point, it is hard to know if it is on eth inside or outside from the street. I have always been skeptical about SIPS for the NZ environment, as traditional timber framed buildings with glass or natural wool insulation etc do allow the buildings to breath

kingdragonfly

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#3261391 19-Jul-2024 11:38

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tweake

2391 posts

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#3261399 19-Jul-2024 11:49

property-investors-rake-500-billion-over-30-years

"Over 30 years, the combined value of New Zealand residential property increased by $1.5 trillion, "

i think thats the bigger headline. especially now that 30 year mortgages are the norm. people have had to work an extra $1.5 trillion dollars worth, plus the interest on that, for nothing.

tweake

2391 posts

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#3263950 24-Jul-2024 12:40

insulation-s-role-in-overheating-a-myth-building-experts

"BRANZ has just come out and said insulation does not cause overheating in homes, it's a common misconception but... it's just not true."

Master Builders declined to answer a question about whether it had lobbied for the rollback. Fletcher Building also did not answer a question about its stance. The minister named the company among those whose representatives were complaining about the standards, in an email he sent to officials.

thats what all this has been about, big companies wants you to buy their products not someone else's by building bigger crappier homes.

Architects told RNZ that if spectacular views justified putting a big window on the sunny side, modelling could tweak the rest of the home so it met the standards, and did not overheat.

i disagree with that. thats architects looking after their own skin. thats in fact one of the problems, trying to use the rest of the house to offset the lack of insulation in one part of the house. trouble is houses are not one big room. each room needs to be done on its own. these are not high performance homes where the house equalizes out.

mattwnz

20141 posts

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#3263996 24-Jul-2024 14:56

tweake:

Architects told RNZ that if spectacular views justified putting a big window on the sunny side, modelling could tweak the rest of the home so it met the standards, and did not overheat.

i disagree with that. thats architects looking after their own skin. thats in fact one of the problems, trying to use the rest of the house to offset the lack of insulation in one part of the house. trouble is houses are not one big room. each room needs to be done on its own. these are not high performance homes where the house equalizes out.

It could depend on if you put insulation on the internal walls to make each space it's own thermal space, and many people keep doors open for rooms not in use. Otherwise heat will transfer through the walls between rooms. But I am a big supporter of large windows on the sunny side for passive solar gains using a thermal mass such as a concrete slab to store that heat. But you need overhangs to stop it in summer, and that is often where there is a problem. People don't tend to complain about overheating in winter. We did this ourselves with larger windows on the northern sides and tiled floors for passive heating. It is free energy and I think it needs to be part of the building code so we design for the sun in our houses.

tweake

2391 posts

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#3264000 24-Jul-2024 15:13

mattwnz:

tweake:

Architects told RNZ that if spectacular views justified putting a big window on the sunny side, modelling could tweak the rest of the home so it met the standards, and did not overheat.

i disagree with that. thats architects looking after their own skin. thats in fact one of the problems, trying to use the rest of the house to offset the lack of insulation in one part of the house. trouble is houses are not one big room. each room needs to be done on its own. these are not high performance homes where the house equalizes out.

It could depend on if you put insulation on the internal walls to make each space it's own thermal. Otherwise heat will transfer through the walls between rooms. But I am a big supporter of large windows on the sunny side for passive solar gains using a thermal mass such as a concrete slab to store that heat. We did this ourselves. It is free energy and I think it needs to be part of the building code so we design for the sun in our houses.

if you put insulation on internal walls then it makes it worse as it separates each room even more. which means the rest of the house can't compensate for the other part. its surprising how much difference even an uninsulated internal wall makes. personally i would prefer insulated internal walls, and its often done usually for noise reasons.

the big windows thing can work well if done right. problem is its often not done well (hence the complaints of overheating) and its often done at the expense of insulation. if its insulated well you don't actually need much solar gain. then you don't have to worry about how much sun the site gets etc.

one of the basic principles of housing is separation from the outdoors and control of indoor climate. when you have lots of solar gain you don't have either, you have a house that's dictated to by the weather.

btw thermal mass is great. but again nz allows that to be done badly. you need insulation for it to work properly. nz rules still allows uninsulated thermal mass houses.

tweake

2391 posts

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#3264230 25-Jul-2024 10:34

teenagers-buy-their-own-home-after-years-saving-their-supermarket-jobs

and we are off !

as soon as banks start pushing interest rates down the RE market is out in full swing stoking the fire FOMO. lets squeeze all the money out of people to inflate house prices. no doubt a nice big advertising campaign will be coming soon. lets see how many suckers we can get into financial trouble this time round.

tweake

2391 posts

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#3264239 25-Jul-2024 11:42

tweake:

teenagers-buy-their-own-home-after-years-saving-their-supermarket-jobs

and we are off !

as soon as banks start pushing interest rates down the RE market is out in full swing stoking the fire FOMO. lets squeeze all the money out of people to inflate house prices. no doubt a nice big advertising campaign will be coming soon. lets see how many suckers we can get into financial trouble this time round.

omg, stuff just deleted their comment section. i guess people pointing out the obvious was not making the RE gods happy.

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