Which brand Heat Pump?

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#2289277 3-Aug-2019 18:26

I have 2 x LG heat pumps and both work very well

snnet

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#2289299 3-Aug-2019 19:15

I would stay away from Fujitsu they are very hit and miss -- it doesn't seem to matter who installs them to a point as there are a lot of product failures. I also wouldn't install Hitachi after seeing my parents' struggles with their two units in their home. Mitsubishi heavy industries is rock solid (as is their consumer brand). Daikin seems to have minimal issues except the hole mysteriously burned in your wallet.

snnet

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#2289300 3-Aug-2019 19:18

timmmay: My eight or so year old Fujitsu hasn't rusted. I've had it serviced twice, just for maintenance. The manual doesn't mention or recommend annual servicing, I think that's largely a money making scheme for installers.

I'd agree in general servicing isn't an absolute must every single year but having decommissioned some units (independent of brand here) that have never been serviced ever when it comes time to pump down the unit in the case of selling it or moving it for a renovation, the valves can be seized and need replacing. I'd probably get the outdoor unit checked out every five years or so to alleviate this.

timmmay

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#2289308 3-Aug-2019 19:51

snnet:

I'd agree in general servicing isn't an absolute must every single year but having decommissioned some units (independent of brand here) that have never been serviced ever when it comes time to pump down the unit in the case of selling it or moving it for a renovation, the valves can be seized and need replacing. I'd probably get the outdoor unit checked out every five years or so to alleviate this.

I tend to get a service every 3 or 4 years, just in case they notice anything. I figure given I have two heat pumps similar age once they fail I'll look at a ducted unit.

bfginger

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#2289309 3-Aug-2019 19:56

Ignore marketing, go to their websites and carefully compare the specifications of the Ecocore APs against the Daikin Coras. In most cases I think there are good reasons to buy a Cora over an AP. From a specifications point of view I wouldn't consider a Mitsubishi minisplit other than the two smaller Hypercore LN units which should be good for modest rooms in cold places.

The quietness marketing of the AP line is based on one specific specification of one specific unit which allows a marketing campaign that suns the whole AP line. The AP25 wouldn't be powerful enough to heat the room shown in the television advert at the lowest setting used to produce the advertised quietest heating db specification.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/7660654/Mitsubishi-heat-pump-ad-misled

timmmay

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#2289311 3-Aug-2019 20:07

bfginger: Ignore marketing, go to their websites and carefully compare the specifications of the Ecocore APs against the Daikin Coras. In most cases I think there are good reasons to buy a Cora over an AP. From a specifications point of view I wouldn't consider a Mitsubishi minisplit other than the two smaller Hypercore LN units which should be good for modest rooms in cold places. The quietness marketing of the AP line is based on one specific specification of one specific unit which allows a marketing campaign that suns the whole AP line. The AP25 wouldn't be powerful enough to heat the room shown in the television advert at the lowest setting used to produce the advertised quietest heating db specification. http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/7660654/Mitsubishi-heat-pump-ad-misled

@bfginger you sound like you really know what you're talking about, but your post is somewhat difficult to understand. What's an "Encore AP"? What a Cora? An AP? What's a Hypercore? With a few edits your post could be super useful, but catering for people who know less than you would make your post a lot more useful :)

bfginger

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#2289346 3-Aug-2019 21:19

EcoCore AP is Mitsubishi Electric's current main high wall heat pump line and the Cora is Daikin's. Daikin hasn't changed the Cora's name through several revisions as very little has been changed while the last version of EcoCore was called the GL which had some differences.

Hypercore is technology that allows the heat pump to work at 100% down to an outdoors temperature of -15C and it is present in Mitsubishi's high style Black Diamond LN series. Heat pump capacity and efficiency suffers below 5-7C depending on the type and quality of engineering. Coras should be above average in the cold but won't work at 100% at -15C.

A heat pump will have an operating capacity specified for heating and cooling. A unit that can operate at 1.4-7.0kW is going to have to power off and on more often at times of low demand than a unit that can run at 0.9-7.0kW as it can't ramp down as low. The maximum capacity differs from the advertised nominal maximum capacity as there is a difference between the short burst maximum and what it can sustain a 7C over long periods.

The EER and COP rating reflect the cooling energy efficiency rating and heating coefficient of performance operating efficiency. A COP of 4.1 means it produces 4.1kW of heat for each 1kW used. AEER and ACOP are annual ratings that include other factors like standby electricity use so those ratings and a large difference between them and EER/COP should be taken into account.

R32 refrigerant is more efficient than the old R410A but it's the delivered efficiency ratings that count. The greater efficiency of R32 has been used to cut costs so most brands' R32 units haven't delivered the gains they could. If two brands' external units both use R32 but one weights 20kg more than the other than says something. Efficiency and quietness are expensive and most people buy based on price and TV ads.

There will be minimum and maximum heating and cooling sound (pressure) db level ratings for the indoors unit specified plus a maximum sound pressure level for the outdoors unit. Some brands provide sound power db levels too which shouldn't be confused with pressure levels, and Panasonic's pressure to power conversions appear to be off. All brands will have some noisy units especially at larger sizes but the largest differences tend to be with multisplit / multiroom units.

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CokemonZ

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#2289448 4-Aug-2019 10:29

. A unit that can operate at 1.4-7.0kW is going to have to power off and on more often at times of low demand than a unit that can run at 0.9-7.0kW as it can't ramp down as low.

That is an interesting point.
We went for a larger unit which can't ramp down as low, but due to the large size of the space figured more is better.
We also have poor insulation - 70s house with no ceiling cavity, and largely single glazed.

Daikin cora 60 scales down to 1kw, we went with the 7.1 which scales down to 2. I think the fuj had slightly better specs, but a six week wait for delivery...... So daikin it was.

Kickinbac

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#2289665 4-Aug-2019 15:18

In my opinion you cant go too wrong sticking to the major brands but you do need to research the actual model / capacity you intend to use and compare it to the other brands. Look for comparisons on COP and EER and noise ratings (dB), they jump around. Each supplier / installer will merit the brand(s) they supply. A good installation is also important.
For example when Mitsubishi Electric say they have the quietest heat pump, they are referring to a 2.5kW model on its super quiet fan speed setting so not really applicable to their 5kW model.

Geektastic

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#2289942 4-Aug-2019 23:37

surfisup1000:

I was going to go daikin, but salesperson convinced me to go with fujitsu which I was initially against.

Our fujitsu is very quiet, the indoor unit is barely audible in quiet mode. Outdoor unit is as quiet as could be expected too. Neighbours certainly couldn't really hear too much when it is running.

There are lots of negative fujitsu reviews, but, they also sell the most, so to be expected.

Anyway, we are very happy with the fujitsu, installed feb this year. My concern is rusting, they don't guarantee against that. Only time will tell.

I have three exterior Fujitsu units on the roof, exposed to the summer blasting of the Wairarapa sun and the winter wind and rain, frost etc.

All fine 12 years later.

mattwnz

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#2289945 5-Aug-2019 00:39

We have 4 mitsubishis indoor units around the house. 3 indoor units with a single multi outdoor unit, and one large indoor and outdoor unit. They are quite quiet.

CokemonZ

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#2289994 5-Aug-2019 08:12

Geektastic:
surfisup1000:

I was going to go daikin, but salesperson convinced me to go with fujitsu which I was initially against.

Our fujitsu is very quiet, the indoor unit is barely audible in quiet mode. Outdoor unit is as quiet as could be expected too. Neighbours certainly couldn't really hear too much when it is running.

There are lots of negative fujitsu reviews, but, they also sell the most, so to be expected.

Anyway, we are very happy with the fujitsu, installed feb this year. My concern is rusting, they don't guarantee against that. Only time will tell.

I have three exterior Fujitsu units on the roof, exposed to the summer blasting of the Wairarapa sun and the winter wind and rain, frost etc.

All fine 12 years later.

Can vouch for this - live in a light salt spray zone, and even though the board had failed the heatpump looked in excellent condition after 9/10 years.

Gilco2

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#2290011 5-Aug-2019 08:47

we live by beach and 14 years ago had a Mitsubishi Heatpump fitted. It was serviced last year professionally. This year I bought new filters from Mitsubishi. This unit has been reliable and reasonably quiet. No rust yet but paint faded on outside unit. Only complaint is when temp gets 5 deg or lower it ices up and spends half hour or more at times going through de icing cycle while you freeze inside with no heat

ajobbins

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#2290016 5-Aug-2019 08:55

mattwnz:
We have 4 mitsubishis indoor units around the house. 3 indoor units with a single multi outdoor unit, and one large indoor and outdoor unit. They are quite quiet.

I have the same setup. Large Mitsi unit in the living area running on it's own outdoor unit, and 3x smaller units one in each of the bedrooms running off one outdoor unit. The bedroom units are 2.2 and 2.5kw models and are very quiet - very easy to sleep with it running, even when above the lowest setting.

The quietness matters more in bedrooms I think, tho the main unit in the living area is also very quiet on lower settings, but I wouldn't be fussed if it was a bit louder.

I did have an issue with the unit in our bedroom making a clicking sound when it was new, but Mitsubishi sent a service person within a couple of days and they replaced a part that was obviously faulty from the factory and it's been silent ever since.

Twitter: ajobbins

timmmay

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#2290022 5-Aug-2019 09:04

The Fujitsu Nocria indoor unit is really quite loud. On "super quiet" we don't have to turn the TV up much (this is a 5.1 system), on low we have to turn it up a bit, on standard you'd just about have to double the volume. It does blow a lot of air though, and it is a 10kw unit. Ourdoor unit is quiet.

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