Gas Bottle Placement Regulations

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#2657736 16-Feb-2021 18:38

Fred99:

Handle9:

There used to be (@aredwood). Haven't seen him for a few years though.

Maybe he'll get a message from you tagging him. Not sure if he was a gasfitter as well as plumber though, IIRC there are separate licenses for each trade. OTOH I'm sure he knows much more than the average punter.

Yeah gasfitters are plumbers with an extra ticket but it's pretty common for them to be both.

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#2657739 16-Feb-2021 18:40

SirHumphreyAppleby:

A Code of Practice is not a binding document.

The AS/NZS standards quoted in the code of practice are if they are referenced in the binding legislation.

Beccara

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#2657741 16-Feb-2021 18:42

Handle9:

Beccara:

Is the heatpump gas or electric? if electric the installation of it and it's COC would have not considered the gas system in any way? unless i'm missing something

I don't think you can't install within an explosion zone without using EX rated gear.

@gregmcc would have a better idea.

Wonder how close it is then:

https://www.worksafe.govt.nz/about-us/news-and-media/electrical-work-near-gas-installations/

Most problems are the result of previous solutions...

All comment's I make are my own personal opinion and do not in any way, shape or form reflect the views of current or former employers unless specifically stated

SirHumphreyAppleby

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#2657742 16-Feb-2021 18:44

Handle9:

SirHumphreyAppleby:

A Code of Practice is not a binding document.

The AS/NZS standards quoted in the code of practice are if they are referenced in the binding legislation.

Correct.

Fred99

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#2657743 16-Feb-2021 18:55

networkn:

The heat pump installer would be required by law presumably to rectify their installation, though I am not sure who would enforce that?

I'm pretty sure that EWRB would be interested, but don't jump the gun on that. Phone the company who installed it, I'm pretty sure that you're right about the 1.5 metres, but I'm not a sparky.

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#2657744 16-Feb-2021 18:56

Who would I need to talk to to find out if the 700mm of clearance between the bottles and the doorway we have currently, from the date the house was built in 2006 is in breach for certain or not? If it's presently in breach, I presume the council will be responsible for the fact it was incorrectly given a COC.

networkn

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#2657745 16-Feb-2021 18:58

Fred99:

networkn:

The heat pump installer would be required by law presumably to rectify their installation, though I am not sure who would enforce that?

I'm pretty sure that EWRB would be interested, but don't jump the gun on that. Phone the company who installed it, I'm pretty sure that you're right about the 1.5 metres, but I'm not a sparky.

Interestingly, he just replied to my email asking for a photo, stating they categorically always install at least 1.5m from the bottles and asking me to verify if it was them that installed it. I have assured him it certainly was.

To be honest, I am not sure how they could have done 1.5m even if they wanted to, as there is a downpipe in the way according to my measurements, and on the other side of that downpipe there is a drain.

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Handle9

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#2657747 16-Feb-2021 18:59

networkn:

Who would I need to talk to to find out if the 700mm of clearance between the bottles and the doorway we have currently, from the date the house was built in 2006 is in breach for certain or not? If it's presently in breach, I presume the council will be responsible for the fact it was incorrectly given a COC.

Liability will likely be with the certifying gas fitter who signed it off but in reality you're probably going to be the one footing the bill.

Edit: Sorry, didn't answer the question. You need to talk to a gas fitter.

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#2657748 16-Feb-2021 19:03

Hopefully you can find a solution that isn’t ‘open to interpretation’, because you can be rest assured that an insurance company will look for anything they can interpret differently.

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#2657749 16-Feb-2021 19:09

By a country mile. I think the cheapest thing, will be to move the heatpump onto the roof immediately above where it is. It's a pain as this means the sound of the condenser will be much closer to my sons room. It will be interesting to see what the heatpump installer has to say about their installation and what they propose, and if they ask us to pay. The concern I have, is that if we refuse to pay, the move could end up being done to a low standard.

I can't *wait* to have to explain all this to my wife.

Fred99

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#2657750 16-Feb-2021 19:12

Handle9:

networkn:

Who would I need to talk to to find out if the 700mm of clearance between the bottles and the doorway we have currently, from the date the house was built in 2006 is in breach for certain or not? If it's presently in breach, I presume the council will be responsible for the fact it was incorrectly given a COC.

Liability will likely be with the certifying gas fitter who signed it off but in reality you're probably going to be the one footing the bill.

I think that probably gets back to whether it was legal at the date it was installed. There *should* be a Code Compliance Certificate (CCC) on file somewhere, if you haven't got a copy then council can get one for you - but they tend to charge $$. It *should* mention the gas install.

Note CCC is final sign-off for building consent passed inspection, CoC (Certificate of Compliance) is what the sparky / heat pump installer should have given you. If the heat pump installer issued a CoC for work that doesn't comply, then I expect they'll treat you with kid gloves and sort it out. If it doesn't comply, then the last thing they'll want is for you to lodge a complaint with with the registration board.

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#2657751 16-Feb-2021 19:15

Scott3:

In terms of a solution, a bunch of separation distance rules allow the distance to be measured around a wall. In some cases, building a wall in between objects to meet separation distance requirements is cheaper than moving the stuff.

Haven't verified if this is the case with gas.

Could also consider switching from bottle gas to natural gas (if available), or going all electric.

I had this exact issue a month ago - gas supply adjacent to a new heat pump install. The boss told me where to put the external unit plinth, but the installer determined the gas bottles were too close to the unit, and wouldn’t commission it. I built a wall between the bottles and the heat pump unit such that creeping around the wall was more than 1.5m, and all was good.

Handle9

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#2657757 16-Feb-2021 19:25

Fred99:

Handle9:

Liability will likely be with the certifying gas fitter who signed it off but in reality you're probably going to be the one footing the bill.

I think that probably gets back to whether it was legal at the date it was installed. There *should* be a Code Compliance Certificate (CCC) on file somewhere, if you haven't got a copy then council can get one for you - but they tend to charge $$. It *should* mention the gas install.

Note CCC is final sign-off for building consent passed inspection, CoC (Certificate of Compliance) is what the sparky / heat pump installer should have given you. If the heat pump installer issued a CoC for work that doesn't comply, then I expect they'll treat you with kid gloves and sort it out. If it doesn't comply, then the last thing they'll want is for you to lodge a complaint with with the registration board.

Yeah sure. The heat pump thing will likely get sorted as it's relatively recent. The door may be another matter. The gas contractor may be gone (or may not). IME for services the council relies on the certifying contractor rather than inspecting everything themselves - building inspectors aren't competent to inspect services, they don't have the expertise. If the installation is certified as compliant (in line with the regs) then that's generally enough to get COC.

Fred99

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#2657760 16-Feb-2021 19:27

BlinkyBill:

I built a wall between the bottles and the heat pump unit such that creeping around the wall was more than 1.5m, and all was good.

That might solve both problems the OP has (proximity to door and heat pump), as well as hide the bottles from view perhaps as a bonus.

networkn

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#2657762 16-Feb-2021 19:35

Fred99:

BlinkyBill:

I built a wall between the bottles and the heat pump unit such that creeping around the wall was more than 1.5m, and all was good.

+1

That might solve both problems the OP has (proximity to door and heat pump), as well as hide the bottles from view perhaps as a bonus.

Which is pretty weird, since Gas likely won't go "around" a corner to get to an ignition point. It's not "more" safe with a wall between them.

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