Serene heaters recall

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Paul1977

5043 posts

Uber Geek

#3224755 30-Apr-2024 19:31

mattwnz: IANAL. But I understand all new houses are also covered by 10 years of implied warranties, and 1 year defects period under the building act. https://www.building.govt.nz/projects-and-consents/why-contracts-are-valuable/implied-warranties-and-defects

We’re outside of our 2 year “defects” period, and the 10 year one is a MasterBuild warranty which after 2 or 3 years (can’t remember which) only covers structural problems. So no help there.

I thought it would be a clear cut CGA issue, but perhaps not?

Handle9

11391 posts

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Lifetime subscriber

#3224757 30-Apr-2024 19:34

Paul1977:

There doesn't seem to be a clear answer on who should be paying for the labour costs for removal and installation of a replacement.

We have one that was part of a 2020 new build. Electrician has said they can supply a replacement free of charge under CGA, but we'll need to pay for the install. I understand they've had this mess dumped on them through no fault of their own, but if they supplied and installed the original (and have acknowledged it's replacement is covered under CGA) doesn't that mean the reinstallation should be covered as well?

Latest update on Master Electricians website say essentially says they don't know:

Our initial research around the responsibility for costs of replacement and/or reinstallation costs has opened up the need for further investigation into the matter, as there is a multitude of scenarios which need to be looked into. We appreciate your patience while we ensure we get you the right information.

Everything I read is also saying don't remove the old one yourself if hardwired; but isn't this just a like-for-like replacement that a homeowner with basic electrical knowledge can legally do themselves? Am I mistaken here?

The electrician is wrong. If he supplied it he is responsible for all losses to the consumer, including his labour.

The relevant section of the act is section 18 (4)

In addition to the remedies set out in subsection (2) and subsection (3), the consumer may obtain from the supplier damages for any loss or damage to the consumer resulting from the failure (other than loss or damage through reduction in value of the goods) which was reasonably foreseeable as liable to result from the failure.

https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1993/0091/latest/DLM312823.html

You may need to threaten the disputes tribunal but it's very clear who is responsible.

mattwnz

20157 posts

Uber Geek

#3224769 30-Apr-2024 21:01

Paul1977:
mattwnz: IANAL. But I understand all new houses are also covered by 10 years of implied warranties, and 1 year defects period under the building act. https://www.building.govt.nz/projects-and-consents/why-contracts-are-valuable/implied-warranties-and-defects

We’re outside of our 2 year “defects” period, and the 10 year one is a MasterBuild warranty which after 2 or 3 years (can’t remember which) only covers structural problems. So no help there.

I thought it would be a clear cut CGA issue, but perhaps not?

IANAL
The 10 years of implied warranties are in addition to any third party warranties you have. This is under the building act and is automatic.

Handle9

11391 posts

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Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3224770 30-Apr-2024 21:05

mattwnz:
Paul1977:

We’re outside of our 2 year “defects” period, and the 10 year one is a MasterBuild warranty which after 2 or 3 years (can’t remember which) only covers structural problems. So no help there.

I thought it would be a clear cut CGA issue, but perhaps not?

IANAL
The 10 years of implied warranties are in addition to any third party warranties you have. This is under the building act and is automatic.

Enforcement of the building act is difficult and expensive. The CGA is much easier.

MadEngineer

4279 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#3224771 30-Apr-2024 21:08

My answer wasn’t direct at your ability to do this or not, it was to answer exactly what you’re asking. My point is if I was putting up a website or other written content I wouldn’t advise for a homeowner to go ahead and try it themselves - hence why everything you’re reading doesn’t offer that advice.

You're not on Atlantis anymore, Duncan Idaho.

Paul1977

5043 posts

Uber Geek

#3224884 1-May-2024 08:56

MadEngineer: My answer wasn’t direct at your ability to do this or not, it was to answer exactly what you’re asking. My point is if I was putting up a website or other written content I wouldn’t advise for a homeowner to go ahead and try it themselves - hence why everything you’re reading doesn’t offer that advice.

Fair enough. For most home owners it probably is a terrible idea for them to do any electrical work themselves.

Rushmere

354 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3228843 10-May-2024 18:21

I did get the promised update from Bunnings today regarding the recall.

They said (as expected) that the Serene S2088 is not part of the recall, but have said that I can nevertheless return this model “for peace of mind”.

I’m very happy with that!

Tradepub

Free professional, reference and technical white papers (affiliate link).

JayADee

2148 posts

Uber Geek

#3228891 10-May-2024 23:02

Rushmere:

I did get the promised update from Bunnings today regarding the recall.

They said (as expected) that the Serene S2088 is not part of the recall, but have said that I can nevertheless return this model “for peace of mind”.

I’m very happy with that!

Well darn. I didn’t get mine from Bunnings or I'd do the same. Glad you got a good outcome though.

Rushmere

354 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3232005 18-May-2024 03:54

I got my refund from Bunnings today for my 2 Serene S2088 heaters.

They also offered to reimburse labour costs for removing the heaters and installing replacements.

I’m extremely happy with the service from Bunnings. They made the process effortless, and went beyond what they were legally required to do (as these specific models haven’t actually been officially recalled).

JayADee

2148 posts

Uber Geek

#3233995 23-May-2024 23:33

Rushmere:

I got my refund from Bunnings today for my 2 Serene S2088 heaters.

They also offered to reimburse labour costs for removing the heaters and installing replacements.

I’m extremely happy with the service from Bunnings. They made the process effortless, and went beyond what they were legally required to do (as these specific models haven’t actually been officially recalled).

That's a super outcome! I got mine from Mico- mico.co.nz. I'm going to email them with my concerns. I want to replace this heater. Have you seen this? http://heatingco.co.nz/product/?id=11

Oh and what are you replacing them with?

Rushmere

354 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3234046 24-May-2024 08:36

JayADee:

Rushmere:

I got my refund from Bunnings today for my 2 Serene S2088 heaters.

They also offered to reimburse labour costs for removing the heaters and installing replacements.

I’m extremely happy with the service from Bunnings. They made the process effortless, and went beyond what they were legally required to do (as these specific models haven’t actually been officially recalled).

That's a super outcome! I got mine from Mico- mico.co.nz. I'm going to email them with my concerns. I want to replace this heater. Have you seen this? http://heatingco.co.nz/product/?id=11

Oh and what are you replacing them with?

I was looking at this but they seem to be unavailable currently.

After my very good experience with Bunnings, I'm now thinking about ordering a couple of these, which appear to be similar but quite a bit cheaper.

JayADee

2148 posts

Uber Geek

#3235300 27-May-2024 15:53

Yes those look good too. I'd be happy with either.

GPML

2 posts

Wannabe Geek

#3320440 14-Dec-2024 13:48

Hi Everyone,

We see that there are many concerns and ambiguities around the Serene heater recall.

We can quickly make these issues crystal clear for everyone.

Our company provides safety audit and quality assurance services to the electrical industry, and we have been directly involved since 2016 with both Serene Industries and WorksafeNZ concerning the numerous fire and safety issues around Serene heater products, in both New Zealand and Australia.

THESE ARE THE FACTS:
1. Serene Industries operated an office in New Zealand, as well as in Australia under licensee/franchise.

2. For all the same safety concerns the Australia licensee shut their Serene business down in late 2017 when these safety issues became known, and promptly sent all their Serene products to scrap.

3. Via our company safety audit reports both Serene Industries and WorksafeNZ have known all about these fire safety and compliance issues with many Serene products as early as 2016. Nearly eight years ago at the time of writing.

4. There have been no less than 52x separate formal safety audit reports/warnings submitted by our company to both Serene Industries and Worksafe during the years 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021.

5. By the end of 2021 and after 52x safety warnings we simply gave up on getting anything meaningful out of WorksafeNZ, despite these warnings being submitted right up to CEO and Ministerial level. Copies of our final submissions to the CEO and Minister have been included in the media coverage by Stuff as well as Crux.org.nz

6. Our company even told both Serene Industries and WorksafeNZ explicitly from very early on that they must heed these safety warnings - that at best this will end up all over the front page media and the largest product recall in New Zealand history - at worst people will be killed.

7. Who knew about all this and who should pay? Ultimately it is WorksafeNZ that should pay this cost. But right now they are hiding behind a principle called ‘Crown Indemnity’.

8. The S2088 'All Metal' heater model is not included in the Worksafe recall, even though it may be depicted in the various media reports.
Whilst the S2088 model quality is still poor and it will not last its 10Year warranty…… it is not unsafe, because it is all metal and fully earthed.

9. The fact Serene Industries swiftly disappeared without trace when this recall materialised, is testament to the fact that the Australian operations that they took over in late 2017 has been under investigation for fraud since 2019 and WorksafeNZ were also fully aware of this. https://wikifrauds.net/Serene%20Industries.html

10. When one asks how on earth this could possibly happen when all the warning signs were right under WorksafeNZ noses for years – one has to bear in mind that this Worksafe incompetence, ineptitude and inaction is precisely the how and why 29 miners were killed in an explosion at the Pike River Mine Disaster in 2010.
The unsafe conditions that were allowed to develop and continue at Pike River Mine for years, also all happened with the full knowledge of both company management and Worksafe through the numerous safety warnings alerted by mine operations.

11. Every ounce of supporting documentation has been included in a new Facebook support group: Serene Heater Recall https://www.facebook.com/groups/1554902758448780

Thanks

GPML

2 posts

Wannabe Geek

#3320442 14-Dec-2024 13:58

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