Real estate, post level 4

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#2737620 1-Jul-2021 23:16

Batman:

quickymart:

As I don't have a mortgage, what happens when someone who has a mortagage loses their job and can't make the payments? Does the bank just reclaim the house and sell it, and the person who has been making said mortgage payments gets nothing?

in a mortgagee sale:

mortagee gets the balance of : sale price - amount owed - marketing fees. if the number is negative then the bank will try to get back what's owed from other securities. if the number is positive then they get money back.

be aware that in a mortgagee sale you are not buying the mortgagee's possessions. i've heard stories of buyers taking possession to find the kitchen missing, carpet missing, some form of derelict transformation takes place!

In the UK some banks are getting into buying houses as investments to rent out. So they could get some good deals from some of their own customers.

I have also seen a lot of reverse mortgage ads on tv recently, and banks are being a lot more conservative with their lending in the last month(several agents have mentioned this to me), so conditions seem to be changing.

mattwnz

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#2737622 1-Jul-2021 23:19

mudguard:

Hickey made an interesting point, I think we all know that the lead in time to get enough trades people is about seven years. Others say, bring people in from overseas, but they have to live somewhere too! Which exacerbates the problem!

The message from the podcast was anyone born after 2008 don't bother trying to buy unless your parent's own property. I guess has home ownership rates drop, this will affect more and more kids.

Temporary work visas. They brought in a lot of people for the Chch rebuild and many returned. When they could have stayed to build more houses.

But I do wonder why NZ doesn't have more multi-generational houses which is common overseas. The problem is that the number of people per house is dropping.

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#2737625 1-Jul-2021 23:53

Some houses are uninhabited

robbyp

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#2737628 2-Jul-2021 00:35

Batman: Some houses are uninhabited

This is the thing everyone seems to be ignoring, partly due to there being no firm stats on it

tdgeek

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#2737690 2-Jul-2021 07:27

mattwnz:

Temporary work visas. They brought in a lot of people for the Chch rebuild and many returned. When they could have stayed to build more houses.

But you need people who WILL build more houses. There is no barrier there. But we prefer to sign today, move in in 3 weeks, much easier. Acquiring a house is very common, but building is niche. You need to make building attractive. But then someone here recently posted that they then have to travel too far. Yes, massive subdivisions next to the CBD arent that common... With the buy instead of build attitude, nothing will change.

GV27

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#2737728 2-Jul-2021 09:05

tdgeek:

Yes, massive subdivisions next to the CBD arent that common... With the buy instead of build attitude, nothing will change.

Prior to the recent policy statement, intense development of central city land (i.e. tall enough to justify the expense of the land AND then the additional costs incurred in going up like lifts etc) has been too easily stifled by locals or just outright barred at a zoning level. So we haven't seen the type of offerings in the apartment/terraced housing space like you see in other cities, and the value has been poor.

Hopefully this changes rapidly in the next few years. No one wants an 50sqm apartment on the fringe with limited utility that still requires a one hour commute that still attracts a premium price tag.

But a decent-sized, family living space with access to rapid transit links closer to the city centre at the same price is a different proposition. We can't blame Kiwis for not buying something that is effectively non-existent in the only market big enough to really handle it.

tdgeek

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#2737735 2-Jul-2021 09:17

Fair points. Are there spaces in CBD's that allow more apartments? I guess so. We could expand that? Like many others I dont want my 1/4 acre paradise surrounded by 10 storey apartments, I don't think that unreasonable. Although they could build subdivisions that are apartment based? Rapid transit, yes thats important for most cities. Needs to be cost effective though, so someone will have to subsidise it I'd suggest, but the Kiwi mentality is NIMBY or its too expensive or its too slow or the seats are too hard. I'll never use the words whinging pom ever again, we are worse. With all that said, we can just buy instead of build, house prices are the price we pay

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GV27

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#2737744 2-Jul-2021 09:31

tdgeek:

Fair points. Are there spaces in CBD's that allow more apartments? I guess so. We could expand that? Like many others I dont want my 1/4 acre paradise surrounded by 10 storey apartments, I don't think that unreasonable. Although they could build subdivisions that are apartment based? Rapid transit, yes thats important for most cities. Needs to be cost effective though, so someone will have to subsidise it I'd suggest, but the Kiwi mentality is NIMBY or its too expensive or its too slow or the seats are too hard. I'll never use the words whinging pom ever again, we are worse. With all that said, we can just buy instead of build, house prices are the price we pay

That depends, are you benefiting from amenities like rapid transport or frequent bus services? These cost far more to provide in the outer suburbs, so forcing development and travel costs onto others because you think others shouldn't be able to build what they want on their land is a hard case to argue, especially in a city growing as fast as Auckland.

Agreed, we are worse. And people take it as some sort of personal insult when we point how hard it is for new buyers. Yes, it might have been hard when you bought your first home, but that doesn't mean we should accept making it borderline impossible for people today.

I sometimes wonder if people will have an epiphany when all their grandchildren leave NZ and they're left on their own; maybe making it so hard for people to get by here that they have no choice but to leave isn't in our long term interests.

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#2737749 2-Jul-2021 09:40

antonknee:

Real easy to say “build” - but build what and build it where? Looking at Auckland, empty sections aren’t easy to find unless you want to be in Pokeno or the equivalent up around Silverdale. Not everyone can afford to buy a section with an existing house, bowl it, and build new. Not to mention we should be reigning in the urban sprawl a bit for a variety of reasons, not encouraging it. Not to mention buying empty sections and building can be harder to get lending for.

It’s just not helpful to say “build instead of buy”, I’m sorry.

I live on the North Shore. I see a LOT of vacant land that could be built on. Albany Mall is surrounded by vacant land just begging to be built on - high density housing next to a mall and a bus station? perfect! It's probably all zoned industrial or some such, but there's definitely plenty of land.

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#2737754 2-Jul-2021 09:54

GV27:

That depends, are you benefiting from amenities like rapid transport or frequent bus services? These cost far more to provide in the outer suburbs, so forcing development and travel costs onto others because you think others shouldn't be able to build what they want on their land is a hard case to argue, especially in a city growing as fast as Auckland.

Agreed, we are worse. And people take it as some sort of personal insult when we point how hard it is for new buyers. Yes, it might have been hard when you bought your first home, but that doesn't mean we should accept making it borderline impossible for people today.

I sometimes wonder if people will have an epiphany when all their grandchildren leave NZ and they're left on their own; maybe making it so hard for people to get by here that they have no choice but to leave isn't in our long term interests.

Urban sprawl is urban sprawl, a growing city will always get bigger. No its not reasonable to build an apartment next door to me, but that doesnt mean I'm forcing you out. If I wanted to build a big house on a big section I'd also need to go further out, so its on everyone not just apartment hopefuls. Its a big city expansion issue. As the above poster said, there are places where it is suitable to build high. The next subdivision could be an apartment subdivision

Today's borderline impossible is what happens when no one does anything. Whether Labour or National or Mother Teresa are running this country its too late now. What could have been tinkered with decades ago, wasn't. So the fix, which will happen, will now happen over many decades, or maybe it wont as we now live in a low wage economy so that probably scuppers it in any case.

There will now be the haves and have nots, depends if your parents left you a house. Unless there is some way to have large scale developments that dont end up like UK slums. But the core issue is not now, its why not back then was this not managed? Both parties have had extensive terms but nothing happened and here we are

I dont know the answer.

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#2737755 2-Jul-2021 09:55

Handsomedan:

I live on the North Shore. I see a LOT of vacant land that could be built on. Albany Mall is surrounded by vacant land just begging to be built on - high density housing next to a mall and a bus station? perfect! It's probably all zoned industrial or some such, but there's definitely plenty of land.

I've seen that too, walking from the busway station to the mall and wondered/asked why more apartments (similar to the ones already up) simply can't be built on them a few pages back...apparently there is a reason why, but it escapes me at the moment.

Also; Bernard puts forward an idea about tackling the current housing issue (maybe): https://thespinoff.co.nz/business/02-07-2021/bernard-hickey-a-big-housing-idea-for-ye-me-of-little-faith-or-hope/

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#2737829 2-Jul-2021 10:41

tdgeek:

Unless there is some way to have large scale developments that don't end up like UK slums.

Having lived for a couple of years in a large-scale South London Council Estate, I can categorically state that we want to avoid this happening in New Zealand as much as possible.

The low-rise sprawling blocks like ours were just as bad as the high rise tower blocks. You just had better access to your flat than having to run the gauntlet of thuggery and druggery.

I don't know what the answer is, either. But it can't be turning NZ cities into the equivalent of UK cities.

EDIT: Spelling and incomplete sentence

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#2737836 2-Jul-2021 10:52

Handsomedan:

tdgeek:

Unless there is some way to have large scale developments that don't end up like UK slums.

Having lived for a couple of years in a large-scale South London Council Estate, I can categorically state that we want to avoid this happening in New Zealand as much as possible.

The low-rise sprawling blocks like ours were just as bad as the high rise tower blocks. You just had better access to your flat than having to run the gauntlet of thuggery and druggery.

I don't know what the answer is, either. But it can't be turning NZ cities into the equivalent of UK cities.

EDIT: Spelling and incomplete sentence

100% Agree. I can imagine a subdivision being developed that has blocks of apartments. Under cover parking. A green area in the centre, a community if you will. Basically identical to any other apartment buildings but in the suburbs. And avoid th4e seedy side, I think we can do that here

mudguard

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#2737895 2-Jul-2021 13:16

Handsomedan:

I live on the North Shore. I see a LOT of vacant land that could be built on. Albany Mall is surrounded by vacant land just begging to be built on - high density housing next to a mall and a bus station? perfect! It's probably all zoned industrial or some such, but there's definitely plenty of land.

Problem is it would be sold at $750,000 per section I imagine!

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#2737965 2-Jul-2021 14:51

mudguard:

Handsomedan:

I live on the North Shore. I see a LOT of vacant land that could be built on. Albany Mall is surrounded by vacant land just begging to be built on - high density housing next to a mall and a bus station? perfect! It's probably all zoned industrial or some such, but there's definitely plenty of land.

Problem is it would be sold at $750,000 per section I imagine!

Yes...that's a major problem, but if there's that much land and the housing is high density, surely this can bring the overall cost-per-unit down, as the supply goes up due to the sheer number available, or about to be available.

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