Water charges Auckland Rental properties

Forums › Home Workshop DIY › Water charges Auckland Rental properties

Bee

732 posts

Ultimate Geek

#116095 18-Apr-2013 09:54

Hi,

I'm not sure where to start with this so I thought I'd try this public forum first.

Basically, with the new Supercity and changes in law(?) last year, we now get our water bill monthly instead of half yearly or Quarterly or whatever it was...

We also pay for water AND wastewater whereas previously wastewater was paid by the house owner.

Our bill still goes to the property manager who then pays it and forwards the bill to us - several days later most of the time - leaving us with 5 or less days to pay... Previously they split the bill out between us and the house owner so it made sense to do it this way..

But now, why cant the bill just come directly to us? This would cut out work for the Property manager and give us more notice and time to pay the bill...

We pay phone and power etc directly to the company so why not water???

Has anyone been in the same scenario and successfully changed the way this works?

How would I go about changing this or is there still some regulation or law in place that stops me changing where the water bill is sent to???

Doing your best is much more important than being the best.

1 | 2

2829 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#801366 18-Apr-2013 10:08

Talk to your landlord and property manager.
Im a landlord in Auckland and our water bill gets emailed to both myself and the property manager. (I set this up by loggin into the watercare website). You could ask your landlord to add your email address to the account as well thus giving you some extra time to see what your up for.

There was no law change regarding the water rates... its just the new policy of watercare to invoice monthly and you may know that previously the fixed charge was part of the rates bill (which was seperate). Its now on the one bill from watercare (water used, wasted and fixed charge).

From what you explain above, you really need to talk to the property manager and ask them why you they only give you 5 days to pay your water usuage as the original water bill has already been paid by the property manager or by the landlord.

In my situation, I auto pay the waterbill myself each month and the email copy the property manager recieves is then passed onto the tennant who then pays the property manager and then me. Im not sure how much time the property manager gives the tennant to pay but thats not my problem ! (hence why I have a property manager).

I hear what your saying about having the tennant being able to pay the water directly.... I agree but in the current scheme, the water bill is tied to the legal owner so any debts or issues are their responsibility. Id rather not have watercare send me to the debt collectors each month because of a small water bill charge not being paid on time. Ive seen other landlords get stung with bad credit flags just because of the water bill.

So in summary, ask niceley to the property manager to ask the landlord to add your email address to the monthly bill dispatch and you should be able to get the bill at the same time everyone else does.

Just remember the landlord pays the fixed charges of the monthly waterbill and the tennant pays for usuage and wastage.

groynk

234 posts

Master Geek

#801367 18-Apr-2013 10:08

I found that strange when I moved to a place in which I had to pay for water last year too.
If the bill is to the landlord, why am I paying it? Once I got over that, like you I thought well the tenant should be billed directly.
I imagine the reason is, that Watercare wouldn't wan't to do that as it would create a lot more administration work.
They did at least get a bit better halfway through last year by allowing online payments to anyone's bill. Initially it was only from the billed user!

In your case if the bill is paid by the property manager then the only deadline is from the property manager for reimbursement.
i.e. you don't necessarily have to pay the property manager so quickly, just negotiate a bit longer, or pay late.

Goosey

2829 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#801369 18-Apr-2013 10:09

Oh if your property has a water catcher (rainwater tank) then this reduces your wasteage calculation somewhat. It may have changed but this was the case in the old Waitakere Council area.

Bee

732 posts

Ultimate Geek

#801392 18-Apr-2013 10:22

So in summary, ask niceley to the property manager to ask the landlord to add your email address to the monthly bill dispatch and you should be able to get the bill at the same time everyone else does.

Just remember the landlord pays the fixed charges of the monthly waterbill and the tennant pays for usuage and wastage.

Maybe I'm missing out on something then? I shouldn't be paying the fixed charges???

From what I can see now, the Property manager pays the full Watercare bill and then I (The Tennant) pay them back. The bill is in the Landlords (property owners) name and they no longer pay anything to watercare.

The property manager sends me a letter with the invoice requesting payment by the date on the invoice even thou they have already paid watercare.

Its a totally ridiculous situation that I intend to fix and I'm surprised that no one has thought about fixing this earlier. I'm sure landlords and property managers would be happy not to have to do this paper work and administration EVERY month and I would like the bill to come to me directly earlier so that I can put aside the exact amount from my next pay instead of having to make an educated guess...

Doing your best is much more important than being the best.

Goosey

2829 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#801466 18-Apr-2013 11:22

I was informed by my property manager that the fixed charge is my responsibility as per the rates. (As the fixed charge used to be in the rates bill). You perhaps need to check the contract you have with your property management company.

As a landlord, I dont have to do anything extra.... the bill comes via email and its paid automaticially by my credit card authority. I pay the property manager their monthly fee to do the rest i.e. collect this water charge from the tennant as well as their rent etc. EASY.

The property manager is invoicing you for your use as they should do !
As mentioned before it seems your issue is with their 5 day timeframe they give you. You need to talk to the property manager to come to an arrangement that suits you both. Of course the watercare bill has already been paid....it has to be ! (or they get nasty and send the land owner to the debt collectors ASAP).

Im sure you would have signed an agreement when you started your tennancy which would have mentioned the payment of the water charges.

Bee

732 posts

Ultimate Geek

#801483 18-Apr-2013 11:38

A plan of attack is being formulated :)

First point is to confirm whether or not the Landlord is required to pay the fixed charges of the water bill by LAW (Residential Tenancies Act)

The definitive answer to this question will decide the next step...

Doing your best is much more important than being the best.

Goosey

2829 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#801496 18-Apr-2013 11:45

I just saw an online article which stated the tennant does not pay the fixed charges.
Again, I would check the tennancy agreement you signed as there might have been somthing mentioning the water bill.

Even if you do prove you dont have to pay the fixed charges for the water bill (which Im sure you should be able to), it doesnt change the fact that the agreement you currently have with your property manager has been set with you the tennant paying the applicable water charges within 5 days of their notification to you. This could have been somthing you agreed to or simply somthing you can negociate with the property manager.
It wont have anything to do with the landlord.

Equinox IT

Cloud spending continues to surge globally, but most organisations haven’t made the changes necessary to maximise the value and cost-efficiency benefits of their cloud investments. Download the whitepaper From Overspend to Advantage now.

hangon

397 posts

Ultimate Geek

#801498 18-Apr-2013 11:54

You shouldn't be paying the waste water fixed charges, it was part of the rate and still a responsibility for the landlord now.

Under the Residential Tenancies Act 1998 a tenant is responsible for

water supplier charges which are exclusively attributable to them.
Waste water charges may be able to be passed on to the tenant where
those charges are based on consumption. Please check this link for more information:
http://www.dbh.govt.nz/water-charges

I confirmed with watercare that at this stage, they are unable to separate the volumetric charges and pass it to tenants separately. They could,
For tenanted properties we are able to address invoices to; Care Of
The Tenant, at the property address. Please note that the property
owner still remains responsible for payment of the account even when
the invoices are being sent care of the tenant.

Many people (landlords n tenants) were appalled by the changes. Watercare decided to charge a percentage (78.5) of water usage as waste water usage based on assumptions, and changed it to monthly bill based on another fishy "research".

The end result is the waste water charges costing more than before. It was like $500 ish per year from back of my head, now it's $190 fixed plus twice the cost of water at 78.5% of water volume. for a family of 4 at upper band it would cost $449 + $190 = $639 in total per year.

And it's creating extra works for landlords, they have to chase the volumetric charges every month.

And that
"One of the reasons that Watercare holds the property owner responsible is the fact that we cannot refuse to supply a customer. Unlike other utility companies, we cannot refuse to supply a tenant or put them on pay-as-you-go like electricity companies. On this basis our relationship with the owner who approves the tenant and maintains a relationship with them as part of the tenancy act."

But they will be happy to put a pressure restriction device and charge you $100 if you bill is overdue...

Regs

4066 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Snowflake

#801568 18-Apr-2013 12:40

hangon: You shouldn't be paying the waste water fixed charges, it was part of the rate and still a responsibility for the landlord now.

waste water is now consumption based, not fixed, in the new watercare supercity environment. It used to vary between councils.

Sales Engineer
Snowflake
www.snowflake.com

about.me/nzregs
Twitter: @nzregs

hangon

397 posts

Ultimate Geek

#801575 18-Apr-2013 12:45

Regs:
hangon: You shouldn't be paying the waste water fixed charges, it was part of the rate and still a responsibility for the landlord now.

waste water is now consumption based, not fixed, in the new watercare supercity environment. It used to vary between councils.

you made me speechless for a sec

WASTEWATER (RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMERS): Every home in Auckland now pays a single, region-wide wastewater tariff. Customers pay a $190 fixed service charge per water meter, plus a volumetric charge of $2.281 per 1000 litres (the volumetric component is charged on a percentage of the volume of water consumed through the water meter). Customers that do not have water meters but are connected to the wastewater network pay a fixed charge of $582 per year.

http://www.watercare.co.nz/about-watercare/news/Pages/Watercare-to-introduce-changes-to-water-and-wastewater-charges.aspx

Regs

4066 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Snowflake

#801583 18-Apr-2013 12:52

i misread your first line, i thought it said that landlords were paying for all wastewater still :-)

yes there is still a fixed charge for having the pipes and/or meter connected which we, as landlords pay for, plus now this consumption-based (*) (volumetric) charge on top.

(*) as you point out, the consumption based one is 'fishy'. if you water the gardens, or fill a swimming pool, you're not consuming wastewater services but being charged as though you are.

Sales Engineer
Snowflake
www.snowflake.com

about.me/nzregs
Twitter: @nzregs

bazzer

3438 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#801644 18-Apr-2013 13:48

Regs: (*) as you point out, the consumption based one is 'fishy'. if you water the gardens, or fill a swimming pool, you're not consuming wastewater services but being charged as though you are.

Isn't that why wastewater out is a percentage of water used rather than all the water used?

hangon

397 posts

Ultimate Geek

#801668 18-Apr-2013 14:07

Isn't that why wastewater out is a percentage of water used rather than all the water used?

yes and no.

the percentage (78.5%) was based on some research of average household. there are fine prints that some customers may be charged a different rate, but afaik most if not all residential are charged at that rate.

now is it wrong to say, since the average salary is $48k a year (June 12), everyone's tax rate should be capped at 17.5%?

that might be a bit extreme, variation of produce waste water is likely significantly less than the salaries.

however the end result, for anyone (other than landlords, some of who enjoyed a 10% rate hike instead) i talked to, is that their waste water bill increased. for tenants, it's particularly bad, it's like their water bill increased 160% overnight.

the policy doesn't seem to encourage the grey water usage - tree huggers (no offence) using bio degradable shampoo and connect shower to water vege gardens? they still need to pay waste water charges on every droplet they saved.

nickb800

2715 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#801676 18-Apr-2013 14:23

Do they allow a second meter to measure outdoor water use? I've heard of this in the states, an arrangement where all outdoor taps run off a separate sub-meter, so they charge your water consumption off the main meter, and then your wastewater consumption based on the difference between the two meters

MurrayM

2455 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#801682 18-Apr-2013 14:29

I've recently (two months ago) moved into a new rental property and this was my first experience with the new WaterCare system (at my previous house the water was included in the rent so I never saw anything).

For me I deal directly with the landlord, there's no property manager. WaterCare invoices are emailed to my landlord and a hard copy is posted to me (they're addressed "To the Tennant" so they don't have my name on them). My landlord told me to just pay the bill online, but after talking to a friend I found out that the landlord is responsible for the fixed waste water portion, not me. So now my landlord pays the fixed portion and I pay the rest.

1 | 2