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Fred99

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#166257 7-Mar-2015 17:54
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SWMBO bought a pair of these ceiling lamps:

Above, they've got 42w 90mm globe halogen bulbs in them, two lamps running off a dimmer, which I think is an HPM trailing edge / soft start type. 
They are supposed to cast a shadow pattern on the ceiling - that's the point.  If you don't like it - then you deal with my SWMBO - I'll get her to join GZ to argue the point.  But IMO, with those globes, the filament is very small hence the shadow cast is very sharp and needs softening.
90mm diameter frosted/white bulbs are no good - very little or no shadow cast.  Smaller "normal size" bulbs don't look very good.
I have a (one) 4w "filament type" 120mm clear LED globe.  There's no mention whether these are specifically "dimmable" (but presumably not - or they'd be saying so).  These are "allume" brand.  One obvious problem is that the dimmer is rated 10w minimum, and sure enough, if the LED is run in one lamp (with the other empty), it doesn't work (glows slightly, and won't dim at all).  However, if I put a 42W halogen in the other socket, then it works perfectly, and because the LED "filament" is much larger (than the halogen) it casts a much softer shadow - perfect.  But there's a problem - 2 x 4 is still only 8w (dimmer min 10w), and even if they seem to dim perfectly is there some possibility that the dimmer or lamp will die?  Or would they even work without the resistive load of the halogen bulb in parallel?  Is there a dimmer which would work, but with minimum less than 10w?.  If there are some E27 globes, LED "faux filament" type, 90 or 120mm, clear glass, > 5w then where would I find them?  Google is not being my friend, I don't see anything on TM or at local retailers.



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Aredwood
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  #1252933 7-Mar-2015 20:10

Have a look at http://sound.westhost.com/lamps/dimmers+leds.html Problem is most dimmers only work properly with a resistive load. You may have to have a low wattage filament lamp or heating element permanently connected. Try using 1 of those plug in air fresheners. Alot of them have a heating element that is rated at approx 7W.







richms
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  #1252943 7-Mar-2015 20:21
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Most of the filiment LED lamsp have a pretty ghetto power supply, if you can call it that. A capacitor to limit current, rectify it and stick it into the series string of LEDs.

bigclivedotcom on youtube has pulled heaps apart and reviewed them. He always says in the video there is no visible flicker but you can see it in the video that there is.

Whatever you do dont get lamps like the corn lamps with many LEDs. That will give you multiple shadows that make it really ugly.

IMO stick with the incandesents in that. its only a small wattage decoreative lamp, not like you are lighting the whole room with it.





Richard rich.ms

Niel
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  #1252989 7-Mar-2015 20:38
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http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201264098209?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&var=500461622043&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
I would go for these and remove the dimmer.  As Richims said, the dimmable ones have a rubbish step-down current limiter, which can result in flickering when dimmed.  This listing is for one with a universal switch mode power supply.  I'm planning on buying 3 of these (8W model) for my pendant lights, the only ones I've got in the house that are not yet LEDs.




You can never have enough Volvos!




richms
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  #1252991 7-Mar-2015 20:40
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Not just when dimmed for the ones that I have bought which have no large white base on them. flicker at full power too. Horrible.




Richard rich.ms

Fred99

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  #1253096 8-Mar-2015 00:40
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I don't want to remove the dimmer - and they are main lighting (2x ceiling pendants).
It's on a lighting circuit, so adding a resistive load isn't as simple as plugging something else in.  A 5k ohm resistor would draw the 10w required to keep the dimmer happy, but there's nowhere to put it (probably want to go for a 20w wire wound to be safe, but that's still too much heat in the confines of a flush box or under a ceiling rose - apart from the legality of such a DIY approach).
I don't see any flicker at all with the 4w filament type LED globe, either in an undimmed circuit, or dimmed when run in parallel with a halogen or incandescent in the other fitting -it seems to work perfectly.  Not sure about the "current limiting" setup on these globes - I'll look at the youtube teardown later.  Perhaps it's not current limiting at all, just rectified, voltage regulated (ETA - no - just dropped by resistance or it probably wouldn't dim at all - also it's marked 220-240v), and the capacitor is there for smoothing. It all packs inside the ES base - so there's not a lot in there.


richms
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  #1253100 8-Mar-2015 01:02
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Point your cellphone camera right up to it and see if you get banding in the picture. If you do, then it has flicker.




Richard rich.ms

 
 
 

Move to New Zealand's best fibre broadband service (affiliate link). Free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE. Note that to use Quic Broadband you must be comfortable with configuring your own router.
Niel
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  #1253118 8-Mar-2015 07:16
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Ah, a Philips bulb so probably no flicker as that would cause an EMC failure.

I'd search for a better dimmer then that can handle a no-load situation.  Or add a 3rd light (even inside the ceiling if you don't want it in the living space).




You can never have enough Volvos!


Fred99

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  #1253498 8-Mar-2015 18:24
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Unfortunately, those philips bulbs are ugly.
There is no flicker of those "filament" LEDs either on the dimmer or full power (yes- I tried with cellphone cam).
Where is a dimmer which can handle a no (resistive) load situation?

MadEngineer
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  #1253625 8-Mar-2015 22:37
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Fred99: Unfortunately, those philips bulbs are ugly.
based on that light fitting, somehow I don't think that's going to be an issue :p




You're not on Atlantis anymore, Duncan Idaho.

Fred99

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  #1253677 9-Mar-2015 08:45
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MadEngineer:
Fred99: Unfortunately, those philips bulbs are ugly.
based on that light fitting, somehow I don't think that's going to be an issue :p


Careful - or I'll set SWMBO on you.
I suggested "downlights" at one stage - a very cheap, practical, and easy option that was never going to happen, and never to be mentioned again.

richms
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  #1253941 9-Mar-2015 12:46
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Well at least paint those things. the bare wood makes it look like a high school woodworking project.




Richard rich.ms

Fred99

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  #1253985 9-Mar-2015 13:20
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richms: Well at least paint those things. the bare wood makes it look like a high school woodworking project.


Tell them.

richms
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  #1253992 9-Mar-2015 13:27
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Ah the New Zealand self congratulatory bulls..t design awards people.

No thanks.




Richard rich.ms

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