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289 posts

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Topic # 185487 24-Nov-2015 22:20
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So i've just (about) finished a whole reno and did all the stopping, taping and jointing myself. The house is looking mint and it's fun doing one room but not every room ! If I was patching in an old socket or cut out, I'd backstrap the hole, cut and screw a piece of gib to fit and then skim over it - for larger holes / repairs I'd tape the joins as well. All is good with the repairs and on the odd occassion, if I sanded back a little too much and some tape appeared I'd just reskim a little more plus 4 ontop and sand the next day.

I've noticed that the new layer of plus 4 seems to sand at a different rate from the previously sanded layer - the top or last layer applied is harder and it then becomes difficult to blend edges etc for an almost invisible finish.

The only way around this is to either prime the repair ( which seems to create a new uniform surface) , reskim the dips, then it sands fine, or reskim over the whole repair, ensuring all previous plus 4 is covered, and then gently sand the 2nd topcoat back to level, ensuring the bottom coat of plus 4 isn't reached or you'll get an edge.

I do mix some water in with the plus4 (says you can add some) to increase it's workability...Could that be setting the compound differently or could it be previous dust on the surface from sanding efforts affecting the hardness.

Difficuly to describe but definitely happening. Thinking it must be me so keen to find out what I'm doing

Thanks for any advice



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Stu

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  Reply # 1434227 24-Nov-2015 23:42
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Could the Plus 4 binding with the fluffed up/sanded tape give the result you're seeing?




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  Reply # 1434230 24-Nov-2015 23:51
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Hi.. No its quite distinct. I used the tape as an example as to why I may need to reapply. It's also the same if I fill in a little nick or depression.  Essentially if I apply plus 4 to a previsouly sanded area or patch a small part of it...When I go to sand the next day the last coat applied sands back a lot more slowly than the original coat underneath which leads to either edges or dents in the plus 4.

I'm probably going to have to try a couple of coats without water and see if they sand uniformally then start to mix it thinner

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1434231 25-Nov-2015 00:04
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IMO you're better using a setting-type plaster like tradeset for any shallow (but deeper than a couple of mm or so) filling/stopping, sand back, then plus 4 or promix for a light skim over the top.  A second "mud" coat (air drying) like plus 4 etc, softens the coat underneath and you're back to square one with drying.  A setting plaster stays hard once it's set.  I know "they say" plus 4 is kind of dual purpose and use it as such, but the pros do a whole house one coat at a time - so there's drying time between coats.

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  Reply # 1434269 25-Nov-2015 05:18
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I had nothing but problems with plus 4 and ending up with diviots.

If it's still damp it is rubbery and will ball up and clog the sandpaper. If I tried hairdryering it to make it dry then it would often come off as a sheet from what it was over, even if that was really roughed up so it should have keyed on.

The powder ones would set fine and then a hair dryer got them dry enough to sand quickly without issue.




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  Reply # 1434930 26-Nov-2015 07:57
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Fred99: IMO you're better using a setting-type plaster like tradeset for any shallow (but deeper than a couple of mm or so) filling/stopping, sand back, then plus 4 or promix for a light skim over the top.  A second "mud" coat (air drying) like plus 4 etc, softens the coat underneath and you're back to square one with drying.  A setting plaster stays hard once it's set.  I know "they say" plus 4 is kind of dual purpose and use it as such, but the pros do a whole house one coat at a time - so there's drying time between coats.


I agree. tradeset is better because you dont have to worry about it getting air to set - so you know eventually it will set and set hard - just avoid needing to sand it.  I don't agree with the literature that says plus4 is suitable for basecoat and second coat. Your more likely in my opinion to end up with cracks in your stopping at a later date if the house moves when plus4 has been used for all coats.  Plus 4's advantages are it sands well and when watered down can be particularly smooth when skimming making it great for the end coat.  It does take a long time to dry.


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