Choosing a suitable Flush Box (and potentially socket/switches)

Forums › Home Workshop DIY › Choosing a suitable Flush Box (and potentially socket/switches)

moschops

29 posts

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#286009 30-May-2021 17:29

I am shopping for some flush boxes (and ultimately sockets & switches) however not sure what to buy.

My rooms have been taken back to the framing and I am going to run new electrical wires and fit the flush boxes so my electrician friend can inspect and connect up and hopefully sign off.

I have been to Bunnings and I only find what appear to be single gang flush boxes so not sure where to start looking and for what so hoping to get some advice here.

Some things that may help with any advice:

- I want to fit double sockets at all outlet points.

- Are there options to have sound insulated boxes or should I be keeping anything in mind when fitting the boxes to my studs? If there are acoustic options are they any good or worth what I assume will be additional cost? I am near the airport and a noisy road so making an effort to do what I can to reduce the noise by installing sound dampening batts, double layers of 13mm GIB and the Rondo wall battens with acoustic clips so would be saddened to later learn my efforts are thwarted by not thinking ahead when installing my power points.

- I haven’t decided with what brand of socket/switches to go for but leaning towards PDL based on recommendations.. although see there are different ranges (i.e. 600 vs Iconic) and not sure if that choice will determine what I need to use for the flush box.

- I will want to run Ethernet cables to a handful of the boxes - do I need to consider the size or will any standard size be suitable?

- Plastic vs metal boxes, plastic vs metal thread - what are the pros/cons or does it not make any difference?

Feels like a lot of questions for what looks like something that appears so simple!

Mehrts

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#2715601 30-May-2021 17:39

Flush boxes will accommodate all single & double outlets, light switches, network wall plates etc the screw holes dimensions are all a set standard. Just go for plastic ones, if they break in the future, they can be easily replaced in-situ.

Metal ones are a pain, plus there's a risk of shorts occurring. (very unlikely though).

Go for metal threads though. Plastic would get chewed out. Any decent plastic flush boxes will have metal threaded inserts.

As for insulation, you should have a small amount of space behind the flush boxes once installed. Silencer batts of some description would be able to be tucked into this space, but honestly I don't know how much difference that'd make.

The only real difference between the switch/outlet models is down to cosmetics. Simply choose whatever you like & fits within your budget.

Daynger

435 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2715673 30-May-2021 18:46

PDL 144MT.

Try not to put anything in the walls that you are soundproofing, you are essentially cutting a hole in all of that work you are putting in, but there is methodology in making it not so bad hole.

If you are running the wiring you electrician friend cannot sign it off, you need an electrical inspector as per ECP51.

If you dont know what ECP51 is, find it and read it BEFORE doing any work.

gregmcc

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#2715676 30-May-2021 18:58

No need for metal flush boxes in a domestic situation, get the plastic ones with the metal threads, the plastic thread ones are only good for 2 or three uses and then the thread strips out.

The wider the back opening in the flush box (where the cables some in to the box) the better as it makes it easier to push the cables in to the wall when screwing back the outlet.

pretty much everything fits on to a standard flush box (there are a few exceptions) but unless you are using something specialized or odd ball a standard sized flush box will work.

As previously said any work you do HAS to be signed off by an inspector, NOT an electrician.

MadEngineer

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#2715677 30-May-2021 18:58

Don’t buy the gear yourself. Get the sparky to supply and install otherwise you’ll be paying retail whereas the sparky will charge you the same if not less while still making a profit and will supply the gear he prefers.

You're not on Atlantis anymore, Duncan Idaho.

chevrolux

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#2715678 30-May-2021 19:01

You are waaaaay overthinking the flush box choice. Literally any flush box will work just fine. You could have six light switches or one light switch in a box.. it won't matter.

The only thing you need to decide is if you mount them vertical, or horizontal. Which is mostly dependant on the product range you choose, but also purely your personal preference.

k1w1k1d

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#2715679 30-May-2021 19:02

Get your electrician friend around to advise what you can and can't do. As advised, he can't sign off what you do, unless he is also an inspector. Many electricians are also inspectors.

He can also advise on suitable parts to purchase and separation etc between house wiring and data cables.

Suggest run rigid pvc pipe to data flush boxes and install a draw wire. Allows you had add or replace cables in the future.

sparkz25

750 posts

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#2715680 30-May-2021 19:03

as @Daynger mentioned PDL 144MT, Whatever you do not nail the damnd things in! you will be cursing it later on in the future if you go to pull the box out.

And again unless your friend is an inspector, then he will not be able to sign it off for you.

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neb

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#2715738 30-May-2021 20:06

What everyone else said, with one change: Get quad outlets, not double. When we redid the Casa we put in quads everywhere except for two locations where there are two quads (so eight outlets in one place), and I should have put in two quads in the living room as well. Also, make sure they're horizontal not vertical so they can take all the wall warts.

andrewNZ

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#2715909 31-May-2021 00:07

Last I checked, quad outlets were very expensive when compared to 2 double outlets.

neb

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#2715911 31-May-2021 00:11

andrewNZ: Last I checked, quad outlets were very expensive when compared to 2 double outlets.

Sure, but then installing and wiring up twice as many flush boxes isn't free either... the quads cost quite a bit, but I haven't regretted any of it, virtually all of them are full or close to it, and I'm thinking of swapping the dual in the living room (currently dual+quad) to another quad to get rid of the power strip there.

Scott3

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#2715917 31-May-2021 01:07

I think you should reconsider DIYing this.

If keen to continue, probably should talk to an inspector first and find out:

If they can sign off stuff they can't see (I.e. assume you haven't made a messy wire join inside one of your wall pulls.
How much their fee would be vs just having a sparky do the job.

The electrical wholesalers (ideal electrical etc) will have a much better range of this stuff than miter 10 etc. basically need to use them. As per "Mad engineer", while they will sell to you as a walk in customer, you will be paying a lot. Nothing has prices on it, and sparkiest normally get a discount along the lines of trade less 60%... As a walk in, the discount you get is pritty random. Got trade less 30% last time, but have paid the inflated full price before, and have had trade less 50%...

Potentially could do a bill of materials, and get each of the three wholesales quote you on it to get a decent price for a whole house lot... Not sure if they would do this for an individual.

Re quad boxes, they are great for retrofit's (have two in my house), but it is generally accepted that two double GPO's next to each other is a cheaper solution for a new build with a sparky already on site. Also note that the quads often stick a lot more out from the wall than the doubles.

If you have area's where acoustics are a really big concern you could ditch flush boxes, and go for a surface mount with a wire sticking through a little hole.

No mixing power & data on the same face-plates - wires should run away from each other too. 4x cat6 + 1x coax into the same faceplate was a real pain to get to work (and I had to skip over the drip loop you are ment to have). Perhaps limit yourself to 4 data terminations per face plate (and put more face-plates if needed) for ease.

Consider if you really want double GPO's everwhere. Do you really need two outlets for your fridge, expel air, hallway vaccume ports etc. Also there is some thought that for high draw locations (like laundry), you are best to run two single face-plates, rather than a dual. I'm not a sparky, but understand that the dual ones are only rated for a 10A load?)

Arsonist

31 posts

Geek

#2715930 31-May-2021 08:07

140F is the product code for a PDL Accoustic (and fire) rated flushbox.