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Rikkitic

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#289084 11-Aug-2021 13:36
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Are there any plumbers here? I am having issues with a low pressure mixing tap on an open vent system. This is an old farmhouse at a remote location and I would like to gather as much information as possible before deciding to call a plumber.

 

The hot water cylinder is connected to a wetback. There is no tempering valve as an exemption was granted due to low gravity pressure. When trying to heat the room in cold weather, a too hot fire sometimes causes the cylinder to boil and overflow. When this happened recently, I opened the kitchen tap hot water to let steam out and relieve pressure. The caused something in the tap to jam from heat expansion, and only cold water would flow regardless of tap position. In the morning, after everything had cooled, the tap worked normally again.

 

Unfortunately, the problem occurred a second time, in spite of me being careful not to run the tap. This time, the tap simply stopped flowing in the hot water position. After again letting it cool overnight, I was able to get a reduced flow by turning it off and on. Both hot and cold are working, but the flow rate is about half what it was before and that doesn't seem to be improving. 

 

Can anyone explain what is happening here? I assume a component in the tap has been distorted by heat expansion and is causing the issue. Is this something that could be repaired? Can the tap be disassembled? Money is an issue, which is why I am asking this. Thanks for any assistance.

 

 





Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

 


 


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wellygary
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  #2758603 11-Aug-2021 13:59
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Until you take the tap apart you won't know if its fixable or not.... 

 

But the setup sounds rather ominous...  Is there a regular hotwater cylinder? 

 

if there is this should probably be vented to allow for the possibility of steam entry from the wetback...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Rikkitic

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  #2758606 11-Aug-2021 14:06
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Yes there is a regular hot water cylinder and it is vented. The problem is with the tap. 

 

 





Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

 


 


wellygary
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  #2758608 11-Aug-2021 14:08
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Rikkitic:

 

Yes there is a regular hot water cylinder and it is vented. The problem is with the tap. 

 

 

So why is it venting steam out the tap?? it should be escaping via the vent from the cylinder


Ge0rge
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  #2758609 11-Aug-2021 14:09
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I do wonder if the rubber washer is swelling due to the heat?  I know that the hot water at my place can reach 75 degrees C at the tap when the fire has been chugging away for a few hours - when that happens one of the mixers feels a little "sticky" when you run the hot tap for longer than a few seconds - but it comes right when you switch it over to cold for a bit.


Rikkitic

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  #2758654 11-Aug-2021 16:02
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wellygary:

 

Rikkitic:

 

Yes there is a regular hot water cylinder and it is vented. The problem is with the tap. 

 

 

So why is it venting steam out the tap?? it should be escaping via the vent from the cylinder

 

 

Sorry lack of clarity. It vents steam from the tap when the tap is opened. The water is at boiling temperature. Because I held the tap open to release pressure, the high temperature appears to have damaged or affected it in some way. This is what I am trying to fix.

 

 





Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

 


 


Rikkitic

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  #2758655 11-Aug-2021 16:05
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Ge0rge:

 

I do wonder if the rubber washer is swelling due to the heat?  I know that the hot water at my place can reach 75 degrees C at the tap when the fire has been chugging away for a few hours - when that happens one of the mixers feels a little "sticky" when you run the hot tap for longer than a few seconds - but it comes right when you switch it over to cold for a bit.

 

 

That is a good description of what I have, except it is worse. I'm sure some component, rubber washer or whatever, has become deformed by the excess heat but has not returned to its original shape and/or size. This is now causing a partial blockage. Can these taps be disassembled?

 

 





Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

 


 


wellygary
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  #2758667 11-Aug-2021 16:15
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Rikkitic:

 

Ge0rge:

 

I do wonder if the rubber washer is swelling due to the heat?  I know that the hot water at my place can reach 75 degrees C at the tap when the fire has been chugging away for a few hours - when that happens one of the mixers feels a little "sticky" when you run the hot tap for longer than a few seconds - but it comes right when you switch it over to cold for a bit.

 

 

That is a good description of what I have, except it is worse. I'm sure some component, rubber washer or whatever, has become deformed by the excess heat but has not returned to its original shape and/or size. This is now causing a partial blockage. Can these taps be disassembled?

 

 

Most taps can be dissembled, at least partially, usually the chromed section will screw off exposing the actual brass tap mechanism

 

pictures would probably be helpful to identify the correct method of dis-assembly .. ( you'll have to turn of the cold system when you do this otherwise there will likely be water everywhere... 


Bung
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  #2758712 11-Aug-2021 18:01
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Rikkitic:

Yes there is a regular hot water cylinder and it is vented. The problem is with the tap. 


 



Not a plumber but think you should look into what happens when you get airlocks in hot supply. In some cases you can clear them by forcing cold back up the hot. Easier to do if you have a mixer that can have its spout blocked. I don't think you have anything in the tap deforming.

andrewNZ
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  #2758719 11-Aug-2021 18:40
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Not a fix, but we have a similar situation. Our setup is mid 80's and we have a wetback direct into the cylinder and no tempering valve.
In the winter we often turn off our cylinder element.

We have boiled the cylinder several times before we started turning it off and ruined several mixer inserts. One mixer was the shower and we didn't find that until it had done a lot of gradual damage...

mclean
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  #2758939 12-Aug-2021 10:23
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Most commercially available mixers are limited to something like 80 degC water temperature, presumably because at higher temperatures something will fail. Assuming that's the case, then I don't know why you'd want to try to fix it, unless you think you can up-spec the replacement components.

 

If you want to stick with mixers then you should be able to find a tempering valve that'll work, unless your pressure is VERY low. Be careful of the maximum temperature when selecting this as well - the ones designed for solar systems can usually handle up to 100 degC on the hot side.


outdoorsnz
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  #2758972 12-Aug-2021 11:17
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I had a leaking hot water kitchen tap and to stop the water pump going on and off, I had to put a cold water washer in (black rubber) as that was all I had on hand. The hot water washer is red and different compound.

 

The up shot of that was the washer would swell and reduce the flow...


gzt

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  #2759433 12-Aug-2021 22:25
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Turning off the element in winter is a good idea if not already.

gzt

gzt
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  #2759436 12-Aug-2021 22:36
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I have seen this in different places. It's a dangerous if not insane situation. I'm sure you realise that and are incredibly careful with guests around etc.

Surely there is a better technical solution? Adding a 12v battery backed pump to increase cold pressure and then you can have a tempering valve. Battery backed means you're good in a power cut for a week or so.

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