Global mode over ? Lets see.....

Forums › Online streaming services › Global mode over ? Lets see.....

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636 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1288659 21-Apr-2015 16:35

I hereby start the "we watch any content we want to watch no matter what country you are in religion/Jedi".

Anyone want to join?

Rikkitic

Awrrr
18665 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#1288661 21-Apr-2015 16:38

I'm in as long as there is agreement to pay (a reasonable amount) for the content if requested and a way to do so is available.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

SepticSceptic

2194 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1288676 21-Apr-2015 16:44

NonprayingMantis:
Don't Countdown have the right to choose what they sell, to whom they sell, and for how much?
If so, why is content any different?

Because Countdown aren't a monopoly, duopoly for food, or other things. I can get my lettuce from a myriad of different suppliers.
I can get unique grocery products from any number of alternative suppliers. I can get USA manufactured Peanut Butter. I can get Oz Peanut Butter. I can get Chinese Peanut Butter

Can't do that for unique content.

dclegg

2806 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1288678 21-Apr-2015 16:48

Rikkitic: I'm in as long as there is agreement to pay (a reasonable amount) for the content if requested and a way to do so is available.

I was pondering this today. I'd actually be OK with paying more for a Netflix subscription if it meant they could offer more of their catalog to us Kiwis. The same logic applies to Lightbox, FWIW*. $30 per month does not seem unreasonable to me if it meant they'd be able to offer more content, due to having geographical restrictions removed.

In theory, if SVOD providers charged their users higher fees, they should be able to pass that onto the content creators in return for less geo-restrictions on the content they sell. The problem in practice though is the existing contracts, which would've been negotiated and signed assuming exclusivity in the broadcasters region. So until these expire, I'm not sure this can be achieved. And as it currently stands, it sure seems like the content creators think they can make more money by continuing down this path, so I have no faith that we'll be seeing an end to them any time soon.

Another problem with this is that the increase in cost would have to be borne by all the SVOD service's customers. I can imagine how US Netflix customers would react to a hefty increase in their monthly fee for only a relatively small increase in content.

*NEON not so much. It's already overpriced considering it's only SD. I also expect it to have a higher priced tier once they get HD working, based on Sky's previous track record.

DeepBlueSky

547 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1288685 21-Apr-2015 17:14

I have been reading with interest the comments through this thread; I can understand both sides here wanting to debate the virtues of banning or not geo blocking. What I do believe is that this needs to be debated in court what I'm concerned about is that it won't help either side here.

If geo blocking is blocked this will just shift how people watch overseas content to:
1. Using overseas GEO DNS providers, if they are blocked
2. People going back to just downloading content and no one gets paid especially not the content providers, this has historically proved impossible to stop which is not good for anyone in the long run if content providers don't get paid there will be no content.

If geo blocking is not stopped content distributers will be doing it tough, number one is Sky but also the TVNZ / Media Works etc. Maybe a return to the UK style Licence fee would guarantee the production of local content, that the distributers can show.

I think the whole argument needs to be carefully managed, the NZ content distributors should ask the their suppliers why the they have to pay more for the rights to programming and why they need to wait if a program. If this can be improved it should help for a time.

Bottom line is the world is changing and the ways people watch or listen to content is changing, trying to block this will make the lawyers happy they will get paid but won't help the content distributers who will have to pay the lawyers. Its like looking back to the days of Video Stores how powerful they were now they are close to becoming a footnote in history, TV / Radio stations are moving in that direction now hence they are putting up a futile defence. These guys need to innovate think outside the square to survive put their money into research and development not pay lawyers.

sultanoswing

814 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1288694 21-Apr-2015 17:31

@ NPM - those are the *current* statutory requirements on discrimination, but in the same way as the monopoly corporates can lobby for their ends, so to can we the people lobby loudly and frquency for ours. So, say "no" to geoblocks and monopolies - make discrimination on the basis of location and nationality illegal. It appears as though most people commenting on here are with this sentiment. Could be the start of a movement... :)

gjen

75 posts

Master Geek

#1288958 22-Apr-2015 09:45

HBO Now users outside US to be 'cut off

Pay TV service HBO is threatening to cut off paying customers of its Now service if they are outside the US.

It has sent emails to people around the world it has detected are using software tools to watch HBO Now shows.

HBO said it took the action because it only has the right to broadcast shows in the US and to people living in the country.

Email messages were sent to people in Canada, the UK, Germany and Australia,reported tech news site Torrent Freak.

HBO Now was introduced as a way for people to watch HBO's programmes without the need to have a subscription to a television or cable service. HBO Now costs $14.99 (£9.50) a month.

However, many people living in other nations have subscribed to HBO Now and used a variety of tools, including virtual private networks (VPNs), to get around the restrictions designed to stop people outside the US seeing popular shows such as Game of Thrones.

In some countries, the cost of an HBO Now subscription was far lower than the price of buying a service from a native cable TV provider. The Sydney Morning Herald pointed out that watching HD versions of Game of Thrones in Australia via means other than HBO Now would cost more than 660 Australian dollars (£342).

Earlier this week, HBO started sending emails to many people who use region-unlocking tricks and tools. The messages warned them that they would be cut off on 21 April if they did not contact HBO and satisfy it that they were eligible to watch the service.

Those who did not contact HBO would be cut off without further notice, said the company.

Earlier this year, Netflix started to take action against some VPN users and changed how its Android app worked in a bid to thwart some of those using software tools to defeat region locks.

Netflix boss Reed Hastings said earlier this week that VPN users were "less bad" than pirates because they were at least paying for the service. His comments came during press interviews discussing the company's financial results.

Sharesies

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

shk292

2858 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#1288989 22-Apr-2015 09:58

sultanoswing: @ NPM - those are the *current* statutory requirements on discrimination, but in the same way as the monopoly corporates can lobby for their ends, so to can we the people lobby loudly and frquency for ours. So, say "no" to geoblocks and monopolies - make discrimination on the basis of location and nationality illegal. It appears as though most people commenting on here are with this sentiment. Could be the start of a movement... :)

How about a law change to make exclusive distribution contracts illegal in NZ? This would kill the 'demand' for geo-blocking, because it's the broadcasters who are stupid enough to think geographic exclusivity is a thing these days, who are losing revenue and making a fuss. If every distribution agreement was negotiated on the basis that it would be monetised in competition with any number of other distributors, then less would be paid for distribution rights. Distributors would have to compete on quality of service, price, supported devices etc etc, leading to a truly competitive market for consumers.
This could apply to hardware and digital products; in fact it already applies at least to hardware and would also make the 'All-Blacks jersey' case an anachronism

MileHighKiwi

782 posts

Ultimate Geek

ID Verified

Lifetime subscriber

#1289003 22-Apr-2015 10:13

gjen: HBO Now users outside US to be 'cut off Pay TV service HBO is threatening to cut off paying customers of its Now service if they are outside the US. It has sent emails to people around the world it has detected are using software tools to watch HBO Now shows. HBO said it took the action because it only has the right to broadcast shows in the US and to people living in the country. Email messages were sent to people in Canada, the UK, Germany and Australia,reported tech news site Torrent Freak. HBO Now was introduced as a way for people to watch HBO's programmes without the need to have a subscription to a television or cable service. HBO Now costs $14.99 (£9.50) a month. However, many people living in other nations have subscribed to HBO Now and used a variety of tools, including virtual private networks (VPNs), to get around the restrictions designed to stop people outside the US seeing popular shows such as Game of Thrones. In some countries, the cost of an HBO Now subscription was far lower than the price of buying a service from a native cable TV provider. The Sydney Morning Herald pointed out that watching HD versions of Game of Thrones in Australia via means other than HBO Now would cost more than 660 Australian dollars (£342). Earlier this week, HBO started sending emails to many people who use region-unlocking tricks and tools. The messages warned them that they would be cut off on 21 April if they did not contact HBO and satisfy it that they were eligible to watch the service. Those who did not contact HBO would be cut off without further notice, said the company. Earlier this year, Netflix started to take action against some VPN users and changed how its Android app worked in a bid to thwart some of those using software tools to defeat region locks. Netflix boss Reed Hastings said earlier this week that VPN users were "less bad" than pirates because they were at least paying for the service. His comments came during press interviews discussing the company's financial results.

Interesting. So the people who are 'illegally' accessing HBO Now via VPN and DNS will illegally torrent instead.

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1289006 22-Apr-2015 10:19

MileHighKiwi:
gjen: HBO Now users outside US to be 'cut off Pay TV service HBO is threatening to cut off paying customers of its Now service if they are outside the US. It has sent emails to people around the world it has detected are using software tools to watch HBO Now shows. HBO said it took the action because it only has the right to broadcast shows in the US and to people living in the country. Email messages were sent to people in Canada, the UK, Germany and Australia,reported tech news site Torrent Freak. HBO Now was introduced as a way for people to watch HBO's programmes without the need to have a subscription to a television or cable service. HBO Now costs $14.99 (£9.50) a month. However, many people living in other nations have subscribed to HBO Now and used a variety of tools, including virtual private networks (VPNs), to get around the restrictions designed to stop people outside the US seeing popular shows such as Game of Thrones. In some countries, the cost of an HBO Now subscription was far lower than the price of buying a service from a native cable TV provider. The Sydney Morning Herald pointed out that watching HD versions of Game of Thrones in Australia via means other than HBO Now would cost more than 660 Australian dollars (£342). Earlier this week, HBO started sending emails to many people who use region-unlocking tricks and tools. The messages warned them that they would be cut off on 21 April if they did not contact HBO and satisfy it that they were eligible to watch the service. Those who did not contact HBO would be cut off without further notice, said the company. Earlier this year, Netflix started to take action against some VPN users and changed how its Android app worked in a bid to thwart some of those using software tools to defeat region locks. Netflix boss Reed Hastings said earlier this week that VPN users were "less bad" than pirates because they were at least paying for the service. His comments came during press interviews discussing the company's financial results.

Interesting. So the people who are 'illegally' accessing HBO Now via VPN and DNS will illegally torrent instead.

Maybe, or maybe they will subscribe to Neon or Sky. Neon is actually the same price as HBO Now, with the only downside right now being no HD (and yes, that is annoying, but really it's not that big a deal - especially not to the millions who torrented the less-than-SD versions leaked ahead of time)

The point is, Sky has paid HBO $$$$ for the exclusive rights to show HBO. if HBO don't crack down on illegitimate users, then sky can probably sue them. At the very least when the rights come up for negotiation next time they will be worth considerably less. So on one hand they might lose revenue from a few hundred kiwis prepared to jump hoops to subscribe to HBO Now, but it will allow them to keep charging millions to Sky, then it's worth it.

All in all, pretty interesting considering only a year or two ago, the HBO CEO said that piracy was good for them.

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/time-warner-ceo-people-pirating-game-of-thrones-is-better-than-an-emmy-for-hbo-2013-8

seems they have changed their tune what with the threats to HBO Now subscribers overseas, the crackdown on 'viewing parties' in bars, and sending letters to those who torrented the leaked episodes

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1289016 22-Apr-2015 10:26

shk292:
sultanoswing: @ NPM - those are the *current* statutory requirements on discrimination, but in the same way as the monopoly corporates can lobby for their ends, so to can we the people lobby loudly and frquency for ours. So, say "no" to geoblocks and monopolies - make discrimination on the basis of location and nationality illegal. It appears as though most people commenting on here are with this sentiment. Could be the start of a movement... :)

How about a law change to make exclusive distribution contracts illegal in NZ? This would kill the 'demand' for geo-blocking, because it's the broadcasters who are stupid enough to think geographic exclusivity is a thing these days, who are losing revenue and making a fuss. If every distribution agreement was negotiated on the basis that it would be monetised in competition with any number of other distributors, then less would be paid for distribution rights. Distributors would have to compete on quality of service, price, supported devices etc etc, leading to a truly competitive market for consumers.
This could apply to hardware and digital products; in fact it already applies at least to hardware and would also make the 'All-Blacks jersey' case an anachronism

from a practical point of view, how would you enforce this?

How would an NZ court enforce HBO (based in America) and stop them from refusing to sell to a second party.

If HBO sells content rights to Sky, can HBO be forced by NZ to sell to somebody else in NZ (e.g. Lightbox)? At what price? What if Lightbox doesn't want to pay that price? Must HBO keep lowering their price until they get another buyer in order to avoid being 'exclusive'?

dclegg

2806 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#1289017 22-Apr-2015 10:28

NonprayingMantis:
Maybe, or maybe they will subscribe to Neon or Sky. Neon is actually the same price as HBO Now, with the only downside right now being no HD (and yes, that is annoying, but really it's not that big a deal - especially not to the millions who torrented the less-than-SD versions leaked ahead of time)

What about watching (and paying for) the content that's on HBO Now that isn't on Neon?

NonprayingMantis

6434 posts

Uber Geek

#1289024 22-Apr-2015 10:37

dclegg:
NonprayingMantis:
Maybe, or maybe they will subscribe to Neon or Sky. Neon is actually the same price as HBO Now, with the only downside right now being no HD (and yes, that is annoying, but really it's not that big a deal - especially not to the millions who torrented the less-than-SD versions leaked ahead of time)

What about watching (and paying for) the content that's on HBO Now that isn't on Neon?

yep, there is some stuff I'm sure. But let's be honest, the main reason for these people to subscribe to HBO Now is Game of Thrones.

shk292

2858 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#1289032 22-Apr-2015 10:45

NonprayingMantis:
shk292:
sultanoswing: @ NPM - those are the *current* statutory requirements on discrimination, but in the same way as the monopoly corporates can lobby for their ends, so to can we the people lobby loudly and frquency for ours. So, say "no" to geoblocks and monopolies - make discrimination on the basis of location and nationality illegal. It appears as though most people commenting on here are with this sentiment. Could be the start of a movement... :)

How about a law change to make exclusive distribution contracts illegal in NZ? This would kill the 'demand' for geo-blocking, because it's the broadcasters who are stupid enough to think geographic exclusivity is a thing these days, who are losing revenue and making a fuss. If every distribution agreement was negotiated on the basis that it would be monetised in competition with any number of other distributors, then less would be paid for distribution rights. Distributors would have to compete on quality of service, price, supported devices etc etc, leading to a truly competitive market for consumers.
This could apply to hardware and digital products; in fact it already applies at least to hardware and would also make the 'All-Blacks jersey' case an anachronism

from a practical point of view, how would you enforce this?

How would an NZ court enforce HBO (based in America) and stop them from refusing to sell to a second party.

If HBO sells content rights to Sky, can HBO be forced by NZ to sell to somebody else in NZ (e.g. Lightbox)? At what price? What if Lightbox doesn't want to pay that price? Must HBO keep lowering their price until they get another buyer in order to avoid being 'exclusive'?

I was more thinking from the distributor's viewpoint, that even if they entered into an 'exclusive' contract, this would have no standing in NZ, so they have no comeback against anyone else distributing the same material. This makes the exclusivity worthless, thereby killing the demand. No-one would be forcing anyone to sell anything, but conversely, nobody would have the right to enforce a monopoly in NZ. The argument "HBO can't let you access HBO Now in NZ because we don't have rights to broadcast in NZ" becomes null and void, because exclusive rights don't exist in NZ. Ditto for Sky's argument that globalmode is devaluing their exclusive rights.

So, I'm not saying that a content owner would be forced to sell to more than one distributor, rather that any sale of rights to material would be done with the knowledge that any number of other distributors would also be able to buy. Owners may make the decision to sell to only one NZ-based distributor, but this would still not give that distributor exclusive rights to broadcast content in NZ

sultanoswing

814 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1289034 22-Apr-2015 10:49

NonprayingMantis:
shk292:
sultanoswing: @ NPM - those are the *current* statutory requirements on discrimination, but in the same way as the monopoly corporates can lobby for their ends, so to can we the people lobby loudly and frquency for ours. So, say "no" to geoblocks and monopolies - make discrimination on the basis of location and nationality illegal. It appears as though most people commenting on here are with this sentiment. Could be the start of a movement... :)

How about a law change to make exclusive distribution contracts illegal in NZ? This would kill the 'demand' for geo-blocking, because it's the broadcasters who are stupid enough to think geographic exclusivity is a thing these days, who are losing revenue and making a fuss. If every distribution agreement was negotiated on the basis that it would be monetised in competition with any number of other distributors, then less would be paid for distribution rights. Distributors would have to compete on quality of service, price, supported devices etc etc, leading to a truly competitive market for consumers.
This could apply to hardware and digital products; in fact it already applies at least to hardware and would also make the 'All-Blacks jersey' case an anachronism

from a practical point of view, how would you enforce this?

How would an NZ court enforce HBO (based in America) and stop them from refusing to sell to a second party.

If HBO sells content rights to Sky, can HBO be forced by NZ to sell to somebody else in NZ (e.g. Lightbox)? At what price? What if Lightbox doesn't want to pay that price? Must HBO keep lowering their price until they get another buyer in order to avoid being 'exclusive'?

Practically, the law can specifiy that NZ consumers have the right to use a VPN or DNS service (including those such as Globalmode) for any purpose (except for the usual caveats such as terrorism, objectionable material etc). Probelm solved legally and practically. Now, that still doesn't get around external companies' T & C's, but NZ doesn't have jursidiction over them anyway. What it does do however, is very practically put to bed any local litigation aimed at enforcing monopolistic anachronistic price protectionism.

You wouldn't then need to enforce much, just need to ensure that NZ companies were'nt behaving objectionably by blocking or undermining consumer rights in this area. In this regard, you'd hear pretty loudly from consumers themselves if there were problems.

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