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Coil
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  #2156823 9-Jan-2019 10:14
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MikeB4:

 

One thing that I have always thought was crazy and please correct me if I am wrong. My understanding is a new driver has no restriction on the power of a car they can own or drive, e.g get their licence today and go and by an Audi R8, that is insane. We recognise the problem when it comes to motorcycles but not with cars.

 

 

You are correct, One of my first cars was a 340HP/660NM Audi S4. Before that was a BMW E30 325 which was not fast but enough to get you into trouble.
I did spend most of my childhood driving cars on farms and other vehicles and my father always had high powered cars. I was no stranger to power and how to handle it and the dangers around it. Compare this to some friends of mine who learnt to drive at 16 rather than 6, its a different world. Most of them have wrapped at least one powerful car. But that's due to their own doing and coming into grief rather than the car just lurching forward on you in traffic.

It is different to motorcycles I feel, all powerful cars made today can be driven by a Nana around town without even knowing it could go from 0-60 in 3 seconds. It is all down to self control and driver training. It does not take an idiot to realize you do not press the throttle wide open on a RS6 in a 50 kph area with cars in front of you. Modern cars are a no brainer and if you cannot drive a fast one then you shouldn't be on the road.

Old power cars are generally bought by a discerning buyer who knows what they are getting into, they are also more likely to be the ones pushing their limits. Then again, you can push limits of a non powerful car and end up in more grief as they are generally much worse at handling. Its all down to being human. 

 

At the end of the day, you can't go as wrong as you can on a bike. Humans will be human, Limes will be ridden on the footpath at 30KPH, people will whinge about rural broadband, people won't merge like a zip or speed up on an onramp, the world keeps turning.




tdgeek
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  #2156863 9-Jan-2019 10:27
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Yeah, well, I agreed with Mike and I also agree with you!

 

NZ allows it, penalties are low or non existent, its a fairly free rein to drive like an idiot here.

 

You started driving at 6 on the farm?  11 for me on ours. Tractors, tractors with sleds (spraying), LandCruiser ute. Hills, clay tracks, those were the days!


Coil
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  #2156869 9-Jan-2019 10:31
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tdgeek:

 

Yeah, well, I agreed with Mike and I also agree with you!

 

NZ allows it, penalties are low or non existent, its a fairly free rein to drive like an idiot here.

 

You started driving at 6 on the farm?  11 for me on ours. Tractors, tractors with sleds (spraying), LandCruiser ute. Hills, clay tracks, those were the days!

 

 

Yep, First time driving was at 6 on my dads lap. Every day after school id grab the mail, sit on his lap and drive from the mailbox to the garage. Never damaged any car of his either! He did the brake and throttle until I was around 8. From 6 I had my own quad bike, ride on converted to a go kart, 80CC honda CRF that I could operate by myself. Got a Honda accord at 8 or 9 to boost around in and that was the first time I drove on a public road but limited to between farms. Around 12-13 my mate and I got a Nissan cefiro and that was RWD. 

It is fully free reign to drive like an idiot, doesn't matter what you drive, you can do it. 




MikeB4
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  #2156873 9-Jan-2019 10:44
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My Dads attitude was you can drive, get your licence and a car when ....

 

1. You can afford it.

 

2. You can fix it.

 

3. You are taught by a professional.

 

4. You can drive it not just aim it.

 

5. You have common sense. ( not sure I fullfilled that requirement ever)


frankv
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  #2156970 9-Jan-2019 12:45
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Coil:

 

tdgeek:

 

Yeah, well, I agreed with Mike and I also agree with you!

 

NZ allows it, penalties are low or non existent, its a fairly free rein to drive like an idiot here.

 

You started driving at 6 on the farm?  11 for me on ours. Tractors, tractors with sleds (spraying), LandCruiser ute. Hills, clay tracks, those were the days!

 

 

Yep, First time driving was at 6 on my dads lap. Every day after school id grab the mail, sit on his lap and drive from the mailbox to the garage. Never damaged any car of his either! He did the brake and throttle until I was around 8. From 6 I had my own quad bike, ride on converted to a go kart, 80CC honda CRF that I could operate by myself. Got a Honda accord at 8 or 9 to boost around in and that was the first time I drove on a public road but limited to between farms. Around 12-13 my mate and I got a Nissan cefiro and that was RWD. 

It is fully free reign to drive like an idiot, doesn't matter what you drive, you can do it. 

 

 

You realise that what you two are saying you did was illegal. Not to mention unsafe (by today's standards). Many would consider this to be "free reign to drive like an idiot". And pretty idiotic to allow a child to do it.

 

 


Coil
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  #2156978 9-Jan-2019 12:55
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frankv:

 

Coil:

 

tdgeek:

 

Yeah, well, I agreed with Mike and I also agree with you!

 

NZ allows it, penalties are low or non existent, its a fairly free rein to drive like an idiot here.

 

You started driving at 6 on the farm?  11 for me on ours. Tractors, tractors with sleds (spraying), LandCruiser ute. Hills, clay tracks, those were the days!

 

 

Yep, First time driving was at 6 on my dads lap. Every day after school id grab the mail, sit on his lap and drive from the mailbox to the garage. Never damaged any car of his either! He did the brake and throttle until I was around 8. From 6 I had my own quad bike, ride on converted to a go kart, 80CC honda CRF that I could operate by myself. Got a Honda accord at 8 or 9 to boost around in and that was the first time I drove on a public road but limited to between farms. Around 12-13 my mate and I got a Nissan cefiro and that was RWD. 

It is fully free reign to drive like an idiot, doesn't matter what you drive, you can do it. 

 

 

You realise that what you two are saying you did was illegal. Not to mention unsafe (by today's standards). Many would consider this to be "free reign to drive like an idiot". And pretty idiotic to allow a child to do it.

 

 

 

 

Oh - I had no idea in the slightest that it was illegal...
The definition of unsafe is pretty loose mate. Not too sure how you conclude this to be "free reign to drive like an idiot" based on someones age.
We had 3 vehicles written off by back packers, 1 quad bike flipped and backpacker injured, 1 van reversed into a water trough and ruined the subframe. I did a lot more driving than the backpackers we had combined from ages 8-14, must have been pretty safe as I never once hurt myself or anyone else. 


tdgeek
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  #2156980 9-Jan-2019 12:58
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frankv:

 

Coil:

 

tdgeek:

 

Yeah, well, I agreed with Mike and I also agree with you!

 

NZ allows it, penalties are low or non existent, its a fairly free rein to drive like an idiot here.

 

You started driving at 6 on the farm?  11 for me on ours. Tractors, tractors with sleds (spraying), LandCruiser ute. Hills, clay tracks, those were the days!

 

 

Yep, First time driving was at 6 on my dads lap. Every day after school id grab the mail, sit on his lap and drive from the mailbox to the garage. Never damaged any car of his either! He did the brake and throttle until I was around 8. From 6 I had my own quad bike, ride on converted to a go kart, 80CC honda CRF that I could operate by myself. Got a Honda accord at 8 or 9 to boost around in and that was the first time I drove on a public road but limited to between farms. Around 12-13 my mate and I got a Nissan cefiro and that was RWD. 

It is fully free reign to drive like an idiot, doesn't matter what you drive, you can do it. 

 

 

You realise that what you two are saying you did was illegal. Not to mention unsafe (by today's standards). Many would consider this to be "free reign to drive like an idiot". And pretty idiotic to allow a child to do it.

 

 

 

 

Mine was on farmland.


 
 
 

Move to New Zealand's best fibre broadband service (affiliate link). Free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE. Note that to use Quic Broadband you must be comfortable with configuring your own router.
tdgeek
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  #2156988 9-Jan-2019 13:04
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frankv:

 

 

 

You realise that what you two are saying you did was illegal. Not to mention unsafe (by today's standards). Many would consider this to be "free reign to drive like an idiot". And pretty idiotic to allow a child to do it.

 

 

 

 

Having started driving supervised, on non public property at 4 years less than what was then the driving age, I'd call that education. Given what I drove as I neared 15, in the conditions I drove in, gave me an excellent head start to vehicle control. Yet you have other 15 year olds pass a test, go for a 10 minute drive on a paved road, do a 3 point turn, park between two cars (that was my worry :-)  but aced it  ) and let them loose in public. No issue for me


Coil
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  #2156991 9-Jan-2019 13:06
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tdgeek:

 

frankv:

 

Coil:

 

tdgeek:

 

Yeah, well, I agreed with Mike and I also agree with you!

 

NZ allows it, penalties are low or non existent, its a fairly free rein to drive like an idiot here.

 

You started driving at 6 on the farm?  11 for me on ours. Tractors, tractors with sleds (spraying), LandCruiser ute. Hills, clay tracks, those were the days!

 

 

Yep, First time driving was at 6 on my dads lap. Every day after school id grab the mail, sit on his lap and drive from the mailbox to the garage. Never damaged any car of his either! He did the brake and throttle until I was around 8. From 6 I had my own quad bike, ride on converted to a go kart, 80CC honda CRF that I could operate by myself. Got a Honda accord at 8 or 9 to boost around in and that was the first time I drove on a public road but limited to between farms. Around 12-13 my mate and I got a Nissan cefiro and that was RWD. 

It is fully free reign to drive like an idiot, doesn't matter what you drive, you can do it. 

 

 

You realise that what you two are saying you did was illegal. Not to mention unsafe (by today's standards). Many would consider this to be "free reign to drive like an idiot". And pretty idiotic to allow a child to do it.

 

 

 

 

Mine was on farmland.

 

 

Same for all my idiotic driving. Not sure if he is stabbing at us being able to fool around with vehicles from a younger age or if we are deemed fools, idiots, unsafe menaces to society for our parents teaching us how to operate a vehicle and then operating it safely but illegally.

Edit^^
What TDGeek said

 

tdgeek:

 

Having started driving supervised, on non public property at 4 years less than what was then the driving age, I'd call that education. Given what I drove as I neared 15, in the conditions I drove in, gave me an excellent head start to vehicle control. Yet you have other 15 year olds pass a test, go for a 10 minute drive on a paved road, do a 3 point turn, park between two cars (that was my worry :-)  but aced it  ) and let them loose in public. No issue for me

 

 

Is TDGeek for Turbo Diesel Geek????


frankv
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  #2157070 9-Jan-2019 14:40
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Coil:

 

Same for all my idiotic driving. Not sure if he is stabbing at us being able to fool around with vehicles from a younger age or if we are deemed fools, idiots, unsafe menaces to society for our parents teaching us how to operate a vehicle and then operating it safely but illegally.

 

Not particularly stabbing at anyone. And I'm not of the opinion that you're idiots or that your parents were idiots. Just pointing out the irony that what you say makes you superiourly safe drivers is nowadays illegal because it is "dangerous". Not living on a farm, I didn't have the opportunities you did. But I did "drive" a tractor at age 10 or so while my uncle fed out, drove a truck at 17, and a bit of stuff like that. Awaiting a response from the "obeying the law is not an option" and "obeying the law makes you safe" folks in this thread.

 

IIRC it's nowadays illegal to allow children below age 12 on tractors, let alone operate them. I'll bet you didn't wear bicycle helmets on the quad bike either. But there's some research that says that below age 14? or so, children CANNOT process information to make decisions correctly. Which implies that they cannot operate vehicles safely in the absence of an adult making decisions for them.

 

 


tdgeek
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  #2157085 9-Jan-2019 14:56
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frankv:

 

Coil:

 

Same for all my idiotic driving. Not sure if he is stabbing at us being able to fool around with vehicles from a younger age or if we are deemed fools, idiots, unsafe menaces to society for our parents teaching us how to operate a vehicle and then operating it safely but illegally.

 

Not particularly stabbing at anyone. And I'm not of the opinion that you're idiots or that your parents were idiots. Just pointing out the irony that what you say makes you superiourly safe drivers is nowadays illegal because it is "dangerous". Not living on a farm, I didn't have the opportunities you did. But I did "drive" a tractor at age 10 or so while my uncle fed out, drove a truck at 17, and a bit of stuff like that. Awaiting a response from the "obeying the law is not an option" and "obeying the law makes you safe" folks in this thread.

 

IIRC it's nowadays illegal to allow children below age 12 on tractors, let alone operate them. I'll bet you didn't wear bicycle helmets on the quad bike either. But there's some research that says that below age 14? or so, children CANNOT process information to make decisions correctly. Which implies that they cannot operate vehicles safely in the absence of an adult making decisions for them.

 

 

 

 

Exactly right. There was supervision, and guidance. Yes, we were lucky to get practical experience well before we were legally allowed to drive. Especially on a farm where slopes, hills, traction, rain, clay are hazards. There is no downside, only a large and lifelong upside.

 

 


Coil
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  #2157087 9-Jan-2019 14:58
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frankv:

 

Coil:

 

Same for all my idiotic driving. Not sure if he is stabbing at us being able to fool around with vehicles from a younger age or if we are deemed fools, idiots, unsafe menaces to society for our parents teaching us how to operate a vehicle and then operating it safely but illegally.

 

Not particularly stabbing at anyone. And I'm not of the opinion that you're idiots or that your parents were idiots. Just pointing out the irony that what you say makes you superiourly safe drivers is nowadays illegal because it is "dangerous". Not living on a farm, I didn't have the opportunities you did. But I did "drive" a tractor at age 10 or so while my uncle fed out, drove a truck at 17, and a bit of stuff like that. Awaiting a response from the "obeying the law is not an option" and "obeying the law makes you safe" folks in this thread.

 

IIRC it's nowadays illegal to allow children below age 12 on tractors, let alone operate them. I'll bet you didn't wear bicycle helmets on the quad bike either. But there's some research that says that below age 14? or so, children CANNOT process information to make decisions correctly. Which implies that they cannot operate vehicles safely in the absence of an adult making decisions for them.

 

 

 

 

All that said and today TDGeek and I are here, healthy and happy. So is my father and his brother who did the same, same with around 100 others kids from the primary school I went to and countless others in this country and Aussie.

I get your point, I can agree judgement comes with age and appreciate all that. Heck, the things I did 2 years ago I'd never do now, and that's life in general, not driving. 
Honestly speaking, unless you had the same upbringing as I you will never understand and be able to comment on these circumstances around farm operation. I get that you have quoted a few numbers there, just thought I'd remind you humans are very adaptive versatile creatures, those figures are maybe an average at best. It is all in proportion to your environment and your upbringing. 
I also see a lot of children operating go kart, motorbikes professionally. In environments that can kill them if they have poor judgement. Probably find when you have been doing something every day since you were under 10 you generally get pretty good judgement around it.

I see my upbringing as a blessing, I appreciated what a car or vehicle can do long before I ever found out the hard way, I knew what going sideways was and had no desire to on the road, i was confident and knew my vehicle proportions very well. This was on the day I got my licence.

I have friends who have never sat in the drivers seat before the age of 16, they had no confidence, had no judgement of what the car is capable of and mostly had NO RESPECT FOR IT. They also had not had the fun I had and most of them lost their licence around 2-4 times each. 

But heck, dangerous idiots with poor judgement I suppose. 


blakamin
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  #2157184 9-Jan-2019 17:26
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I let my daughters, 9 and 15, drive my ute on our property until I sold it. The 9yo on my lap. 

 

15yo drives my X5 on the property no worries now. 9yo prefered the ute, but now we have a boat :D

 

I'd rather they got some basics down before they got out on the road with the other w-anchors.

 

 

 

Shock Horror, I also used to let them sit in the back of the ute as I went down to our water pump. At walking pace.

 

 

 

Yes, this sign used to be not far from my place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Geektastic

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  #2157212 9-Jan-2019 18:45
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Good sign!





blakamin
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  #2157213 9-Jan-2019 18:48
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Geektastic: Good sign!

 

There's another with a door knob pic on it...

 

 

 

Can't remember what the latest is, we tend to ignore them after a while.


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