Muppets on the road

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#2970109 19-Sep-2022 14:01

Bung:

Is there a gap in the painted lines? There appears to be only a token effort. Lazy painter?

I see no gap. Looks like a perfectly standard no stopping zone.

Kyanar

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#2970110 19-Sep-2022 14:02

Journeyman:

Ok - let's say you're about to enter a busy intersection at rush hour and you hear police sirens. The sirens are getting louder which means they're getting closer. Might I suggest it's unwise to enter the intersection, even if you have the green light? I understand the temptation to think "Nah I can gap it. I'll get through the intersection before the cop gets here" but the police car will be travelling quite fast and will get there before you know it. It's probably best to just wait a moment just in case the police car is actually driving on the wrong side of the road - which they're allowed to do.

Might I suggest also that if you're the second car in the queue, it is doubly unwise to follow the first car through the intersection.

Emergency services vehicles are required to slow on approach to the intersection for just this reason. It doesn't mean you should try and gap it in front of it, but equally the police car or ambulance should not be barrelling into you if you are foolish and discourteous enough to do so.

msukiwi

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#2970115 19-Sep-2022 14:05

Bung:Is there a gap in the painted lines? There appears to be only a token effort. Lazy painter?

Nope - that IS the standard here in Christchurch now! All road marking is bad!

Kyanar

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#2970118 19-Sep-2022 14:09

msukiwi:

Nope - that IS the standard here in Christchurch now! All road marking is bad!

Again, why is that bad? There doesn't appear to be anything wrong with that road marking.

msukiwi

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#2970119 19-Sep-2022 14:14

Kyanar:Again, why is that bad? There doesn't appear to be anything wrong with that road marking.

They regularly mark X metres...not to an obvious point like a driveway edge etc!

Won't even consider "hocky sticks" to show obviously where to park (Where there is a problem) "As everyone would want them" - A quote from the Area Traffic Engineer!

geoffwnz

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#2970124 19-Sep-2022 14:22

Kyanar:

Journeyman:

Ok - let's say you're about to enter a busy intersection at rush hour and you hear police sirens. The sirens are getting louder which means they're getting closer. Might I suggest it's unwise to enter the intersection, even if you have the green light? I understand the temptation to think "Nah I can gap it. I'll get through the intersection before the cop gets here" but the police car will be travelling quite fast and will get there before you know it. It's probably best to just wait a moment just in case the police car is actually driving on the wrong side of the road - which they're allowed to do.

Might I suggest also that if you're the second car in the queue, it is doubly unwise to follow the first car through the intersection.

Emergency services vehicles are required to slow on approach to the intersection for just this reason. It doesn't mean you should try and gap it in front of it, but equally the police car or ambulance should not be barrelling into you if you are foolish and discourteous enough to do so.

They are also not supposed to "push" people through red lights. Example of the Totara Park lights. Single lane coming over the bridge to the SH2 lights. Ambulance will turn off lights and sirens and wait for lights to change so they can clear the intersection and resume "under lights" travel. Police car sits on the bridge in full disco mode leaning on the horn as well.

So Mr Police Officer, what exactly do you expect the cars ahead of you to do? Cross SH2 against the lights at significant risk of being t-boned by cars doing 100kmh?

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Kyanar

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#2970147 19-Sep-2022 15:13

msukiwi:

They regularly mark X metres...not to an obvious point like a driveway edge etc!

Won't even consider "hocky sticks" to show obviously where to park (Where there is a problem) "As everyone would want them" - A quote from the Area Traffic Engineer!

Still don't see a problem. The no stopping zone is pretty clearly marked (and the car is clearly on it) - there's no need to extend the yellow line over the driveway because it's always illegal to park there. It also looks like there is a third yellow "dash" obscured by the telegraph pole - you can just see the closer corner of it:

Maybe it would be good to have signs at each end as well, but legally they aren't necessary, and installation in concrete is expensive.

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Kyanar

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#2970148 19-Sep-2022 15:17

geoffwnz:

They are also not supposed to "push" people through red lights. Example of the Totara Park lights. Single lane coming over the bridge to the SH2 lights. Ambulance will turn off lights and sirens and wait for lights to change so they can clear the intersection and resume "under lights" travel. Police car sits on the bridge in full disco mode leaning on the horn as well.

So Mr Police Officer, what exactly do you expect the cars ahead of you to do? Cross SH2 against the lights at significant risk of being t-boned by cars doing 100kmh?

Our emergency services all have their lights and sirens on as they wait behind you as well, but regularly make statements through the media that you are not to clear the way by entering intersections against lights as it's dangerous and not just that if you get a red light ticket you will have no justification to have it quashed.

Many of our lights however are controlled by an EVP system which allows the computer aided despatch software to signal the traffic control system that an emergency vehicle is approaching, trigging the system to extend, shorten, or rearrange phases to allow the emergency vehicle to pass with no or minimal red light though - so it comes up less.

Bung

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#2970279 19-Sep-2022 18:17

I've been on Jervois Quay Wellington a few times when it's obvious something is coming through. The cars stopping at the lights shift to to edges of their lanes making an extra lane. The Police urgent duty policy is for cars to be doing no more than 20 going through opposing lights if the driver has any hope of coming out of the accident enquiry.

I was just surprised to see such a short no stopping zone. I had a neighbour once who wanted the Wellington Council to put something like that to give him more visibility coming out of his drive. They weren't interested and were going to take him to court for his DIY effort.

Journeyman

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#2970285 19-Sep-2022 18:57

Kyanar:

Journeyman:

Ok - let's say you're about to enter a busy intersection at rush hour and you hear police sirens. The sirens are getting louder which means they're getting closer. Might I suggest it's unwise to enter the intersection, even if you have the green light? I understand the temptation to think "Nah I can gap it. I'll get through the intersection before the cop gets here" but the police car will be travelling quite fast and will get there before you know it. It's probably best to just wait a moment just in case the police car is actually driving on the wrong side of the road - which they're allowed to do.

Might I suggest also that if you're the second car in the queue, it is doubly unwise to follow the first car through the intersection.

Emergency services vehicles are required to slow on approach to the intersection for just this reason. It doesn't mean you should try and gap it in front of it, but equally the police car or ambulance should not be barrelling into you if you are foolish and discourteous enough to do so.

I agree, and that's why the cars that wandered into the intersection didn't get t-boned by the cop car. Because he wasn't barrelling :)

Ge0rge

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#2970286 19-Sep-2022 19:05

They are supposed to come to a halt before entering the intersection when going through a red, ascertain that the road is clear, then proceed at no more than 10kph through the intersection.

trig42

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#2970365 20-Sep-2022 09:16

Speaking of getting out of the way for Emergency vehicles.

When we drove through France, Switzerland, Italy and Germany a few years back, whenever there was congestion on the motorways, everyone would leave a lane down the middle for emergancy vehicles. It was just automatic. I never saw an emergancy vehicle (or a cheeky entitled person as would happen here) using it, but it was always there. It meant if you saw congestion ahead, you'd either pull left or right enough that there was a gap between the lanes for another vehicle.

Having said that, the driving manners in Europe are so much better than here, and they know and practice keeping right (left here) unless overtaking.

Dratsab

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#2970383 20-Sep-2022 10:00

Ge0rge: They are supposed to come to a halt before entering the intersection when going through a red, ascertain that the road is clear, then proceed at no more than 10kph through the intersection.

Not quite correct. They (I'm assuming you're referring to Police) just need to make sure the way is clear then, according to their policy, proceed at no more than 20kmh.

Edit: Actually, it's more than just policy, it's written into law via sections 11.18 and 11.19 of the Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004.

Ge0rge

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#2970652 20-Sep-2022 18:59

I stand corrected. Interesting, as what I wrote was the teaching on my emergency response driver's course about 20 years ago.

elpenguino

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#2970668 20-Sep-2022 20:33

trig42:

Speaking of getting out of the way for Emergency vehicles.

When we drove through France, Switzerland, Italy and Germany a few years back, whenever there was congestion on the motorways, everyone would leave a lane down the middle for emergancy vehicles. It was just automatic. I never saw an emergancy vehicle (or a cheeky entitled person as would happen here) using it, but it was always there. It meant if you saw congestion ahead, you'd either pull left or right enough that there was a gap between the lanes for another vehicle.

Having said that, the driving manners in Europe are so much better than here, and they know and practice keeping right (left here) unless overtaking.

Ah, a motorcycle passing lane. How helpful.

They are better mannered indeed. Years ago, I had a lot of fun riding a motorbike on the autobahns and it didn't matter how fast the euro-saloon in front of me was going, once he saw me in his mirror, he'd pull over to let me pass.

The only exception in my experience - drivers with UK number plates.

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