Should cyclists pay road taxes ?

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#2718939 6-Jun-2021 13:12

shk292:
gzt: ... The other question I have is, does it really need the height of the existing structure.
There is still a requirement for ships to pass under the bridge - both the sugar works and the NZDF armament depot are up-harbour. I suppose we could always just add the relocation costs to those to the project cost, money well spent if it allows a few dozen more to cycle to work

39 metres of clearance are not needed by ships in that class.

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#2718986 6-Jun-2021 17:39

Rikkitic:

Some here seem to still cling to the notion that cyclists are just parasites who get in the way of cars and don't contribute anything except aggravation.

You would think that those car drivers would be glad to pay a little to remove the irritation.

frankv

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#2718987 6-Jun-2021 17:47

tdgeek:

sir1963:

If everyone cycled, everyone would end up paying perhaps $2K extra in taxes each year. because the need for roads will NOT go away.

If everyone cycled, the current roads would not need to be expanded.

I'm not so sure. Bicycles take up about 1/4 of the area of a car (especially one stopped in bumper-to-bumper traffic), by the time you allow a buffer zone around each one. So they need to go at least 1/4 the speed of a car to get the same congestion levels. How many cyclists can maintain a steady 25kph?

frankv

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#2718989 6-Jun-2021 17:52

tdgeek:

Maybe, but if we collect all the revenue from RUC where are the roads? National and Labour have all these road projects but where are they?

Wellington Expressway.

Transmission Gully (being built). New Manawatu Saddle road (being built). Expressway to Levin (being built).

I'm sure that Aucklanders can give examples there beyond the Waterview tunnel & Orewa motorway.

And there's a bunch of divider marker poles and road markings at Ohakea that probably cost over $100K.

frankv

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#2718992 6-Jun-2021 17:58

tdgeek:

mattwnz:

They all have a use by date. I am not sure what the habour bridges life is, but it wasn't that long ago when an accident potentially could have caused the end of it. You just need a big crash on it and it could leave Auckland without a bridge at all. Thi sis why they need an alternative, at least for contingency. But also becuase this one will reach the end of it's life. It is iconic too that they needed to enlarge it not all that long after it was built with the Nippon Clippons. It was just typical that they didn't plan for the increased usage.

IIRC there are still many years left, and a new bridge is in future plans. This thread is about the terrible idea of creating a small bridge for two wheel traffic users

What I don't understand is why it is cheaper to build an entire new bridge than to build something that sits on top of the existing bridge's posts. Not hanging off the existing structure, which I gather is about at it's limit, but on top of the concrete piles. Surely that's got to be cheaper?

Senecio

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#2718997 6-Jun-2021 18:21

Should cyclists pay taxes - Yes

Do they already pay their fair share of taxes - Yes

Most people who cycle for a past time

Own a car
Are more than likely to be higher income earners. Especially that lycra brigade. You think a $7,000 bike can be bought on a low income

Most people who cycle to commute

Also own a car, they need it for the weekend or Mum/Dad's taxi
Are also likely to be medium to higher income workers. Your'e general warehouse team member doesn't cycle to work. Generalisation I know, but I have a good sample size to go.

Would love to see a study undertaken. Take a 1,000 people who cycle and 1,000 who don't. I'm confident that you'll find that the cyclists pay more in total tax contribution than those who don't cycle.

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sir1963

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#2718998 6-Jun-2021 18:22

frankv:

Rikkitic:

Some here seem to still cling to the notion that cyclists are just parasites who get in the way of cars and don't contribute anything except aggravation.

You would think that those car drivers would be glad to pay a little to remove the irritation.

You would also think cyclists would want to pay a little more to have safe cycleways.

SomeoneSomewhere

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#2719001 6-Jun-2021 18:39

That assumes that there's a link between revenue and expenditure and there usually isn't.

It's also I believe quite widely accepted that one of the biggest impacts on cycling safety is the number of cyclists on the roads - more cyclists, motorists are more aware of cyclists, less accidents. A tax that dissuaded cycling would therefore have a negative impact on safety.

mattwnz

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#2720057 6-Jun-2021 23:13

There are now 4 million cars on the road for a population of 5 million. The governemnt must be making more money than ever to put back into the roads for all users.

ezbee

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#2720115 7-Jun-2021 11:45

Auckland's new Cycle, Harbor Crossing

Call it the Erebus Memorial Bridge with names of passengers and crew along the route, and story of the disaster.

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#2720130 7-Jun-2021 12:09

i think sir1963 will get a shock when he realises cyclists are not his main problem ...

try escooters. soon auckland streets will be filled with them

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#2720283 7-Jun-2021 15:40

mattwnz

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#2720288 7-Jun-2021 16:35

Batman:

i think sir1963 will get a shock when he realises cyclists are not his main problem ...

try escooters. soon auckland streets will be filled with them

I would be for commercial operations to pay a fee or levy to councils for anything that is non human powered.

sir1963

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#2720290 7-Jun-2021 16:37

SomeoneSomewhere:

That assumes that there's a link between revenue and expenditure and there usually isn't.

It's also I believe quite widely accepted that one of the biggest impacts on cycling safety is the number of cyclists on the roads - more cyclists, motorists are more aware of cyclists, less accidents. A tax that dissuaded cycling would therefore have a negative impact on safety.

A tax could allow better cycleways to be built which will significantly improve safety

SomeoneSomewhere

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#2720301 7-Jun-2021 17:16

sir1963:

SomeoneSomewhere:

That assumes that there's a link between revenue and expenditure and there usually isn't.

It's also I believe quite widely accepted that one of the biggest impacts on cycling safety is the number of cyclists on the roads - more cyclists, motorists are more aware of cyclists, less accidents. A tax that dissuaded cycling would therefore have a negative impact on safety.

A tax could allow better cycleways to be built which will significantly improve safety

"That assumes that there's a link between revenue and expenditure and there usually isn't."

Taxing bikes isn't necessary to do that. For example, the regional fuel tax largely doesn't go towards car-focused projects.

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