Fake Philips Xenon and refusal to refund?

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › Fake Philips Xenon and refusal to refund?

1 | 2 | 3 | 4

1014 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808078 28-Jun-2017 09:52

binarybrother: This guy might be getting sold what he thinks is real from his supplier, how would he know?

The same way as the OP...

Coil

6614 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808079 28-Jun-2017 09:52

binarybrother: Here’s how Philips tell you to check, but based on retail packaging version. Philips may well sell bulk packaging that is non branded but Google wasn’t very helpful on that topic. http://www.chk.philips.com/gb_en/ So you can google ‘how to tell fake Philips Xenon D2S’ and there’s lots of pages/images. Spot welds around base is the obvious part which does seem to indicate they are fake. I don’t want to put them in my car to ‘try them out’ as I’m sure they will work and don’t want to have an argument with the seller about returning a used product. If they are fake then I’d expect them not to last as long. It’s an existing factory Xenon car and one of my current bulbs has stopped working. It’s got Philips ones in today which I’ve compared to the new ones I got and there are differences. The ones I’ve purchased are not the really obvious fakes the Internet shows but there’s enough doubt in my mind after spending a hour or two looking on the Internet and examining the new bulbs. My situation is I want genuine. I’ve been sold genuine but have no way to verify that other than take the sellers word and with the level of fake ones out there think I’m entitled to question their authenticity. I think I believe that the seller believes they are genuine. But doesn't mean they are. $140 for the pair so it's not a lot of money. Somewhat surprised how resistant he is to refunding to rectify the situation.

Get your money back, i wouldnt let someone i knew use those fake bulbs for the fact they are reckoning with other peoples safety driving on our roads. Read here https://vehicleinspection.nzta.govt.nz/virms/in-service-wof-and-cof/general/lighting/headlamps

Technically they are illegal.

Bung

6488 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#1808081 28-Jun-2017 09:54

Coil:
HID's or Xenon bulbs are still in most european cars, only the top of the line fully optioned RS6's and alike have the LED bulbs standard now.
The car manufacture has the bulbs made by Bosch or who ever and they put it in their own packaging.
The bulb is considering a genuine part so its covered by the car dealer and brand but not the products manufacture.

https://www.driven2automotive.com/blog/fighting-fake-hid-bulbs-the-osram-trust-program/

My bulb survey couldn't afford most european cars some ~$40k Mazda and Suzuki have LED projectors now.

I was thinking more of the oem supply rather than the manufacturer branded spare parts.

I have since seen claims by a big US seller of Philips bulbs that 80% are faked and they do not trust any middlemen, buying only off Philips USA. The biggest risk as I see it is ruining the plastic of your headlight as the fakes don't filter UV very well. I think I would err on the side of caution and only buy fully retail packaged bulbs.

PS when did your branding change?

cadman

1014 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808087 28-Jun-2017 10:01

Coil:

Get your money back, i wouldnt let someone i knew use those fake bulbs for the fact they are reckoning with other peoples safety driving on our roads. Read here https://vehicleinspection.nzta.govt.nz/virms/in-service-wof-and-cof/general/lighting/headlamps

Technically they are illegal.

Not sure where you are getting it from that they are illegal - they may well meet the prescribed performance requirements - it's not like it's an HID conversion. The only issue I see is just that of misrepresentation.

Coil

6614 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808093 28-Jun-2017 10:06

Bung:
Coil:

HID's or Xenon bulbs are still in most european cars, only the top of the line fully optioned RS6's and alike have the LED bulbs standard now.
The car manufacture has the bulbs made by Bosch or who ever and they put it in their own packaging.
The bulb is considering a genuine part so its covered by the car dealer and brand but not the products manufacture.

https://www.driven2automotive.com/blog/fighting-fake-hid-bulbs-the-osram-trust-program/

My bulb survey couldn't afford most european cars some ~$40k Mazda and Suzuki have LED projectors now.

I was thinking more of the oem supply rather than the manufacturer branded spare parts.

I have since seen claims by a big US seller of Philips bulbs that 80% are faked and they do not trust any middlemen, buying only off Philips USA. The biggest risk as I see it is ruining the plastic of your headlight as the fakes don't filter UV very well. I think I would err on the side of caution and only buy fully retail packaged bulbs.

PS when did your branding change?

Rebranded the other day, Just moving away from my initials as im pretty tired of being personally identified haha, Someone took my handle Cipher in May so had to settle for Coil. (tesla in my pic and coil, Get it Tesla-Coil huehue)

Coil

6614 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808099 28-Jun-2017 10:08

cadman:

Coil:

Get your money back, i wouldnt let someone i knew use those fake bulbs for the fact they are reckoning with other peoples safety driving on our roads. Read here https://vehicleinspection.nzta.govt.nz/virms/in-service-wof-and-cof/general/lighting/headlamps

Technically they are illegal.

Not sure where you are getting it from that they are illegal - they may well meet the prescribed performance requirements - it's not like it's an HID conversion. The only issue I see is just that of misrepresentation.

If these are average knock offs the beam will not be not equal in colour and intensity. Possibly to bright and they can flicker. Which is not up to LTSA standard. As clearly depicted below.

cadman

1014 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808123 28-Jun-2017 10:40

Coil:

cadman:

Coil:

Get your money back, i wouldnt let someone i knew use those fake bulbs for the fact they are reckoning with other peoples safety driving on our roads. Read here https://vehicleinspection.nzta.govt.nz/virms/in-service-wof-and-cof/general/lighting/headlamps

Technically they are illegal.

Not sure where you are getting it from that they are illegal - they may well meet the prescribed performance requirements - it's not like it's an HID conversion. The only issue I see is just that of misrepresentation.

If these are average knock offs the beam will not be not equal in colour and intensity. Possibly to bright and they can flicker. Which is not up to LTSA standard. As clearly depicted below.

Yeah but you can get that with different brands anyway. If replaced as a pair, no problem.

Quic Broadband

Move to New Zealand's best fibre broadband service (affiliate link). Free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE. Note that to use Quic Broadband you must be comfortable with configuring your own router.

Coil

6614 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808160 28-Jun-2017 11:33

cadman:

Coil:

cadman:

Coil:

Get your money back, i wouldnt let someone i knew use those fake bulbs for the fact they are reckoning with other peoples safety driving on our roads. Read here https://vehicleinspection.nzta.govt.nz/virms/in-service-wof-and-cof/general/lighting/headlamps

Technically they are illegal.

Not sure where you are getting it from that they are illegal - they may well meet the prescribed performance requirements - it's not like it's an HID conversion. The only issue I see is just that of misrepresentation.

If these are average knock offs the beam will not be not equal in colour and intensity. Possibly to bright and they can flicker. Which is not up to LTSA standard. As clearly depicted below.

Yeah but you can get that with different brands anyway. If replaced as a pair, no problem.

Yeah you can, Its more the irregular intensity of the beam of colour difference that is the issue. An old VW HID will be more yellow than a new one but the beam will be consistent and wont have bright spots. If you have $250-$300 to spend per bulb...

Sam91

620 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1808168 28-Jun-2017 11:51

I think I've found the auction in question. Does the box match the box pictured on the auction?

binarybrother

42 posts

Geek

#1808208 28-Jun-2017 13:46

So emailed him rather than trying to talk over the phone again. Thought I might need an email trail to prove what was said:

[i]Electronic goods, due to their fragile nature are not usually accepted back for credit once opened. However we will assess the bulbs once we see them and make the following assumptions. Because you are returning at your discretion, as opposed to them being wrong, or misrepresented,

We will accept them back for credit, less a 10% restocking fee, you will need to cover also the freight both ways and the trademe success fee.as below.

My recommendation is that you take us at our word and install them as represented. [i]

I've replied telling him those costs are not acceptable (he can get his success fee refunded) but to conclude the matter will pay him the restocking fee, $14. He's digging in here so will see what he comes back with. Failing that I'll see what TradeMe can do and from there I'll have to likely settle for some naming and shaming.

tripper1000

1617 posts

Uber Geek

#1808212 28-Jun-2017 13:53

Trademe will pull the auctions if they receive a complaint from Philips. Take the items to Philips if you can.

I know a girl who was selling one of those nutra-bullet blender things that she'd been given and Trademe pulled her auction because the license importer was targeting fakes on Trademe. She was a bit put out as she didn't even realise it wasn't the genuine article, but I guess if she relisted it and made it clear it wasn't the genuine article she would have been right.

Edit: Spelling - probably still some mistakes in there.

ubergeeknz

3344 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Vocus

#1808309 28-Jun-2017 15:28

I feel if this outfit was selling the legit article and could prove it, they would have. The fact they're digging in certainly confirms that something's up. Take it to its conclusion IMO, the suggestion of getting Philips involved is a good one.

Coil

6614 posts

Uber Geek
Inactive user

#1808327 28-Jun-2017 15:53

Link us the bulbs please, Interested to see how its described and so fourth. I would consult trademe regarding the trader ASAP from whats been said above. If it sounds dodgy it is.

dacraka

766 posts

Ultimate Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

#1808330 28-Jun-2017 15:59

Don't the real bulb packs have a hologram sticker on them to prove that they are real Philips?

binarybrother

42 posts

Geek

#1808338 28-Jun-2017 16:19

I'll wait until I'm at an impasse with him before advertising who I'm dealing with. I don't want to make matters worse. It's a small business which looks to have been around for a while and sell a variety components and services. He's had mostly positive feedback. His company is part of MTA so there's an avenue there if TradeMe can't help resolve.

So far called Philips NZ who don't import and distribute them, but they put me in touch with Hella who do. Rang Hella and explained the situation. They were very helpful. They had Osram in stock rather than Philips at present but had imported Philips Xenon in the past. They said they'd never seen plain white box packaging before and agreed it seemed suspect. Trying to send mine into someone at Philips to positivity confirm seems like a hard option. Without that Philips won't get involved directly.

Still waiting for a reply from the business. I'll follow up again tomorrow and let you all know what goes down.

1 | 2 | 3 | 4