What are the reasons for regional variations in vehicle specifications?

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ratsun81

508 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3113196 8-Aug-2023 11:39

Bung:
Geektastic: I recently bought a Subaru Outback turbo.

NZ vehicles are Japanese built and USA vehicles are built there.

The vehicles built in both locations are essentially the same.

However, I did note that the engines in the USA versions are tuned to a higher power - 260 bhp v 245 - despite being otherwise the same engine.

Why would that be done?

If it really exists is a ~6% difference noticeable. It could be that in its US market segment 260 bhp is needed to match the completion so that is the figure that Subaru US's ad agency pulled out of their trunk.

I remember the days when all the motorcycles provided to the US magazines for test had been modified in some way to give 10 -15mph higher top speed than anything straight out of the showroom.

Possibly its down to the fuel, US fuel from light research is all E10 blended fuel so the power increase could be due to that.

Inphinity

2780 posts

Uber Geek

#3113205 8-Aug-2023 12:04

Aside from localised fuel availability, economy or emissions requirements can play a part, too. Some countries run different tunes to meet different emissions or economy objectives. If we were a big enough market, you'd see more players using more eco-friendly tunes to be able to be CCF neutral, for example.

WyleECoyoteNZ

1049 posts

Uber Geek

#3113208 8-Aug-2023 12:10

I'd guess a lot of it comes down to US federal regulations.

Things like emissions could be different.

Things you don't immediately think about are different as well, like headlights for instance.

frankv

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#3113215 8-Aug-2023 12:15

Maybe it's also associated with speed limits? In Europe and the USA, there are motorway speed limits around 130kph (not to mention autobahns, and not to mention that US drivers typically do another 10mph). It's going to be helpful to have a bit more power so you can cruise at those speeds all day.

Groucho

524 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3113447 8-Aug-2023 15:18

It's not just engines, Japanese cars (looking at you Toyota) starve their NZ/AU spec vehicles of warm fuzzy features compared with their import equivalents even when a few years older. In shopping around for a new(er) ~10 year old Corolla/Auris last year, no proximity key/start button, no auto/off headlights, no subtle tilting of door mirrors when in reverse, no reverse camera.

On the plus side NZ new meant VVT-I (not CVT) and no BEEP BEEP BEEP when reversing. NZ new won the day.

BlakJak

1275 posts

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#3113526 8-Aug-2023 20:38

The most common type of octane rating worldwide is the Research Octane Number (RON). RON is determined by running the fuel through a specific test engine with a variable compression ratio under controlled conditions, and comparing these results with those for mixtures of isooctane and n-heptane.

There is another type of octane rating, called Motor Octane Number (MON) or the aviation lean octane rating, which is a better measure of how the fuel behaves when under load. MON testing uses a similar test engine to that used in RON testing, but with a preheated fuel mixture, a higher engine speed, and variable ignition timing to further stress the fuel's knock resistance. Depending on the composition of the fuel, the MON of a modern gasoline will be about 8 to 10 points lower than the RON. Normally fuel specifications require both a minimum RON and a minimum MON.

In most countries (including all of Europe, Australia and New Zealand) the "headline" octane that would be shown on the pump is the RON, but in the United States and some other countries the headline number is the average of the RON and the MON, sometimes called the Anti-Knock Index (AKI), Road Octane Number (RdON), Pump Octane Number (PON), or (R+M)/2. Because of the 10 point difference noted above, this means that the octane in the United States will be about 4 to 5 points lower than the same fuel elsewhere: 87 octane fuel, the "regular" gasoline in the US and Canada, would be 91-95 (regular) in New Zealand.

From http://www.protune.co.nz/tech.php?ln=OCTANE-RACING&LID=1050135192

So expect a difference beween octane rating considerations in the US and elsewhere. Just to throw that factoid out there.

No signature to see here, move along...

Tinkerisk

4228 posts

Uber Geek

#3113553 8-Aug-2023 23:53

frankv:

Maybe it's also associated with speed limits? In Europe and the USA, there are motorway speed limits around 130kph (not to mention autobahns, and not to mention that US drivers typically do another 10mph). It's going to be helpful to have a bit more power so you can cruise at those speeds all day.

The „Autobahn“ (in Germany, because it is a German term) does not have a general speed limit, you can drive at 350 km/h if you can justify it and your car allows it. Don't worry if someone in front of you swerves into your lane at 120km/h to overtake a lorry (that's still a speed difference of 230km/h). At night, when the motorway is empty and there are six or eight lanes, you can go for it. Sometimes there are local speed limits, which of course have to be observed. There are supposed to be people who rent a real horsepower car in Germany just to have given it a go at least once in their lives.

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Sidestep

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#3113558 9-Aug-2023 04:41

Sometimes it's just that there's money to be made in a captive market..

This summer we popped across the border to visit friends, and while there borrowed their 2023 Outback.

They'd got the Onyx version.

Nice package, practical (easy to clean) vinyl interior, Deep Snow/Mud X-Mode option, and the gaudy chrome grille, window surrounds etc. replaced with nice black trim.
Wife liked it so much that we popped into our local Subie dealer to see if it was time to upgrade ours..

But Canadian-market Onyx's (while made on the same line, in the same factory) aren’t available as an XT with the 260hp turbo - they only have the 182hp N/A 2.5.

At the usual exchange rate - they're almost 15% more expensive than the same optioned vehicle in the US.
The dealer (who said we had to move up to a Limited to get the Turbo) tried to tell us vehicles sold here are 'specially engineered for Canada' Lol.

As if the climate 500km away in Coeur d'Alene is any different to Calgary.

And no we can't just import a US one.
Subaru won't honour the warranty, do over-the-air upgrades, or provide a letter stating it meets all Canadian standards.

Needless to say, left the dealership feeling annoyed, and without buying a car.

Geektastic

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#3121453 28-Aug-2023 23:03

Sidestep:

Sometimes it's just that there's money to be made in a captive market..

This summer we popped across the border to visit friends, and while there borrowed their 2023 Outback.

They'd got the Onyx version.

Nice package, practical (easy to clean) vinyl interior, Deep Snow/Mud X-Mode option, and the gaudy chrome grille, window surrounds etc. replaced with nice black trim.
Wife liked it so much that we popped into our local Subie dealer to see if it was time to upgrade ours..

But Canadian-market Onyx's (while made on the same line, in the same factory) aren’t available as an XT with the 260hp turbo - they only have the 182hp N/A 2.5.

At the usual exchange rate - they're almost 15% more expensive than the same optioned vehicle in the US.
The dealer (who said we had to move up to a Limited to get the Turbo) tried to tell us vehicles sold here are 'specially engineered for Canada' Lol.

As if the climate 500km away in Coeur d'Alene is any different to Calgary.

And no we can't just import a US one.
Subaru won't honour the warranty, do over-the-air upgrades, or provide a letter stating it meets all Canadian standards.

Needless to say, left the dealership feeling annoyed, and without buying a car.

Yes I can see that being annoying.

I have spotted a few other oddities. The US cars have a very good camera in the rear facing edge of the Shark Fin antenna that gives a full high resolution rear image that is displayed in the rear view mirror. Very handy if you fill the back up with camping stuff and so on - you still get the view as if it was not there!

Another is the Wilderness version, completely not available outside the US although I have heard that there is (sort of) one in NZ because someone liked it so much they bought all the parts (they are all bolt ons) from the US and added them here. The only thing that cannot be replicated is the colour unless you have the base vehicle resprayed.

We do not get any of the connected services for Starlink down here either - no live weather etc etc. and What 3 Words integration is not present here either.

Kyanar

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#3123317 3-Sep-2023 15:38

frankv:

Maybe it's also associated with speed limits? In Europe and the USA, there are motorway speed limits around 130kph (not to mention autobahns, and not to mention that US drivers typically do another 10mph). It's going to be helpful to have a bit more power so you can cruise at those speeds all day.

That wouldn't account for the fact that the highest speed limit in Australia, which many cars destined for the NZ market would likely also be designed for, is also 130km/hr (and until a few years ago, literally unlimited). Referring of course to the large open highways across the Northern Territory where the speed limit is what's called an "open speed limit" - where the prevailing thinking was that excessive speed was in fact less risky than fatigue, and fatigue was likely to be the more common contributor to road accidents.

Scott3

3970 posts

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#3123416 3-Sep-2023 23:38

Geektastic: I recently bought a Subaru Outback turbo.

NZ vehicles are Japanese built and USA vehicles are built there.

The vehicles built in both locations are essentially the same.

However, I did note that the engines in the USA versions are tuned to a higher power - 260 bhp v 245 - despite being otherwise the same engine.

Why would that be done?

A combination of the following:

Differing local regulations (emissions, safety, weight limits etc). i.e.
- CAFE emissions rules only in much of the USA, vs take your pick of many (and slightly old) standards in NZ
- Need to keep smaller vehicles under 3500kg in NZ as the need for a COF & the 90km/h speed limit for heavier vehicles is unattractive to buyer.
- Local safety regulations (i.e the ATTO3 had to be recalled in aussie because it only had two child seat top tether points in the second row
Differing operating environments. i.e.
- Lowest octane fuel available in western Europe is 95RON, so cars get optimized for that (or higher octane fuel), and don't even need to be designed to run 91RON at all.
- Cars sold in Thailand, Philippines etc, don't need heaters.
- Roads in the USA tend to be straighter, and bumpier than other first world countries, hence there is a consumer taste for softer, more comfort oriented suspension setups, vs stiff sport suspension setups favored elsewhere.
- Aussie is massive, so long range fuel tanks are popular in 4x4's, vs NZ, where fuel is much more available.
- Road surfaces can be bad in places like the Philippines, so the ford ecosport was offered with a spare tire (mounted on the rear door), where as in markets like NZ it was not offered with a spare.
Differing buyer tastes, For example:
- Wagons & Hatchbacks are less popular in the USA than in NZ / Europe
- Safety much more important in NZ than much of Asia (i.e. NZ 8 seater Hyundai Imax van gets 3 point seat belts on every seat, Philipines market last generation staria / grand staria gets lap belt's on all but two seats)
- Seating capacity more important in Philipines (i.e. same van as the 8 seat hyundai imax was sold as a 9 or 12-seater in the Philippines)
- In countries like the Philippines (vast majority of time speed is restricted by the road or other traffic) engine power is less important than it is in NZ (few roads above 100km/h speed limit, but lots of higher speed climbs with free flowing traffic), which in turn is less important than in the USA (Going from LA to vegas, and the v6 sports car was working pritty hard up some of the climbs, didn't seem too steep, but the traffic was flowing at about 130km/h).
- USA & japan (and to a lesser extend NZ) like auto's, compared to asia & europe.
- USA & japan dislike diesel cars.
- Tow rating less important on smaller cars in the USA (where larger pick up's & SUV's are abundant) than in NZ.
Differing factory ability, for example:
- UK built Gen1 Nissan Leaf's had steal doors, where japan built units had alloy doors
Differing product mix in different markets. For example:
- In the Philippines the Toyota Fortuner is offered as a 4x2, where as in NZ it is strictly 4x4 only. I guess toyota NZ want to encourage those that want a 7 seat SUV don't need low range 4x4 into the Highlander, by not offering the cheaper 4x2 Fortuner.

In the case of the turbo Subaru outback:

The USA version of the car get's more power & torque (will be masured under SAE methrors), and is rated to run on lower octane fuel (87 R+M/2), roughly equal to 91 RON. And gets a lot lower tow rating (3500lb /1588kg).

NZ version needs 95RON, gets less power & torque (measured under DIN, i assume 70020), but is rated to tow 2400kg.

DIN HP should be about 1.4% higher than SAE, so the different measure methods are unlikely to be the reason.

My guess for the difference is due to one of the following:

Subaru tuned back the power on the NZ version to allow compliance with Euro 6b emissions (which may be stricter than the USA equivalent?)
Subaru tuned back the power to get a better fuel economy figure under the ADR standardized test. (which is very important in NZ as it drives both the clean car fee, and cost / revenue to offset for the dealer under the clean car standard). Less important in the USA where fuel is cheaper, and the vehicle is classified as a light truck, meaning less onerous requirements.
Subaru tuned back the power to allow for a higher tow rating on the NZ version. Perhaps due to limitations of the transmission or engine cooling system (dialing back-torque, reduces load on the transmission). dialing back power reduces the load on the cooling system...
Subaru is simply under selling its car's power. Brands could do this for a number of reasons:
- Make something else in their lineup look more attractive in a spec sheet comparison. (WRX?)
- Give room to advertise a power increase a few years down the track.
- Underpromice / overdeliver for happy customers
- Make the car seem less performance-oriented for insurers.
- Reduce road tax / registration burden in places where peak power is a component of the tax (common in Europe)
- Avoid limitations on use, i.e. in aussie P platers are restricted to a max of 130kW / tonne (outback will be well under this regardless)

robjg63:

Because we often piggy-back on the Australian market, we are impacted by the Australian 'requirements'.

This is sometimes, but not always the case.

Australia is quite a different market to NZ:

Australian Design Rules (ADR), make Aussie can't simply use RHD cars that match other markets (like Ireland).
Cheaper fuel, less fuel economy related policy & less environmental concern make fuel economy less important.
NZ has some specific regulations that impact our market.
Absence of cheap, automatic & well specified used imports ex Japan mean there is more a market for entry level car's in Aussie.
Buyer tastes are quite different.

As example's:
a NZ new 2006 Mitsubishi Outlander we used to have in the family had (far too soft / saggy) Coilover rear suspension, I assume to match with japan domestic market spec. Aust, and most of the rest of the wold got separate coils & shocks.
Subaru legacy was sold as a legacy in NZ despite being badges as a levorg in aussie.
Toyota Aussie offers a cars like the corolla hatch in non-hybrid in aussie, but have gone hybrid only in NZ.
Kia Picanto is offered in 6 versions in aussie, but only one (fairly high spec) version in NZ.
Default configuration for the Toyota Prado in Aust is with the spare wheel on the rear tailgate (and with an additional long range fuel tank under the rear of the car). "Flat tailgate pack" with the spare under the rear and long range fuel tank deleted is an option on higher trim models only. In NZ the flat tailgate is the only version offered.
Hiace van (frount engine shape) is offered as a 12 seater in aussie (two versions 3710 GVM & 3720kg GVM), but in NZ it is only offered as a 10 seater as crossing the 3500kg GVM threshold is a big deal (hubometer, COF, 90km/h max speed limit etc.)

Scott3

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#3123469 4-Sep-2023 10:30

xpd:

NZ new cars should be fine on 91+...... seals used in engines from overseas cars etc have been exposed to higher fuel types and the seals dont like 91, and causes issues.

So from new, the seals should be good for anything.

For clarity, higher octane fuel provides better resistance to premature detonation, rather than sealing performance.

Plenty of NZ new cars require higher octane fuel. And it is going to become more common as pressure on manufacturers to reduce emissions / improve fuel economy increases. Running higher compression increases efficiency, but requires increased resistance to premature detonation (or direct injection).

CitizenErased

207 posts

Master Geek

#3152655 27-Oct-2023 12:47

Groucho:

On the plus side NZ new meant VVT-I (not CVT) and no BEEP BEEP BEEP when reversing. NZ new won the day.

You're confusing two different thing there. VVT-i stands for Variable Valve Timing with intelligence (i.e. the engine); CVT is a continuously variable transmission. NZ new Corollas have had CVT transmissions since 2013, the same as the rest of the world.

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