EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment) for Home Use

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#3225532 2-May-2024 15:23

mkissin:

Jase2985:

interesting, wonder how much the power loss is?

Assuming 2.5mm2 conductors, and a 30m run (so 60m total return) then the total resistance of the lead is 0.41 ohms.

If it's a "fast" 16A charger the total loss is then 105W, which is 2.85% (of a 230V 16A source).

Not nothing, but not much.

Probably a little less than that, the fastest our Leaf ever went from the 16A charger was 14.5A.

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candyflip

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#3229041 11-May-2024 15:18

We're looking at installing an EV home charger in our AirBnb carport (Westland) and need it to be WiFi capable and controllable completely remotely, for our guests.

We won't charge them (ie. no cost) for a charge! 😄

But we do need to be able to control who charges, when, and for how long.

And we probably don't want a charge cord attached that could potentially be ripped off or otherwise damaged by guests or others.

I've looked at the Tesla 3, but installers are saying they have terrible trouble configuring the app and rate it very low on ease of install.

Names that come up highest are; EO, Delta, Evnex, ABB, Fronius and Fimer.

Thoughts on that?

Dingbatt

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#3229048 11-May-2024 15:35

Any EV owner worth their salt should have a cable they can use. Some of the EVSEs have the ability to use RFID cards to activate them. So if your guests use keys to access your property, maybe you could add an RFID card to the key ring?

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

candyflip

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#3229056 11-May-2024 15:43

Dingbatt:

Any EV owner worth their salt should have a cable they can use. Some of the EVSEs have the ability to use RFID cards to activate them. So if your guests use keys to access your property, maybe you could add an RFID card to the key ring?

We're going keyless doorpad on our main entry (also remote controlled), so thankfully no keys to worry about.

But I agree that even travelers in EuropCar hired EV's should have the charge cables with them.

wired

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#3229097 11-May-2024 17:47

candyflip:

We're looking at installing an EV home charger in our AirBnb carport (Westland) and need it to be WiFi capable and controllable completely remotely, for our guests.

We won't charge them (ie. no cost) for a charge! 😄

But we do need to be able to control who charges, when, and for how long.

And we probably don't want a charge cord attached that could potentially be ripped off or otherwise damaged by guests or others.

I've looked at the Tesla 3, but installers are saying they have terrible trouble configuring the app and rate it very low on ease of install.

Names that come up highest are; EO, Delta, Evnex, ABB, Fronius and Fimer.

Thoughts on that?

we installed a Wallbox unit to do this, with a RFID tag (noting your thoughts on this) and a current sensor so we didn’t need to upgrade the power supply. It has a good remote portal.

SaltyNZ

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#3229466 13-May-2024 08:39

wired:

we installed a Wallbox unit to do this, with a RFID tag (noting your thoughts on this) and a current sensor so we didn’t need to upgrade the power supply. It has a good remote portal.

Currently on my third Wallbox after neither of the first two lasted a year before failing. Good luck.

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trig42

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#3229522 13-May-2024 08:55

Dingbatt:

Any EV owner worth their salt should have a cable they can use. Some of the EVSEs have the ability to use RFID cards to activate them. So if your guests use keys to access your property, maybe you could add an RFID card to the key ring?

Do you think that most EV owners have a type2 to type 2 cable (or the Chademo variant)?

I don't think they do. Maybe most of the really early adopters.

I don't have one. I've looked at whether or not buying one is a good idea and it just doesn't stack up for me. When I'm away from home (where I have a 32A AC charger), I'll either DC charge, or use the Granny charger. I'd be pretty gutted if I rented an AirBnB that advertised EVSE, but showed up there to no cable (especially if I chose that AirBnB over another because it advertised EV charging).

Of course, then you'd have the issue of showing up and the EVSE they have is CCS2 and you have a Chademo car.

If you are putting and EVSE in an AirBnB, make it a tethered one, or, to stop others using it get an untethered one and provide the cables in the AirBnB and ask that the guests unplug them and leave them inside when they leave.

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Dingbatt

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#3229525 13-May-2024 09:00

trig42:

Dingbatt:

Any EV owner worth their salt should have a cable they can use…….

Do you think that most EV owners have a type2 to type 2 cable (or the Chademo variant)?

I don't think they do. Maybe most of the really early adopters.

I draw your attention the the three words following “EV owner” in my post.😏

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

Scott3

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#3229611 13-May-2024 10:31

trig42:

Dingbatt:

Any EV owner worth their salt should have a cable they can use. Some of the EVSEs have the ability to use RFID cards to activate them. So if your guests use keys to access your property, maybe you could add an RFID card to the key ring?

Do you think that most EV owners have a type2 to type 2 cable (or the Chademo variant)?

I don't think they do. Maybe most of the really early adopters.

I don't have one. I've looked at whether or not buying one is a good idea and it just doesn't stack up for me. When I'm away from home (where I have a 32A AC charger), I'll either DC charge, or use the Granny charger. I'd be pretty gutted if I rented an AirBnB that advertised EVSE, but showed up there to no cable (especially if I chose that AirBnB over another because it advertised EV charging).

Of course, then you'd have the issue of showing up and the EVSE they have is CCS2 and you have a Chademo car.

If you are putting and EVSE in an AirBnB, make it a tethered one, or, to stop others using it get an untethered one and provide the cables in the AirBnB and ask that the guests unplug them and leave them inside when they leave.

Should note that not all Chademo car's have J1772 (Type 1) AC port's. As an example recent NZ new Nissan leaf's have have a type 2 AC port next to the CHAdeMO fast charge port.

I would say less than half of EV owners have the public AC charge cord. They (for type 2 to type 1) are about $270. I use ours perhaps 4 times a year, and mostly just opportunity charging, not because I need it (and I have a short range leaf). Would be more cost-effective to skip the cord and rely on DC charging instead.

I have family members who's long range EV came with a type 2 to type 2 cord. It lives in their garage and has never been used (car is at 90,000km+).

That said, I don't think it is fair to be gutted that an accommodation provider follows the government guidelines for public charging infrastructure. If you want to be able to charge at all public AC charging, you need to pony up for the appropriate cord (or individually check if the EVSE is the BYO cable type before booking):

https://nzta.govt.nz/planning-and-investment/planning/transport-planning/planning-for-electric-vehicles/national-guidance-for-public-electric-vehicle-charging-infrastructure/charging-point-connectors-and-socket-outlets/

A reason that this guideline was put in place was that it allows charging of both Type 1 & Type 2 EV's (without adapters which is important as while common, adapters not supplied by the vehicle or EVSE manufacturer are deemed electrically unsafe by worksafe).

Yeah, the big issue with a tethered EVSE is that you have to pick between type 1 & type 2 plugs.

trig42

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#3229615 13-May-2024 10:53

Yep agree with that, but if you are going to advertise your AirBnB has EV charging (not saying that candyflip's one will be advertising it or using it as a point of difference), then less than half of people with and EV will have a cable that can use it (and I reckon it's way less than half).

If you do advertise/use as point-of-difference, then you either need to put the caveat in that it is untethered or supply the cable in the accommodation.

I've had an EV for 7 months now. I've used the granny charger once (at a bookabach) and then only because I knew we weren't going anywhere for about a day and couled leave it trickling in. I could have taken it up the road to Masterton and quick charged it if we'd needed to use it. All our other road trips it's been at DC fast chargers (Z, BP and ChargeNet).

cthombor

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#3229773 13-May-2024 13:11

trig42:

Yep agree with that, but if you are going to advertise your AirBnB has EV charging (not saying that candyflip's one will be advertising it or using it as a point of difference), then less than half of people with and EV will have a cable that can use it (and I reckon it's way less than half).

If you do advertise/use as point-of-difference, then you either need to put the caveat in that it is untethered or supply the cable in the accommodation.

I think anyone driving an EV into Westland is iikely to either be adventurous (and well-prepared) or clueless.

By "clueless" I mean anyone who is unlikely to "ask the right questions" to avoid a nasty surprise when they (belatedly!) discover just how few options they have for fastcharging (or even slow-charging!) their EV in that region.

Some of the "adventurous" EV road-trippers may never have driven an EV in the middle of the NI -- where it's routine for a motel to offer a type-2 slowcharging socket to the folks who spend the night.

The situation isn't helped by plugshare.com *not* revealing (except indirectly through comments and pictures posted by helpful folks) whether a Type-2 station is offering a type-2 plug or a type-2 socket.

All to say that -- if you can figure out how to do this without too much additional risk (e.g. of someone driving away with the adapter cables), you might consider *renting* cables for a daily charge of perhaps $5? If folks have to prepay for a cable-rental then it'll be clear -- even to the "clueless" that a charging cable is required. You'll need both types of cables: type2-to-type2 and type2-to-type1. And you'll want to "size" the cable for the capacity of your wallbox -- for example, if it delivers at most 3.6kW then you can purchase a less-expensive (and lighter and smaller-diameter) cable. And you'll want the cable to be long enough to reach the charging port of any EV -- which can be anywhere on the vehicle, as there's bugger-all in the way of standardisation on its location!

Dingbatt

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#3297563 15-Oct-2024 11:31

When I first started this thread, I wondered about DC home charging. The response at the time was “too expensive and not really available”. I stumbled across this YouTube video (well actually I subscribe to his channel) about an Australian home DC car charger. Not cheap, but not out of the question for the person who has everything anyway.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

Dairusire

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#3297578 15-Oct-2024 11:58

Dingbatt:

When I first started this thread, I wondered about DC home charging. The response at the time was “too expensive and not really available”. I stumbled across this YouTube video (well actually I subscribe to his channel) about an Australian home DC car charger. Not cheap, but not out of the question for the person who has everything anyway.

Yeah definitely not cheap. The system alone for the stack he got was 28k AUD.

but, to be fair here. 28k AUD w/ DC EV charging, 32kwh of Battery. Put enough solar on the roof and that'd be more than enough for me to go completely offgrid lol. Did like the fact it also supports bidirectional DC EV charging too, so if you've got a vehicle that supports that, well. Epic.

Scott3

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#3297639 15-Oct-2024 13:16

Dingbatt:

When I first started this thread, I wondered about DC home charging. The response at the time was “too expensive and not really available”. I stumbled across this YouTube video (well actually I subscribe to his channel) about an Australian home DC car charger. Not cheap, but not out of the question for the person who has everything anyway.

Home DC charging has got heaps cheaper over the last few years.

Used to be you needed to spend ~$25k for a 25kW delta unit.

These days you can get a 30kW unit for $13k (and it supports 1000V natively to boot):

https://smartevchargers.co.nz/shop/dc-fast-chargers/30kw-dc-fast-charger-css2/

Of course, it still requires a fat electrical connection (a 63A 3 phase connection is 43kW, and a 100A three phase connection is 69 kW).

And of course requires a fairly special application to justify the cost.

Pretty much every higher end EV on the NZ market supports ~11kW AC charging, which is enough to charge the car overnight, and some support 22kW AC charging (BMW iX as an option, Cadillac Lyric as standard), which is fast enough for a full charge in ~5 hours.

Perhaps somebody who likes to take their larger boat to the lake for a waterski in the early morning (say a 150km - 180km round trip using the bulk of the range of their Kia EV9), come home and work / relax for a few hours in the middle of the day, then go fishing (a similar distance away) in the evening?

Dingbatt

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#3297645 15-Oct-2024 13:44

I guess the thing about this one (as opposed to the one Scott3 linked) is it’s sitting on top of the battery stack, so no AC to DC required. Or DC to AC for a conventional set up with a battery powering an EVSE either.
Theoretically, it’s not limited by the pole fuse at the street or that you only have one phase at your house. You just need a roof full of PV panels and a tall stack of battery modules. As I said, for the person who already has everything (and wants a “look at me” system).

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

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