Mazda 3 vs Hyundai i30 vs Mitsi Lancer

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#1302467 12-May-2015 08:56

And you're completely off the idea of diesel? The 2.2 engine's highly regarded (already used in the CX5 and the 6), and my understanding the 3s with this engine are the fastest (0-100) of the range.

Inphinity

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#1302468 12-May-2015 08:58

MikeAqua: With Mazda 3 the base model comes with front back and side airbags, reversing camera and of course ABS and stability control.

The mid range adds blind spot warning, parking sensors and rear cross traffic warning. Mid range also comes with GPS, and I guess easy navigation adds some safety. I'm dubious about how much value radar cruise control, auto-braking and lane departure warning add. I can see auto-braking being a hazard in some circumstances.

It is quiet and has comfy, supportive seats.

Will think about the 2.5, but obviously it adds to price, weight and fuel. The 2.0 is very nicely balanced, will the 2.5 be as nicely balanced with the heavier engine.

The 2.5 is almost as fuel efficient as the 2.0 when driven nicely, while noticeably more capable when you need to put your foot down (although the 2.0 is not sluggish for what it is). In my opinion the SP25 handles slightly better than the 2.0 models, presumably a combination of the larger tyres and what I suspect is slightly stiffer suspension (or maybe it's juts the lower profile tyres). That said, on new prices, the top-spec SP25 is about $15k more than the entry-level GLX. The non-limited SP25 is only about a $6k premium and much better value imo, though it is as far as I'm aware only available in 6MT (which to me is a positive, to some it won't be). Kinda hoping they do another MPS model soon... ;)

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#1302488 12-May-2015 09:24

nakedmolerat:
richms: How does it keep the aircon cool when it stops the engine? How long does it take to get moving? How fast is it to get going?

Could this be why I keep getting stuck behind people in new cars at lights that take 4-5 seconds to get moving from when the light goes green or is it prettymuch instant?

It takes milliseconds to start - you should not notice the difference at all.

For those wondering how it is done the engine is stopped in a position that allows the direct injection and ignition to do most of the work. The starter motor probably only turns just in case. Mazda claim 350mS start time.

Inphinity

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#1302574 12-May-2015 10:28

Bung:

For those wondering how it is done the engine is stopped in a position that allows the direct injection and ignition to do most of the work. The starter motor probably only turns just in case. Mazda claim 350mS start time.

Subaru's Start/Stop is also rated at 350ms start time. It can be a bit disconcerting at first, but not really noticeable after a little while.

mattwnz

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#1302778 12-May-2015 13:47

jonathan18: And you're completely off the idea of diesel? The 2.2 engine's highly regarded (already used in the CX5 and the 6), and my understanding the 3s with this engine are the fastest (0-100) of the range.

Unfortunately in NZ, having a diesel car is very expensive, as the laws are geared to commercial operators. So unless you are doing big kms, a petrol IMO is often a better option. But if you do want more performance, the SP25 offers very good performance and torque. Infact I read that the compression ratio or something like that, in these mazdas was approaching that of a diesel engine. Youtube videos I have seen, the 0-100 in the sp25 is around 7.5 seconds, and the 2 litre is around 9 seconds, so they aren't bad.

mattwnz

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#1302780 12-May-2015 13:48

Inphinity:
Bung:

For those wondering how it is done the engine is stopped in a position that allows the direct injection and ignition to do most of the work. The starter motor probably only turns just in case. Mazda claim 350mS start time.

Subaru's Start/Stop is also rated at 350ms start time. It can be a bit disconcerting at first, but not really noticeable after a little while.

I had read on some brands, the start/stop is like getting a kick in the back seat each time you set off. You do get a bit of a judder in teh mazda, but guess you get used to it, or you would get used to disabling it.

MikeAqua

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#1302809 12-May-2015 14:20

This car won't do many kms, I'm guessing 5,000km per year. I love small diesels, but unfortunately the transport agency/acc discourages them.

1) Road users charges are the same for anything up to 3.5T and
2) registration is ~$250/yr higher for small diesels than equivalent sized petrol powered cars.

This destroys any savings. Most taxi divers have petrol cars - that speaks volumes

jonathan18: And you're completely off the idea of diesel? The 2.2 engine's highly regarded (already used in the CX5 and the 6), and my understanding the 3s with this engine are the fastest (0-100) of the range.

Mike

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MikeAqua

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#1302810 12-May-2015 14:22

This car won't do many kms, I'm guessing 5,000km per year. I love small diesels, but unfortunately the transport agency/acc discourages them.

jonathan18: And you're completely off the idea of diesel? The 2.2 engine's highly regarded (already used in the CX5 and the 6), and my understanding the 3s with this engine are the fastest (0-100) of the range.

Mike

mattwnz

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#1302829 12-May-2015 15:10

MikeAqua: This car won't do many kms, I'm guessing 5,000km per year. I love small diesels, but unfortunately the transport agency/acc discourages them. 1) Road users charges are the same for anything up to 3.5T and
2) registration is ~$250/yr higher for small diesels than equivalent sized petrol powered cars.

This destroys any savings. Most taxi divers have petrol cars - that speaks volumes

jonathan18: And you're completely off the idea of diesel? The 2.2 engine's highly regarded (already used in the CX5 and the 6), and my understanding the 3s with this engine are the fastest (0-100) of the range.

It is quote interesting how different countries laws and regualtions affect the cars models sold in the market. In the UK for instance Diesels are quite popular, and petrol cars sold have very small engines. For instance the mazda 3 that is sold is only 1.5 litres, but in NZ that one isn't sold. The justification is that in the UK petrol is very very expensive due to the high taxes, so they wouldn't sell the thirstier models.

What is also interesting is that in the UK, Asian made vehicles appear to depreciate faster/more than European vehicles if you were reselling them at a later date. But the inverse occurs in NZ, European vehicles tend to depreciate more.

MikeAqua

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#1302846 12-May-2015 15:27

European cars cost more to service (cost x frequency) and to buy parts for. People price that in.

A chunk of the original price for and Audi, BMW Mercedes is a prestige premium. You can only buy a new Merc or Beamer from a dealer. 2nd hand there is more competition, and people are less willing to pay for prestige.

mattwnz:
What is also interesting is that in the UK, Asian made vehicles appear to depreciate faster/more than European vehicles if you were reselling them at a later date. But the inverse occurs in NZ, European vehicles tend to depreciate more.

Mike

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#1302861 12-May-2015 15:32

MikeAqua: European cars cost more to service (cost x frequency) and to buy parts for. People price that in.

A chunk of the original price for and Audi, BMW Mercedes is a prestige premium. You can only buy a new Merc or Beamer from a dealer. 2nd hand there is more competition, and people are less willing to pay for prestige.

mattwnz:
What is also interesting is that in the UK, Asian made vehicles appear to depreciate faster/more than European vehicles if you were reselling them at a later date. But the inverse occurs in NZ, European vehicles tend to depreciate more.

Plus we are probably paying a lot more in NZ for those European cars to begin with, vs over in the UK, where they are common and less prestige. While in the UK, Japanese cars seem to be quite a bit more than we get them for, but they are also not seen as being prestige vehicles over there.

Inphinity

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#1302893 12-May-2015 15:46

MikeAqua: 1) Road users charges are the same for anything up to 3.5T and
2) registration is ~$250/yr higher for small diesels than equivalent sized petrol powered cars.

While I agree with the point, the current registration difference is ~$140/year for the petrol vs diesel, using the Mazda 3 as an example ($280.55 vs $421.94). Of course, at 5000km/year you're also looking at close to $300 in RUC, at current rates. You won't make that back on fuel savings at the current prices, so the diesel is the more expensive option in terms of overall running costs (probably higher servicing costs, too).

jonathan18

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#1302927 12-May-2015 15:58

Inphinity:
MikeAqua: 1) Road users charges are the same for anything up to 3.5T and
2) registration is ~$250/yr higher for small diesels than equivalent sized petrol powered cars.

While I agree with the point, the current registration difference is ~$140/year for the petrol vs diesel, using the Mazda 3 as an example ($280.55 vs $421.94). Of course, at 5000km/year you're also looking at close to $300 in RUC, at current rates. You won't make that back on fuel savings at the current prices, so the diesel is the more expensive option in terms of overall running costs (probably higher servicing costs, too).

One advantage, though, of buying a Mazda diesel is that the cost of servicing is covered for the first three years of the car's life; I can't say that I'm looking forward to paying for this when my car is out of this three-year period (in about 14 months), though I doubt I'll still be going to the local Mazda dealer going by the 'bills' we're given with each service.

That said, I think I'd go with the petrol next time, and would definitely do so if I was only doing 5k kms a year... The govt. here is not one bit interested in sorting out the all-mightly f-up that are RUCs (which are set to go up again on 1 Jul - at least one can purchase ahead to minimise the increase).

wasabi2k

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#1302936 12-May-2015 16:14

mattwnz:
MikeAqua: European cars cost more to service (cost x frequency) and to buy parts for. People price that in.

A chunk of the original price for and Audi, BMW Mercedes is a prestige premium. You can only buy a new Merc or Beamer from a dealer. 2nd hand there is more competition, and people are less willing to pay for prestige.

mattwnz:
What is also interesting is that in the UK, Asian made vehicles appear to depreciate faster/more than European vehicles if you were reselling them at a later date. But the inverse occurs in NZ, European vehicles tend to depreciate more.

Plus we are probably paying a lot more in NZ for those European cars to begin with, vs over in the UK, where they are common and less prestige. While in the UK, Japanese cars seem to be quite a bit more than we get them for, but they are also not seen as being prestige vehicles over there.

Physical proximity would seem to be a possible cause.

mattwnz

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#1302947 12-May-2015 16:34

Inphinity:
MikeAqua: With Mazda 3 the base model comes with front back and side airbags, reversing camera and of course ABS and stability control.

The mid range adds blind spot warning, parking sensors and rear cross traffic warning. Mid range also comes with GPS, and I guess easy navigation adds some safety. I'm dubious about how much value radar cruise control, auto-braking and lane departure warning add. I can see auto-braking being a hazard in some circumstances.

It is quiet and has comfy, supportive seats.

Will think about the 2.5, but obviously it adds to price, weight and fuel. The 2.0 is very nicely balanced, will the 2.5 be as nicely balanced with the heavier engine.

The 2.5 is almost as fuel efficient as the 2.0 when driven nicely, while noticeably more capable when you need to put your foot down (although the 2.0 is not sluggish for what it is). In my opinion the SP25 handles slightly better than the 2.0 models, presumably a combination of the larger tyres and what I suspect is slightly stiffer suspension (or maybe it's juts the lower profile tyres). That said, on new prices, the top-spec SP25 is about $15k more than the entry-level GLX. The non-limited SP25 is only about a $6k premium and much better value imo, though it is as far as I'm aware only available in 6MT (which to me is a positive, to some it won't be). Kinda hoping they do another MPS model soon... ;)

I believe the SP25 non limited is available in both manual and auto in the hatch only, but there isn't a big price difference, and dealers seem to stick to autos for demos. ALso possible get better resale on an auto as more people seem to prefer them. Although personally I prefer manuals. The manual seems to not be as fuel efficient in the numbers as the auto. People should be able to get a good deal off the RRP. I wouldn't buy the GLX as it is missing a lot of features. Either the GSX or sp25 non limited seem to offer the best value. Even the dealer said that the limited doesn't really offer good value. The safety features that the limited offers over the non limited are largely just the features that kick in if you aren't paying attention or fall asleep, which is when you shouldn't be driving anyway. But they will likely be standard features in coming models..

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