Does the luxury EV use case still stack up cost wise?

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › Does the luxury EV use case still stack up cost wise?

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Obraik

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#3180177 10-Jan-2024 19:37

mudguard:

I'm also not currently a candidate. I do 40,000kms a year for work (I provide the work car). I'd love an EV if I had a normal job.

40,000kms a year for work seems like the ideal candidate for an EV!

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michaelmurfy

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#3180191 10-Jan-2024 20:02

mudguard:

I'm also not currently a candidate. I do 40,000kms a year for work (I provide the work car). I'd love an EV if I had a normal job.

That's ideal! If you've got at-home or at-office charging facilities then you could save a pretty penny here. Long trips in an electric vehicle are pretty nice. EV's have come a long way over the years.

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mudguard

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#3180193 10-Jan-2024 20:04

michaelmurfy:

mudguard:

I'm also not currently a candidate. I do 40,000kms a year for work (I provide the work car). I'd love an EV if I had a normal job.

That's ideal! If you've got at-home or at-office charging facilities then you could save a pretty penny here. Long trips in an electric vehicle are pretty nice. EV's have come a long way over the years.

I have neither of those. I'm only home weekends and would be draping an extension cord out the motel window each night 😂

Believe me I've thought about it. But I'd have to dedicate an hour a day to fast charging.

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#3180196 10-Jan-2024 20:07

2kadmin:

I would have spent more on an ICE vehicle, and if you can show me an ICE vehicle that can make the 0-100 dash in 3.7 seconds and doesn't depreciate like a weighted lead balloon, I'll buy one tomorrow.

in 2013 this car was $45000NZD new https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/cars/subaru/wrx/listing/4483110278

and i personally bought one of these in 2006 with 60,000kms for $24,000 https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/cars/subaru/wrx-sti/listing/4480353815

but err 0-100 was probably a hair under 5s not quite the 3.7, faster one has appreciated a lot more https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/cars/nissan/skyline/listing/4445658453

michaelmurfy

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#3180199 10-Jan-2024 20:15

mudguard:

I have neither of those. I'm only home weekends and would be draping an extension cord out the motel window each night 😂

Believe me I've thought about it. But I'd have to dedicate an hour a day to fast charging.

Ah bugger - yeah you're right. Burning liquid dinosaurs is your better option here.

muppet

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#3180203 10-Jan-2024 20:20

If you're going to buy a Tesla, just make sure you don't get one where the wheels fall off.

[I'll stick with my 2011 VW Golf thanks]

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#3180208 10-Jan-2024 20:44

muppet:

If you're going to buy a Tesla, just make sure you don't get one where the wheels fall off.

To be fair Toyota pioneered the technology of having wheels fall off: https://electrek.co/2022/06/23/toyota-recalls-bz4x-electric-cars-wheels-falling-off/

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morrisk

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#3180335 11-Jan-2024 08:04

weasel13:
morrisk:

This type of discussion has happened a number of times here on Geekzone over the last 5 or more years.

My view has always been the same - the change from ICE to EV is needed as one of the actions we must take to try to reduce emissions in the hope of slowing global warming.

Given the impact that global warming is already happening and the costs associated with these impacts, the costs/savings and benefits/disadvantages of EV versus ICE at an individual level are insignificant.

If you can afford to make the change from ICE to EV then do it.

The discussion here is the cost comparison, not your views on global warming.

The reason that these discussions continue to happen is that the cost comparison change over time. For example an EV in my price range didn't have the range required or I had to spend more and be lumbered with higher depreciation.

I've got a 2018 leaf 40kw purely from a cost saving benefit. Being only 5 years old it has already depreciated over 60% of its value but still has 89% battery health. I predict depreciation will slow rapidly and it will hold its value unlike the 30kw leafs.

I'm terms of getting it for the environment there is bugger all difference for the environment. EV do a lot more damage to the environment during production yet they are brain washing people into believing they are green. People should buy the car that works out the best for them whether it's financially or that they enjoy driving like my ute which means I can go where the leaf can't and have fun in the outdoors

My post specifically refers to cost.

The problem is that people are thinking only of the costs relating to car ownership.

The real costs that we are all facing are the real costs of climate change.

The only reason that EVs are available today and their costs being debated is because they are one of the ways that we can try to reduce CO2 emissions in the hope of slowing the warming of the earth that is in part due to ICE vehicles.

I won't respond to your assertion that that EVs do more damage to the environment during production as that has been discussed in depth in many forums and my analysis of this aspect does not agree with your conclusion.

alasta

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#3180341 11-Jan-2024 08:33

Or you could just keep your existing car and reduce your carbon footprint with more walking, public transport use and remote working. But of course that's not appealing because it doesn't involve buying a shiny new tech-laiden asset.

morrisk

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#3180357 11-Jan-2024 09:11

Agree entirely - the objective is to reduce emissions.

tdgeek

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#3180361 11-Jan-2024 09:13

Been watching Ade's Climate Change doco. Last ep was a Swedish business that runs a green energy company, the house has a lot of solar and the excess is turned into Hydrogen, so his basement that has the mini power plant also has a LOT of Hydrogen bottles that feeds the house at night and when solar isnt enough. He says a decade to get the setup cost to a figure that is viable to add to a standard home. He says Hydrogen is the way to go for power and transport.

Ok, not Luxury EV related but EV and climate change are related

2kadmin

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#3180397 11-Jan-2024 10:19

Batman:

2kadmin:

I would have spent more on an ICE vehicle, and if you can show me an ICE vehicle that can make the 0-100 dash in 3.7 seconds and doesn't depreciate like a weighted lead balloon, I'll buy one tomorrow.

in 2013 this car was $45000NZD new https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/cars/subaru/wrx/listing/4483110278

and i personally bought one of these in 2006 with 60,000kms for $24,000 https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/cars/subaru/wrx-sti/listing/4480353815

but err 0-100 was probably a hair under 5s not quite the 3.7, faster one has appreciated a lot more https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/cars/nissan/skyline/listing/4445658453

All awesome cars! A WRX was my boy racer crush for ages, awesome machines. I've always loved turbo cars, but somehow, I wound up with a 6.4L V8; I fell in love with the noise and what I thought was the instant acceleration. That was 120k in 2017, which turned to 75k in just over three years comfortable, fast and just didn't care. Being a geek, I wanted to check out the new technology and understand the pitfalls and, having felt the instant torque of an electric motor, it's just too addictive; in comparison, a foot down overtake, an electric motor is already pulling, while in an ICE car, the signal has just made it to the fuel pump, then the kick down wait, or for the purists, clutch down and change, then wait for the throttle to response.

I'm hopeful that the depreciation won't be so brutal on the performance model, but I've made my choice, and I'll live with the consequences. I hope most people who were thinking of swapping to EV have done so and gone for the RWD model that qualified for the UTE tax rebate, but who knows.

I think a few people have made some valid points, EVs aren't not for everyone. Cars, like driving itself, are emotive things, as they represent freedom and trigger a lot of passionate thoughts and thinking. I often say to people, that if someone wants to drive 1km/h faster than you, they are a 'lunatic', 1km/h slower, they are 'holding everyone up'.

If you aren't heading home each evening, doing monster Ks, towing two boats and caravan uphill in both directions, or basically doing anything that makes you reliant on paid-for public charging. The numbers, if that is what you are into, won't ever add up, unless you want them to.

johno1234

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#3180398 11-Jan-2024 10:21

tdgeek:

Been watching Ade's Climate Change doco. Last ep was a Swedish business that runs a green energy company, the house has a lot of solar and the excess is turned into Hydrogen, so his basement that has the mini power plant also has a LOT of Hydrogen bottles that feeds the house at night and when solar isnt enough. He says a decade to get the setup cost to a figure that is viable to add to a standard home. He says Hydrogen is the way to go for power and transport.

Ok, not Luxury EV related but EV and climate change are related

I can't see it being practical. Hydrogen is hard to store and transport and energy losses are suffered converting electricity and water into hydrogen and more losses compressing hydrogen into storage. Why bother with converting solar to electricity to hydrogen when you can just stop at electricity which is relatively easy to store and distribute?

The cost of his hydrogen plant and storage would be immense.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2339665-heating-homes-with-hydrogen-is-bad-for-both-your-wallet-and-the-planet/#:~:text=Overall%2C%20they%20show%20that%20hydrogen,using%20natural%20gas%20or%20coal.

tdgeek

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#3180425 11-Jan-2024 11:31

johno1234:

I can't see it being practical. Hydrogen is hard to store and transport and energy losses are suffered converting electricity and water into hydrogen and more losses compressing hydrogen into storage. Why bother with converting solar to electricity to hydrogen when you can just stop at electricity which is relatively easy to store and distribute?

The cost of his hydrogen plant and storage would be immense.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2339665-heating-homes-with-hydrogen-is-bad-for-both-your-wallet-and-the-planet/#:~:text=Overall%2C%20they%20show%20that%20hydrogen,using%20natural%20gas%20or%20coal.

Short clip of the actual house, was a lot more info on the docs though. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koiM0Y8VjOw

Inefficient to make, yes, but the Sun made it for free once he installed his electrolysis machine

He stores it in bottles in his basement

He stated 10 years to be economically achievable in a standard house.

Every energy type has downsides, so you place them where the upsides exist and downsides are somewhat mitigated.

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