EV (electric vehicle) News & Discussion

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#3075816 13-May-2023 15:37

lmnop:
alasta:

So it sounds like, at least at this stage, electric vehicles aren't really that practical if you can't charge at home?

Depends. Are you within eScooter range of a Warehouse with free 25kW chargers outside? Is your home/work close to some 50kW+ chargers?

Lol, it wouldn't end well if I were to attempt to use an eScooter!

The local Pak N Save has a 50kw charger. If I were to plug into that for 20 minutes while I'm doing my shopping then I guess that would give me 100km of range which would be plenty to get me through the week.

My bigger concern is longer trips. I would want to charge to 100% before driving long distance, and it sounds like that might be impractical with a public charger.

PolicyGuy

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#3075884 13-May-2023 18:10

robjg63:

Batman:

most likely insufficient orders, or maybe they don't want to spend money on a gigapress for the RHD

Could mean that they are pivoting production capacity to better selling models?

I expect the model 2 or whatever it will be called,the revamped model 3 and model Y are maybe more important to them.

There have been statements that they want to increase production/sales and that they want to make EV's more affordable.

I'd guess that they can sell more LHD models than they can make, so it's easier & cheaper to simply ignore the RHD market at least for the moment, and just turn out the LHD models as fast as they can make them.

As @robjg63 says, the Model 2 / 'small' car is going to be far more important in the big RHD markets - Japan & UK, NZ it a statistical blip only - than the bigger Teslas. The existing Tesla models count as medium to large cars in those markets and have a more limited appeal than a smaller car would

SaltyNZ

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#3076058 14-May-2023 13:26

Dingbatt:

What the RHD move may portend for the Cybertruk is a different matter.

With any luck they'll ditch it entirely and put the designers back to work on cars that aren't ****ing stupid.

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Dingbatt

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#3076089 14-May-2023 15:28

SaltyNZ:

Dingbatt:

What the RHD move may portend for the Cybertruk is a different matter.

With any luck they'll ditch it entirely and put the designers back to work on cars that aren't ****ing stupid.

Cars, designers or both?😁

(Not a Cybertruk fan, by the way)

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

Technofreak

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#3076536 15-May-2023 22:02

Interesting video from John Cadogen.

https://youtu.be/djuy1KFOTLY

Figures are based on Aussie electric power generation CO2 emissions, New Zealand figures will be more favourable to EV use. Still thought provoking when comparing a Ranger Wildtrack with an Ionic 5.

Main points.

An EV like the Ionic will need to travel 75,000 km before it's CO2 emissions are less than the Wildtrack.
If the Wildtrack owner used the price difference to install solar panels on their house, she/he will produce way less CO2 than the Ionic 5 owner.
The big gains in reducing CO2 emissions are not in personal transportation. There are much bigger gains in home/domestic CO2 emissions.

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WyleECoyoteNZ

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#3076540 15-May-2023 22:36

Technofreak:

Interesting video from John Cadogen.

https://youtu.be/djuy1KFOTLY

Figures are based on Aussie electric power generation CO2 emissions, New Zealand figures will be more favourable to EV use. Still thought provoking when comparing a Ranger Wildtrack with an Ionic 5.

Main points.

An EV like the Ionic will need to travel 75,000 km before it's CO2 emissions are less than the Wildtrack.
If the Wildtrack owner used the price difference to install solar panels on their house, she/he will produce way less CO2 than the Ionic 5 owner.
The big gains in reducing CO2 emissions are not in personal transportation. There are much bigger gains in home/domestic CO2 emissions.

If I recall rightly, Volvo themselves did something very similar between the XC40 & XC40 Recharge

itxtme

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#3076544 15-May-2023 22:56

Problem with his figure he has totalled the CO2 of the vehicle burning the fuel, but not the CO2 produced in making and transporting the fuel. Its around 30% more emissions that come out of the vehicle.

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Technofreak

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#3076545 15-May-2023 23:10

itxtme:

Problem with his figure he has totalled the CO2 of the vehicle burning the fuel, but not the CO2 produced in making and transporting the fuel. Its around 30% more emissions that come out of the vehicle.

Yep, sure it depends on what base line you start with. Just like it depends on how your electricity is generated, whether it be hydro, gas, coal, nuclear etc. You could even start talking about the emissions generated in transporting the coal that is burnt to make the electricity in his example.

His main points being there are better ways to spend your money to reduce CO2 emissions than buying an EV. His other point being that EV are not zero emission like some people like to think they are.

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HarmLessSolutions

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#3076742 16-May-2023 10:56

Having watched Cadogan's video, a presenter I normally avoid like the plague, the main takeaways are that Australia really needs to sort its electricity generation sector off of coal, and to get an accurate comparison in the way he's attempting he really needs to take responsibility for the emissions load of the fossil fuel used before it gets in the ute's tank in the same way he's taking the EV's battery's manufacturing process. Biased? No more than usual for Cadogan. Click-bait denial followed by promotion of some shiney new torch. Disingenuous!

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GV27

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#3076745 16-May-2023 11:05

Technofreak:

His main points being there are better ways to spend your money to reduce CO2 emissions than buying an EV. His other point being that EV are not zero emission like some people like to think they are.

They absolutely are as functionally zero-emission as anything that results from heavy manufacturing can be.

If that's the bar then nothing is getting over it, ever.

itxtme

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#3076922 16-May-2023 20:38

Technofreak:

Yep, sure it depends on what base line you start with. Just like it depends on how your electricity is generated, whether it be hydro, gas, coal, nuclear etc. You could even start talking about the emissions generated in transporting the coal that is burnt to make the electricity in his example.

His main points being there are better ways to spend your money to reduce CO2 emissions than buying an EV. His other point being that EV are not zero emission like some people like to think they are.

He is comparing apples with pineapples. He is directly comparing how in Australia the power is made (fuel for the EV), but not the fuel for the ICE only taking the emissions from burning it. Its bananas [to throw in another fruit].

A study has looked at this and suggest adding 30% to the emissions - thats probably a low ball estimate for Australia too.

His point about panels for reducing CO2 may be true, but his time to recovery for an EV is complete BS, period. And if you need a car and can get an EV you will make an impact on reducing greenhouse gasses and not in 7.5 years.

GV27

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#3077008 17-May-2023 06:20

There's also the strong, strong argument that many new cars and all used cars are not 'made to order' when you consider buying them - they exist. Maybe some supercars and high end stuff, sure. But a pre-owned Nissan Leaf functionally has zero emissions to factor into production because someone already built it.

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#3077074 17-May-2023 10:10

GV27:

There's also the strong, strong argument that many new cars and all used cars are not 'made to order' when you consider buying them - they exist. Maybe some supercars and high end stuff, sure. But a pre-owned Nissan Leaf functionally has zero emissions to factor into production because someone already built it.

I'm not a fan of that line of argument.

Car manufacturers build cars for people to buy, and set project future production around demand projections, which current sales data feeds into. Buying an inventory car means one less car in stock, providing an incentive for the manufacturer to build more of them. In the event people stop buying a particular model of car (or deep discounting is needed to move stock), manufacturers are going to wind back / stop production of it pretty fast. An example this are the RWD commodore / Falcon, or the 4.0L v6 petrol hilux. People wern't buying enough of them, so production stopped (for the falcon / commodore), and the v6 petrol hilux hasn't been offered in NZ for many years.

Same line of logic as the "Plane is going anyway, so by buying a ticket only adds the tiny amount of weight related emissions" - Sure, but your demand (and money) is used to select the scale of the operation in the future.

On used cars it is a little murkier, but the price signals from the used market do flow through to the New Market. Stuff like the Suzuki Jimny, Rav4 Hybrid, Tesla Model Y etc, depreciate so little that buyers who go looking for a somewhat modern used car may well decide that there is not good value in the used market and buy a new one instead.

And new car buyers will be able to project a lower total cost of ownership on something that depreciates slow (like Landcruiser 300), vs something that depreciates fast like a similar value euro luxury sedan.

Dingbatt

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#3077223 17-May-2023 15:21

Just received an email from Tesla NZ informing me about a price drop and likely arrival in June “before the rebate decrease”.

In the linked list were a few Ys but they were mainly 3s, including some LRs (AWD) which I didn’t think were available here anymore.* The thing is some of the Performance 3s were only a couple thousand more than the LRs. So why wouldn’t you?

I wonder how many other sales outfits will be spruiking the “rebate decrease” as the sales pitch.

* Only the RWDs qualify for any rebate.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

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#3077251 17-May-2023 17:58

I stumbled across the fact there is a Cupra Born on display in Westfields Newmarket. The salesman said it was one of two in NZ on loan from Australia. The other was down the road at their dealership. Did I want to take it for a test drive? Yes, I did. The report is in the EV test drive thread.

Next week it is being revealed to the press, so I’m looking forward to the Kiwi reviews.

Deliveries from September. It’s <$80K.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

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