EVs - Test Drives and Impressions of NZ Available Models

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#3066130 20-Apr-2023 16:56

networkn:

I also don't understand the lack of EV Sports Wagons. I have no interest in a rolly top-heavy SUV, most of them have less practical capacity than a decent wagon as well. Audi and BMW should have had full electric A/S4 and 3 Series by this year, I don't understand the decision not to get them to market.

Sports Wagons are a niche segment, even in ICE cars. Which is a pity as they are far more suitable for most people than the SUV they eventually buy, but the people know what they want apparently. Also, EV SUVs aren't that top heavy. They are heavy but most of the mass is down low.

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#3066139 20-Apr-2023 17:18

Senecio:

networkn:

I also don't understand the lack of EV Sports Wagons. I have no interest in a rolly top-heavy SUV, most of them have less practical capacity than a decent wagon as well. Audi and BMW should have had full electric A/S4 and 3 Series by this year, I don't understand the decision not to get them to market.

Sports Wagons are a niche segment, even in ICE cars. Which is a pity as they are far more suitable for most people than the SUV they eventually buy, but the people know what they want apparently. Also, EV SUVs are that top heavy. They are heavy but most of the mass is down low.

it's not the weight that kills EVs it's the tall profile that makes it not aero (CdxSA) that kills the range esp at speed

so EV wagons make perfect sense. but the buyers don't know that.

For the manufacturer the battery takes up space so they need the thing taller to for the people's heads workout squatting

Maybe one day...

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#3066177 20-Apr-2023 18:38

Batman:

i'd like to throw in Model 3 Performance based on what others have told me, but because I haven't found a way to test one yet I can't throw it in, but I'm guessing you haven't tried that either.

but in terms of EVs being soulless, i don't think you'll ever find one with a soul, not until they create one that feels like a NA V8/V10/V12 with either manual transmission or DCT. my mate has a Taycan, (and i've seen a couple of GT RS in Dunedin!) i can't say it has a soul either. prefer a 911 Turbo or even a 718 S, and if I were in the US, a C8 E Ray or a Shelby GT 500.

I have driven the M3 Performance. Other than being extraordinarily quick 0-60, it didn't feel much better than the M3 for handling.

The interior of Telsas is sterile and unwelcoming in my opinion and they lack basic features like a HUD. I *almost* bought the Model S, but I am pretty glad I didn't. On paper they sort of make sense, but for me, they aren't a car I'd love.

Dingbatt

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#3066189 20-Apr-2023 19:22

Lots of commentary but not many test drives. The reason I started this thread was for people to post their actual test drive experiences not general EV banter, in the hope it might assist GZers with decisions.

Still to come,

I finally got round to test driving a Tesla Model Y. I wanted to compare it to the Mach-E and Enyaq I have driven recently.

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#3067606 24-Apr-2023 12:24

As mentioned above, I finally got round to test driving the

Tesla Model Y RWD

For the TL:DR crowd

Essentially the Model Y is a Model 3 stretched in the vertical axis and has a hatchback rather than a boot. Uglier than the 3 (IMO) but more practical.

Car test driven was white RWD on 19" Gemini wheels with the optional white interior upgrade (+$1700). Order price as at 24 April 23 was $74687 (incl white interior). Note there is an additional charge for other paint colours varying from $1700 to $2800 (for red*).

The MY shares numerous components with the M3. That commonality keeps the manufacturing costs for both down.

The interior is best described as 'spartan' with just a landscape mode central display (15") that is used for the setting and control of most functions. It is a bit of a culture shock when first operating the car, but does become intuitive after a while. Particularly when used in combination with the voice control. There are two stalks on the steering column. The left to operate indicators, hi/lo beam and windscreen washer/wipers. The right for motion control (ie D,R,N and P) and to engage/disengage the "Autopilot" (essentially Lane Keeping and Adaptive Cruise Control). Edit: Plus two scroll wheels on the steering wheel for (at the time of writing) media control (left) and autopilot and voice control (right).

There is plenty of storage in the centre console as it is unencumbered by any controls. But expect to purchase aftermarket storage dividers to make more practical use of the space. Much like Apple products, there are heaps of aftermarket accessories available. Once again the manufacturing cost is kept down by not installing these in the factory. The glovebox is adequate, and to be honest, I've only opened the one in my M3 twice in a year. Opening either through the touchscreen or by voice.

The seating position is more SUV-like than the M3. The driving position feels more commanding. The seats are the same as the M3 (electric with heaters and lumbar support for the driver), but are on plinths that raise their height off the floor so in the front your legs aren't stretched out in front of you so much, and in the back the passenger's feet hang down more, in a more comfortable seating position. There is also more headroom, both front and back from the Y's elevated roofline. There is one large fixed panoramic sunroof. You may want to look at an aftermarket sunshade for summer.

The hatch is where the MY excels. A powered tailgate and large flat load area, as well as a decent sized underfloor storage makes this as good as any in class (imo). The vehicle does not come with either a Type 2 portable charger or a cargo cover. Both can be purchased separately. There is also a decent sized "frunk", larger than the M3 and probably similar in size to the Mach-E. There is no powered lift on the frunk (aftermarket available), but at least its release is on the touchscreen (or app) and you don't have to dive for an old school manual hood release, like most other EVs I have tried.

It is rated to tow up to 1500kg (braked). The official towbar is still "coming" according to the salesperson. It was supposedly due in the first quarter of 2023. There is no spare wheel, and no puncture repair/ tire inflator provided. Once again, aftermarket purchase is required. Tesla offer roadside assistance for a flat tire, anywhere in NZ. Although I was told "It may take a while to get to you, if you aren't close to a Tesla Service Centre". The centres are currently only Auckland Wellington and Christchurch.

So the drive itself.

The ride is firm, although not noticeably more than the M3 or the Mach-E. Slightly more road noise than the M-E but less wind noise at motorway speeds. I quite liked the slightly elevated driving position and visibility was good, except for RH shoulder check (quite a thick B pillar) and the hopelessly small rear window. As with the M3, the side mirrors are quite small and lack adjustment to fully cover blindspots. The side and rear cameras are good and are selectable to display while driving. This will probably be necessary in busy city motorway traffic, particularly the rear. Anecdotally, I have been told the Model Y was originally designed to not have a rear window, but they couldn't get it past the regulators.

Only having the centre display for all information is the thing I like least about the Model 3/Y. I found with the elevated ride height in the Y, it was easy to exceed to speed limit and having to look across at the readout in the centre display distracting. Readers of the Model 3 thread will know I have fitted an aftermarket driver's display to my car and would do the same in a MY. This is, of course, an individual thing and many Tesla 3/Y drivers have no problem. It is something that had me thinking long and hard before ordering.

The voice control works well, as long as you use the right phrase.

I find the ventilation barely adequate. It works much better in recirc than it does on fresh (probably an indictment of American air quality) and the fan needs to be set to a noisy level to achieve adequate flow. Rear seat ventilation, via the centre console vents, is good though. The front seat airflow in the 3/Y is the least satisfactory of any of the EVs I have tried. It does have a heatpump as standard though. In (some) other EVs this is an optional extra or only available on higher trim grades.

On my normal test drive route, which includes urban, extra-urban and motorway driving I achieved a surprising 130Wh/km. It was a mild day and that was without aircon being used. So for the reported 58kWh LiFePO battery that equates to 446km, which is very close to the WLTP range of 450km. I would be more comfortable saying a range of 400km+ is achievable. And of course because of the battery chemistry, it can be charged to 100% everyday.

In summary, as long as you can live with the spartan interior and no driver's display then the Model Y is worth considering as a family EV. It is more practical to use than the Model 3 (although not as pleasing to the eye - imo) and will be able to tow a reasonable size trailer. Just be prepared to spend some money aftermarket to get some things that come standard from other manufacturers. It is not a small car though and some urban dwellers my find it a little challenging.

I know there are Model Y owners on GZ. Please feel free to comment if you think I've got anything glaringly wrong. Considering it was a 1 hour 50km test drive, I'm sure there will be things longer term ownership will bring to light.

*I have a red Model 3. I don't believe the additional cost (+$3300 when I ordered) is warranted as paint quality isn't great (soft and flat). It lacks the depth you see in vehicles from other manufacturers. The lights in the showroom tend to flatter the paint job, particularly if the vehicle has been professionally polished (and I noticed the same with blue (+$1700)). Given my time again, I would have ordered the white and put the savings towards getting the vehicle wrapped.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

billgates

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#3067614 24-Apr-2023 13:09

Nice review @Dingbatt

What did you think of the driving comfort for your 50KM trip as you mentioned that ride is firm.

What surprises me the most is Tesla is the only company that is not doing 360 degrees camera which is a must whether you have young kids or not. Did you try the auto pilot as well as that seems to be a hit and miss.

Do whatever you want to do man.

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#3067630 24-Apr-2023 13:50

The left to operate indicators, hi/lo beam and windscreen washer/wipers. The right for motion control (ie D,R,N and P) and to engage/disengage the "Autopilot"

This sounds weird for NZ. I might be wary of lending to casual drivers.

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gzt

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#3067632 24-Apr-2023 13:55

I have a red Model 3. I don't believe the additional cost (+$3300 when I ordered) is warranted as paint quality isn't great (soft and flat). It lacks the depth you see in vehicles from other manufacturers. The lights in the showroom tend to flatter the paint job, particularly if the vehicle has been professionally polished

Interesting. Seeing cars on the street it was my impression the blue was deepest. Maybe the few I've been close to had additional treatments. A random red I saw had black doorhandles. Looked great. Must have been aftermarket.

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#3067645 24-Apr-2023 14:34

@billgates

The ride was no worse than my Model 3 or the Mach-E or Enyaq I have driven recently. Pretty much all the EVs I have tested I would consider to have a ‘firm’ ride. They tend to crash through bumps rather than smooth them out. Possibly because of the increased mass due to the battery. We had a roadie around the bottom of the North Island recently and I would have preferred to be in my sister’s GLE Mercedes or even my old Camry Hybrid for ride comfort because of the state of NZ roads. The M3 was more fun to drive though.

As for the autopilot, my experience of basic autopilot in the M3 is that it is the best of any I have driven. I tried it in the MY and it performed similarly. That is basic AP only, not enhanced AP or FSD, neither of which I believe are worth the money Tesla asks for the upgrade.

They still don’t have “phantom braking” fully figured out. The MY did one passing under a motorway over ridge, which was overridden by pushing the accelerator. The Tesla is not the only vehicle I have driven recently where the automated safety systems have been a little “overzealous”.

@gzt

The control stalk layout, with indicators, lights and washers on the left is the same for most cars whose primary market is LHD, isn’t it?

Likewise, the Mercedes GLE has its “gear” selector on the right stalk. On the M3/Y, you push the stalk up for reverse, down for forward and push the button on the end for park. Once underway, pull down once to engage adaptive cruise control (Tesla call it “Traffic Aware Cruise”) and twice for lane keeping.

The right scroll wheel allows you to adjust following distance and target speed.

The black trim, such as door handles and window trims has been standard on Model 3/Y for a few years now. Because so many customers were getting “chrome deletes” done, Tesla changed to black. I’m sure it had nothing to do with it being cheaper😏. One thing I have noted on my M3 is that the flush door handles can be hard to locate in poor light. The Model Y will be the same. I’m sure it’s even worse on the blue or black ones in particular.

As for the red. It just looks flat when compared to the metallic red on our Ford Focus parked beside it. For the extra dosh I would have expected it to be like the Mazda red.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

shk292

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#3067657 24-Apr-2023 15:24

Dingbatt:

The control stalk layout, with indicators, lights and washers on the left is the same for most cars whose primary market is LHD, isn’t it?

I've never encountered a car with wash/wipe and indicators on the same stalk (or different stalks on the same side). In my experience, Euro cars have turn and lights on the left, and wash/wipe on the right; Jap/Korean have vice versa.

We've previously had one of each in our household, which means your windscreen gets more cleaning than expected. It must be quite difficult to switch between the "normal" system and Tesla's, with everything on the same side.

I'm loving the test drive reports, so good to have an overview of what's out there. So far I've driven an EV6 (liked it a lot), BYD Atto 3 (like it except for the seats which aren't compatible with my head shape and posture) and Kia Niro (prev model - nice enough but a little unexciting). Looking forward to reading about the Solterra when it arrives

Dingbatt

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#3067661 24-Apr-2023 15:42

shk292:

Dingbatt:

The control stalk layout, with indicators, lights and washers on the left is the same for most cars whose primary market is LHD, isn’t it?

I've never encountered a car with wash/wipe and indicators on the same stalk (or different stalks on the same side). In my experience, Euro cars have turn and lights on the left, and wash/wipe on the right; Jap/Korean have vice versa.

Oh yes, I misunderstood what was being asked.

The left stalk does indeed do multiple functions. Up/down for indicators, in/out for hi/low beam or headlight flash, and pushing the button on the end activates a wiper sweep. Push and hold the button for washer as well. The washers are mounted on the wipers themselves.

Other light and wiper functions are accessed through the touchscreen (or by voice). Of note, when you operate the basic controls on the steering wheel, the more advanced settings pop up on the touchscreen.

I find a steering wheel festooned with buttons a little cluttered now. You don’t have to take your eyes off the road when there are only two stalks and two scroll wheels to access.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

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#3067672 24-Apr-2023 16:34

Yep, that’s a good and fair review of the Y, thanks Dingbatt - pretty much reflects my own thoughts after eight months of ownership. A few comments:

- Paint: agree, the quality of the blue isn’t spectacular; I thought the paint of my previous car (a Mazda, also blue) was better. This is also quite susceptible to marks when cleaning, despite only using microfibre cloths.
- Visibility: TBH, one gets used to the poor view out the back fairly quickly, and it’s not a huge issue. If I’m worried I’ll switch on the rear camera.
- Ride: TBH, this is probably my biggest issue, with the firmness getting somewhat irritating, particularly around town. That said, the handling is less fidgety than the Mazda6 was (that had really low profile 19s”) so is much more predictable on the road.
- Acceleration: not something I saw you comment on specifically, but it’s much slower out of the blocks than the RWD M3. It’s fine but nothing to write home about (and the BMW dealer who lives around the corner was certainly able to leave me in the dust at the lights in his i7!). Excellent acceleration from say 50 up and also between that critical 80 and 120, so overtaking is a breeze.
- Voice control: absolute crap for me; the only way of improving its accuracy to a level approaching acceptable is to speak in an American accent!
- Range: Decently economical for a car weighing not far off 2 tonnes; that said I’m yet to see 400km off a full charge - I think this reflects my primary use being in a city which seems deliberately set up for uneconomic driving (eg short blocks, lots of roundabouts) - I had thought an EV would significantly negate this compared to an ICE, but not as much as I hoped.
- Aircon: agree front cooling can be an issue - especially if you install an aftermarket speedo unit that blocks part of the air vent, like I have! I’m debating removing it next summer. Another annoyance is not being able to turn off the front passenger aircon off if someone’s in the seat. My wife gets really dry eyes, even if the air is pointing as directly up as possible - we keep a strip of rubber in the glovebox to block the vent for her when needed!
- Transition from D to R: really don’t think much of the way Teslas let the driver switch between drive and reverse while still moving (up to 5km/h I think) - not so much an issue now, but while getting used to indicators on the other side I’ve had some hairy moments, as have others driving the car.
- Frunk: I find it much more useful than others seem to, as I’ve read many claiming they basically never use it. One great use - making sure the car never smells of takeaways! I reverse into the garage, so getting stuff out of the frunk is heaps easier than the boot.
- Storage: as a family of four that does not travel light when on holiday, the Y has proved to be fantastic. We’ve moved from holidaying/road tripping in a Mazda6 wagon with roof box to the Y with no box and have had no problems fitting all our crap. Definitely an excellent car for families, and we made the right decision to hold off for the Y (and nothing really else since would have been this good - the Enyak is stupidly priced and underpowered; the Mach-E may have been ok but I think I’d have found the entry level one fairly sparse compared to the Y.)
- Boot: The lack of a cargo cover initially worried me, and did try a couple of times to get one from AE but the orders were cancelled; in the end I’ve not bothered getting one, but I have built a barrier that’s put behind the back seats to wall the boot off from the cabin when we have it well-loaded, following advice here on GZ (this was the end result).

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#3067674 24-Apr-2023 16:46

dingbat: Pretty much all the EVs I have tested I would consider to have a ‘firm’ ride. They tend to crash through bumps rather than smooth them out. Possibly because of the increased mass due to the battery. We had a roadie around the bottom of the North Island recently and I would have preferred to be in my sister’s GLE Mercedes or even my old Camry Hybrid for ride comfort because of the state of NZ roads.

This seems like something tire and rim choice, or aftermarket shocks after warranty might help along for Tesla?

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#3067680 24-Apr-2023 17:00

@jonathan18 I did not know about the passenger aircon annoyance in Tesla's. I don't see why Tesla cannot resolve this with a firmware update to allow for the passenger side aircon to be turned OFF if a passenger is sitting. They let you turn it OFF from the looks of it if no passenger is sitting.

What is your current consumption in the Y for city commute?

Do whatever you want to do man.

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#3067681 24-Apr-2023 17:11

The other thing I didn’t comment on was the audio system in the Model Y. It is noticeably better than that in the Model 3 (as all speakers are activated) and I wish Tesla offered a service centre upgrade option for the 3. The sound was slightly better than the Mach-E RWD but inferior to the AWD and GT models of that car (to my old ears anyway).

Both the i4 and EQC had great audio, but then I would expect it in cars in that price bracket.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

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